The RCAF's Next Generation Fighter (CF-188 Replacement)

[DBNSG]

Members of the Canadian Armed Forces are generally not permitted to wear their uniforms when not on duty, except during specific occasions such as military functions, events, or ceremonies approved by their commanding officer. Retired members may wear their uniforms at appropriate military functions, reflecting their rank and service.


Perhaps make some changes to this policy. How many regular force members keep their uniforms on the base or wear civvies so as not to alarm the public. There are 1500 regular forces at CFB Toronto. A few uniforms on the transit system might create some awareness. Going back to Oakville for a minute, the reserve had their vehicles parked on Navy Street just off the main drag: people saw them every time they went downtown. Having a solid core heading up the Santa Claus parades directly behind the band certainly helped as well. The Military Bands are great PR. Unfortunately our forces are relatively few in number in comparison to our population and it would be impossible to attend all of them or even a significant minority of them. I honestly think that re-vitilizing the local militia concept in a meaningful way is the most practical and useful way to foster awareness.

How many H.S. groups are encouraged to tour our facilities/museums and are they inviting enough inside to make it worthwhile.

The Halifax area does not have that problem. Uniforms everywhere and then the gray stuff under the Bridge and flying around.
I have entertained business associates from Ontario and they have been a little freaked out at a Cyclone flying along juat above Halifax harbour. Freaked out in a "Fuck that was cool " way.

 

[Halifax Tar]

The Halifax area does not have that problem. Uniforms everywhere and then the gray stuff under the Bridge and flying around.
I have entertained business associates from Ontario and they have been a little freaked out at a Cyclone flying along juat above Halifax harbour. Freaked out in a "Fuck that was cool " way.

The Maritimes, traditionally, is a leader in providing members for the CAF. There is a reason the term NS Armed Forces is more than just a pejorative.

 

[Rainbow1910]

My preferred solution:

1) Cut back F-35. 60-70. Painful. But guess we gotta give the public something.

2) Increase the number of FLIT.

3) Commit early to GCAP. At least 30 frames.

4) Launch a CCA program.

Dual fleet right now is only half the problem with the Gripen. We plow $10 billion into that piece of shit and we will end up delaying CCAs and GCAP. Instead of a 5th/6th Gen fleet with CCAs in 2050. We'll have a 4th/5th Gen fleet and very little autonomous capability. We'll spend billions to reach 2050 with 2030 capabilities. How do people not see what an insane waste of money that is?

There's also all the other trade-offs. We need that Stand off Jammer/SIGINT fleet. We need more P-8s. We need more Globaleyes. We need more C-17s if the line reopens. We will either need more MQ-9s or another large drone type. Or we can give up all of that and get the Gripen. JFC.

My biggest concern with cutting the F-35 buy in favour of GCAP is that we are trading a known quantity for an unknown quantity. GCAP is a multi-national program ran by nations with capable aviation industries, but limited experience in the construction and design of modern stealth aircraft. They have had funding issues in the past and are up against an incredibly aggressive 2035 service entry date, primarily due to Japan requiring this to replace existing aircraft. It seems fairly likely that this date will get pushed back and even once in service operation is achieved, the amount of customers who will require their airframes first are going to push Canada to the back of the line.

Cutting the F-35 fleet in the short term for the potential of more fighters of another type in the medium-long term does not sit well with me, when said second program could see additional delays and we may need those fighters in the meantime. What happens in another 5-10 years if all of this effort and spending for the CAF falls to the wayside in the Govt and publics eye? You could very easily see your "interim" plan becoming your primary plan. If that first option is cut back, it might be all you are left with. Only 60-70 fighters would be rough for the RCAF in a more dangerous world going forward.

 

[ytz]

If we don't trade Panthers for Tempest, we'll end up trading them for Gripens. Pick your poison.

The good news here is that as long the line is running, we can top up. And hopefully, the worst of the current politics will be behind us then.

 

[daftandbarmy]

If we don't trade Panthers for Tempest, we'll end up trading them for Gripens. Pick your poison.

The good news here is that as long the line is running, we can top up. And hopefully, the worst of the current politics will be behind us then.

 

[lenaitch]

I visited North Bay on my drive across Canada in the summer of 2022 and stopped in at the base museum. Not sure if your daughter was working there at the time but the lovely young lady was very welcoming and I noticed she made sure to have a little interaction with each of the visitors(I dorked out when I got to sit in the T33 cockpit).
I wonder if the 3 storey underground bunker will ever need to be reactivated.

That would have been her. Up until last year, the place had a staff of one (now it has two).

It seems nobody has clue about 'the hole'.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

If we don't trade Panthers for Tempest, we'll end up trading them for Gripens. Pick your poison.

The good news here is that as long the line is running, we can top up. And hopefully, the worst of the current politics will be behind us then.

The Canadian solution is buy just enough F-35's for now to get training done and barely meet our commitments, while running a commission to study what path we should take going forward. That allows us to pivot if there is friendlier administration down south or the Europeans seem to be getting their poop together on a real airplane.
This also allows us to maintain existing F35 contracts, with the possibility of getting some European contracts as well.