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All Things First Nations - CF help, protests, solutions, residential schools, etc. (merged)

Question:

Are we going to see an insurgency here?

According to insurgency doctrine (from the 90s) we are seeing a rise in civil disobedience with traffic blockades etc.

The next phase is actively attacking police stations etc to show that the government is weak and cannot protect the public.

Are we there yet?

Edited - I am deeply disappointed in the Idle No More Movement. I thought they might seek gainful employment, alas this is not happening. :facepalm:
 
recceguy said:
Now we're getting to the crux, and more info backing up E Levant's Idle\Occupy link.

http://www.genuinewitty.com/2013/01/03/idlenomore-the-soros-anarchists-behind-the-scene-at-the-sarnia-rail-blockade/

If this were a movie, the Link Diagram at the bottom of this article would be a targetting list that one would send to Jason Statham as "The Mechanic".    >:D
 
Jim Seggie said:
Question:

Are we going to see an insurgency here?

According to insurgency doctrine (from the 90s) we are seeing a rise in civil disobedience with traffic blockades etc.

The next phase is actively attacking police stations etc to show that the government is weak and cannot protect the public.

Are we there yet?

I don't know if the government has the political will to really do anything aggressive against the protesters. We seen it many times with road blocks and the like, usually started by the Mohawks. If the roadblocks continue will the government do something? It will be interesting to see.
 
I do not read SUN media articles often, but this one does publicize more information than most MSM reagrding the Chief's diet.

'Idle No More' protests sparked by chief's 'diet.' It's not a hunger strike
By Lorne Gunter ,QMI Agency
First posted: Wednesday, January 02, 2013 07:37 PM MST | Updated: Thursday, January 03, 2013 10:39 AM MST

During one of his famous hunger strikes for farm workers’ rights in the 1960s and 1970s, activist Cesar Chavez had to fight off a supporter who tried to force feed him orange juice. Despite his weakened condition, Chavez was able to knock the juice glass out of his supporter’s hand and angrily insist that even the consumption of juice would violate the spirit of his fast.

Contrast that with Attawapiskat Chief Theresa Spence. The Northern Ontario chief is claiming to be on a hunger strike until Prime Minister Stephen Harper agrees to meet with her to discuss Ottawa’s treaty obligations. But Spence is consuming broth “several times a day,” according to reports, plus several cups of tea and water.

That’s not a hunger strike, it’s a diet. Good for you, Chief Spence. You’ve joined the millions of Canadians who’ve pledged to drop a few pounds this New Year’s. A noble goal, to be sure, but hardly a great spiritual or political achievement.

If Spence’s claim to be on a hunger strike weren’t ridiculous enough, it was revealed Wednesday that she doesn’t want just any meeting with Prime Minister Harper. “This meeting has to be not just one day, it has to be at least a week or two weeks,” she insisted.

That’s delusional.

Aboriginal Affairs Minister John Duncan has offered to meet with Spence. She has refused, insisting instead that she will only meet with the PM. And she won’t just take any meeting. She wants a fortnight.

You can bet Spence herself wouldn’t agree to meet for as long a week or two with any disgruntled resident of the northern reserve she so badly mismanages. If one of her own residents began fasting to back up his demands for a new house, for instance, you can bet Spence would refuse to see him for more than an hour or two. And she is the leader of a community of 1,800 or fewer.

Yet Spence sees nothing totally preposterous with her own demand that the PM meet with her for a week or two.

Remember, too, this is the same Theresa Spence whose remote community made national news last year when it was revealed that some residents were facing a winter in decrepit housing — including uninsulated tents.

Spence (and many of the same publicity-seeking opposition politicians who have rushed to her side this time) insisted the fault was Ottawa’s, even though the federal government had given her tiny community more than $90 million in the previous five years.

Spence herself had a comfortable office and home with a big-screen satellite television and high-speed internet. Her reserve had also received millions more from the Ontario government, from nearby mines and from casinos, and still was nearly $12 million in debt.

But the delusion goes well beyond Chief Spence to the greater Idle No More aboriginal movement that has so closely aligned itself with her protest.

Idle No More, which has been blockading train lines and organizing protests across the country, has convinced itself the federal government is surreptitiously changing federal law to make it easy for aboriginal governments to sell off land from their reserves.

That simply is not happening.

At the behest of elected reserve governments, Ottawa is changing the law to streamline the leasing of reserve land for casinos and other businesses.

At present, the Indian Act gives the federal government a very patronizing role in approving new leases. The new law would give greater control to elected on-reserve leaders.

But the rules making it difficult to sell reserve land permanently are not changing.

Like Spence, though, Idle No More supporters have deluded themselves into seeing Ottawa as out to get them.

[email protected]
 
Another chart showing the web these anarchist people belong to.

http://www.genuinewitty.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/flagpole-alex-relationships-5.png

Mohawk Warriors, Unions and media. Hmmmmm :whistle:
 
I believe that there are valid concerns that need addressing but, these groups and these people distract from it all.  just like at the G20, G8, Occupy etc.  Some legitimate beefs and people using legitimate forms of protest but they get drowned out by louder dolts that muddle the message and end up smashing stuff.
 
So when will the Mainstream Media wake up and see the obvious and get off their pet hobby horse 'Anything against the current Harper Government' meme? So many everyday folks are duped by all this 'unethical and unprofessional journalism.
 
I honestly think until they leave the reserves behind they'll always be on the fringes of Canadian society. Throwing millions of dollars at them is not going to fix their problems and we can't give them back their land.
 
Chief Stoker said:
I honestly think until they leave the reserves behind they'll always be on the fringes of Canadian society. Throwing millions of dollars at them is not going to fix their problems and we can't give them back their land.

:goodpost:

I agree.  :nod:
 
They should integrate with the rest of Canadian Society. Leave the reserves behind. That doesn't mean get rid of their traditional way of life if they choose.

Places like attawapiskat are unsustainable though.
 
Jed said:
So when will the Mainstream Media wake up and see the obvious and get off their pet hobby horse 'Anything against the current Harper Government' meme? So many everyday folks are duped by all this 'unethical and unprofessional journalism.

The day after the government changes hands?
 
ObedientiaZelum said:
They should integrate with the rest of Canadian Society. Leave the reserves behind. That doesn't mean get rid of their traditional way of life if they choose.

Places like attawapiskat are unsustainable though.
Attawapiskat in not their native lands they were moved there by the Fur Company's.
1. As cheep labour.
2. As hunters.
3. As a way to keep other fur company's away from there.
 
Chief Stoker said:
I honestly think until they leave the reserves behind they'll always be on the fringes of Canadian society. Throwing millions of dollars at them is not going to fix their problems and we can't give them back their land.

You're not the first one to say it, and you won't be the last. But, that would mean all those chiefs would find themselves out of a job, hence, it will never happen.
 
Retired AF Guy said:
You're not the first one to say it, and you won't be the last. But, that would mean all those chiefs would find themselves out of a job, hence, it will never happen.
And the Majority of the band will need to find Jobs also.
 
Retired AF Guy said:
You're not the first one to say it, and you won't be the last. But, that would mean all those chiefs would find themselves out of a job, hence, it will never happen.

I have a few good friends that are in the military who are aboriginals. They are level headed people who have integrated well into society off the reserve. They still have their beliefs and even practice them on the ship IE smudging, pow wows. It boggles my mind when people would rather live in squalor in some unheated shack somewhere instead of taking responsibility for themselves and succeed. A few take advantage of free/subsidized education, preferential hiring but many don't, its a crying shame.
 
Chief Stoker said:
I have a few good friends that are in the military who are aboriginals. They are level headed people who have integrated well into society off the reserve. They still have their beliefs and even practice them on the ship IE smudging, pow wows. It boggles my mind when people would rather live in squalor in some unheated shack somewhere instead of taking responsibility for themselves and succeed. A few take advantage of free/subsidized education, preferential hiring but many don't, its a crying shame.


It boggles my mind when people would rather live on the pogey in a small town somewhere instead of taking responsibility for themselves and succeed.


There are plenty of folks outside the first nations communities who are doing exactly the same thing - I recall reading about some communities in the Maritimes where foreign workers are brought in to do things like work at Timmies- since none of the locals are willing to do it.
 
dapaterson said:
There are plenty of folks outside the first nations communities who are doing exactly the same thing - I recall reading about some communities in the Maritimes where foreign workers are brought in to do things like work at Timmies- since none of the locals are willing to do it.

That's the reason it's all Filipinos working at the Timmies in Corner Brook, NL haha... not cause there's not enough people unemployed to do the job that's for sure.
 
Which makes the new EI rules sensible and prudent.

Don't want to work? You don't get paid.
 
Chief Stoker said:
I have a few good friends that are in the military who are aboriginals. They are level headed people who have integrated well into society off the reserve. They still have their beliefs and even practice them on the ship IE smudging, pow wows.

I'll second that.  I'm sure this sounds racist but if I was filling out a section and I had a choice from a variety of races I would pick a aboriginal first based solely off my experience.  Loyal to a fault, ultra hard working, mature, dependable, driven, honourable. Amazing soldiers.

I think the culture they are brought up in is that everyone is against them and they need to meet and exceed the perceived choler.

Just two examples I came across this week.
1. I was reading a fellows facebook page. He went to get some medication and his indian card would not work. he was convinced that the government was doing it on purpose. Like REALLY convinced. Him AND the other dozen plus posters who's card wouldn't work at the pharmacy for medication either. Harper wanted to kill them!  A day and a half of hatered later the system was back up and working and everything was fine.

2. A first nation woman was allegedly kidnapped in Thunderbay brought out to the woods sexually assaulted by two white guys and told that it was happening because of the blockades happening, it would happen again and native's do not deserve treaty rights or some shit like that.

In very short order accusations were leveled at the government for basically hiring thugs to kidnap this girl rape her and threaten her. Not a political entitiy- a 30 year old single mother.  The people making the accusations sounded like they whole hardheartedly believed this.

How can you heal the rift between cultures when THIS is the first reaction?
 
"I'm sure this sounds racist"

No, it sounds objective. Something missing from many peoples perspectives on things these days. Just point out a few of the facts about the whole INM movement, or Theresa Spence's convenient Hunger strike / diet / misdirection, and there will be no shortage of people out there calling you a racist. However, I have often been of the opinon that you should stick by your guns ( funny....me formerly in an Arty Rgt).

"How can you heal the rift between cultures when THIS is the first reaction?"

You cant. People who spend their lives mired in the past, and re-hashing past mis-deeds, or perceived slights never build a successful future. The Indian Act is greatly flawed, but it represents a way of life to those in power on the First Nations side, that would be disasterous to them should any real change occur. So most of what they do is simply political posturing.

It's tragic, almost to the point of comedy that the first reaction is almost conspiracy theory-esque. Yes the Harper Govt is trying to kill off sick Indians....good grief....how someone comes up with that while actually being allowed to walk around society is scary......unless their meds were anti-psychotics....in which case...carry on. Or that a crime against a woman, native or no, was perpetuated by the govt.....but wait and see what shakes out on that investigation.



Interesting story. My boss also instructs in building code, and was invited up to Moose Factory / Moosonee a few years back. He met some very nice reserve folks, and non reserve folks. He also got into construction costs while there, because they were so skewed. Here is what he was told.

The Feds will give say $3M in funding for housing. But being the Govt they typically will give it out over a period of time, say 3 years. The band then goes and gets financing from a bank or trust for the full amount to facilitate the projects. The finance company ( remember, it's a small area) then gives the loan, but dictates to the band who they will use for trades, transport, etc. All of this results in a house, that is essentially a pre-fab, built in say North Bay, and shipped flat packed. We worked out costs. Typically these homes are on concrete block pillars, and are a one level 24'x36' bungalow. Costs of actual construction? Around $120,000. Shipping? By flatbed semi, and then barge, including crane rental to put up the trusses $40,000. So $160,000. Yet by the time everyone in the chain has had their hand in the purse for their "share" that house is upwards of $250,000. So on one home, there is $90K of value not realized.........wonder where all that goes?

The Indian Act, and the reserve system needs an overhaul in the worst way possible. Real change needs to occur. I have been an advocate for years that they should be registered as Municipalities, and then much of the governance, and checks and balances would be in place.
 
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