All Things Negligent Discharge (merged)

[armyvern]

Jeez Jim. She just got back! Stop hitting on her from across the country!! :-*

Stop it!! I've been in a no-frat state for 8.5 months; I might be enjoying this!  8)

 

[OldSolduer]

Jeez Jim. She just got back! Stop hitting on her from across the country!! :-*

I guess I walked into that one!!  :facepalm:

Stop it!! I've been in a no-frat state for 8.5 months; I might be enjoying this!  8)

I'm going to stifle myself before I get in real trouble!

 

[medicineman]

That problem goes, at least, back to the B-H deployments. We caught guys doing gate duty with the firing pins out of their rifles.

I was riding shotgun with my acting- CSM on an ex in Wainwright one dreary fall day when he announced to me that there were bad guys in the areas and to look out for them.  I jacked a balnk up int the chamber of my rifle, safed it and pointed it out the window.  Sgt Gluebag looks at me and says "Please unload your weapon - if you had an ND in front of me I'd have no choice but to charge you".  My chin dropped, I looked at him and replied " Look Sarge, I've been in the service for quite awhile, have been around firearms alot of my life, I haven't had one yet and don't intend to start today.  You said there are bad guys out there, we have to play the game."  He then looked at me and said "That wasn't a request - unload your weapon".  This dweeb wouldn't even put the mag in his pistol , despite us not having any 9mm blanks, just to ensure the hammer wouldn't be able to drop on the thing, since he was worried he'd get fried over that.  That is the level of paranoia that comes from having ZERO comfort with your weapon.  My guess he was likely on of those fruit loops - and he was in Bosnia when the folks were still routinely being shot at or over.

MM

 

[OldSolduer]

I was riding shotgun with my acting- CSM on an ex in Wainwright one dreary fall day when he announced to me that there were bad guys in the areas and to look out for them.  I jacked a balnk up int the chamber of my rifle, safed it and pointed it out the window.  Sgt Gluebag looks at me and says "Please unload your weapon - if you had an ND in front of me I'd have no choice but to charge you".  My chin dropped, I looked at him and replied " Look Sarge, I've been in the service for quite awhile, have been around firearms alot of my life, I haven't had one yet and don't intend to start today.  You said there are bad guys out there, we have to play the game."  He then looked at me and said "That wasn't a request - unload your weapon".  This dweeb wouldn't even put the mag in his pistol , despite us not having any 9mm blanks, just to ensure the hammer wouldn't be able to drop on the thing, since he was worried he'd get fried over that.  That is the level of paranoia that comes from having ZERO comfort with your weapon.  My guess he was likely on of those fruit loops - and he was in Bosnia when the folks were still routinely being shot at or over.

MM

We did hear that troops in Velika Kladusa weren't given bolts to the C9 or they took the firing pin out.

 

[brihard]

Un. Effing. Believable. I mean, I can 'get' what I'm reading here in an abstract sense, but every part of my that takes any amount of pride in being a soldier and an NCO is just seething that crap like that has been gotten away with.

I'd like to see recruits carrying around loaded, readied weapons full of blanks constantly from as early on as can be safely done, and be damned to the ND statistics. I guess I take intimate familiarity an comfort with a weapon so for granted that I'm genuinely having trouble understanding this.

 

[medicineman]

We did hear that troops in Velika Kladusa weren't given bolts to the C9 or they took the firing pin out.

The following letters come to mind: R-E-T-A-R-D-E-D.  Arrange them how you like.

Fact is alot of people are not comfortable with how the weapons work and how to keep them safe.  I saw an NBP sailor on a nameless ship, while on their equivalent of QRF for leaving harbour, sitting with a C-8, mag in, playing with the safety catch.  With a pile of people in the hangar, including kids (was a family day cruise).  I had a polite chat, since I wasn't in uniform, and suggested he stop doing that.  If you're playing with the safety or any other gadgets on it, you're obviously not too comfy with the weapon.  Maybe they should be having weapons training earlier in BMQ to make the candidates more comfortable with having, holding, carrying the weapon...maybe they should be carrying them around with blanks in the chamber for the same reason...who knows.

Yes ND's happen...the idea is to cut them down, so I'm all for making people paranoid about them, but paranoid in the good way that makes people think about what and why they're doing something, since it's a vital part of the job.  I liken it to giving medications - you don't get paranoid, you just get into your comfort zone and do your double/triple checks to make sure the right person gets the right amount of the right stuff, given the right way at the right time.  It's just habit forming...kinda like what basic training is supposed to be about  .

MM

 

[GAP]

Maybe they should be having weapons training earlier in BMQ to make the candidates more comfortable with having, holding, carrying the weapon.

On day 3 of boot camp they gave us dummy rifles. They taught us how to hold, carry, & store them, and until we went to Pendleton and were issued real rifles, we ate, slept, and generally all round lived with those bi&^%ches! The one thing we never were, was....apprehensive  about them. They were part of us.

:2c:

 

[OldSolduer]

On day 3 of boot camp they gave us dummy rifles. They taught us how to hold, carry, & store them, and until we went to Pendleton and were issued real rifles, we ate, slept, and generally all round lived with those bi&^%ches! The one thing we never were, was....apprehensive  about them. They were part of us.

:2c:

Back when we used the FNC1 - remember that bad boy - we in TQ3 kept them in out locker, with breech block. We knew those weapons inside and out.
We never went anywhere without them. We were what you call "intimately familiar" with them.

Now I'm not sure how they do it in TQ3 BIQ now. Are they allowed to keep weapons in the shacks or are we too risk averse for that to happen?

 

[dangerboy]

We keep weapons in the shacks, but collect their bolts at night.

 

[OldSolduer]

We keep weapons in the shacks, but collect their bolts at night.

Question - how does WATC treat NDs?

 

[dangerboy]

In WATC,  they are investigated and if it is worthy a charge is laid and the pers is put on consoling for safety.

 

[armyvern]

In WATC,  they are investigated and if it is worthy a charge is laid and the pers is put on consoling for safety.

How Freudian of you.  >

Where's ArmyRick's video when we need 'er??

 

[OldSolduer]

In WATC,  they are investigated and if it is worthy a charge is laid and the pers is put on consoling for safety.

I'd console em too......and that video is hilarious.

 

[mariomike]

Aug 25, 2016

Special forces commander charged after accidentially firing weapon
http://www.680news.com/2016/08/25/special-forces-commander-charged-after-accidentially-firing-weapon/
OTTAWA – Canada’s top special forces soldier is facing a court martial after accidentally firing his rifle while loading it during a visit to Iraq last December.

 

[Lightguns]

Aug 25, 2016

Special forces commander charged after accidentially firing weapon
http://www.680news.com/2016/08/25/special-forces-commander-charged-after-accidentially-firing-weapon/
OTTAWA – Canada’s top special forces soldier is facing a court martial after accidentally firing his rifle while loading it during a visit to Iraq last December.

Good on him, he took ownership publically and immediately.  This is how it is done!

 

[Bass ackwards]

In cases like these it would be useful to know exactly what happened.
Not to further embarrass the man but for the rest of us to learn from.

I've been out for a very long time but I still handle firearms. I figure if it can happen to a guy with that much experience, then what should I be watching for when I handle one? What can I do safer?

 

[The Bread Guy]

Good on him, he took ownership publically and immediately.  This is how it is done!

:nod:

 

[Lightguns]

In cases like these it would be useful to know exactly what happened.
Not to further embarrass the man but for the rest of us to learn from.

I've been out for a very long time but I still handle firearms. I figure if it can happen to a guy with that much experience, then what should I be watching for when I handle one? What can I do safer?

That's easy he has, "has also held senior staff appointments in Assistant Deputy Minister (Policy) Group, the CDS’ Transformation Team, Force Development, and the Canadian Army."  Those jobs will reduce your skills with weapons quickly but really stuff happens.  Fine and carry on.  The important thing now is that the fine be of or near the same amount given a Pte and not some token $25 good old boy fine.

 

[Weinie]

I believe that the fine for then BGen Menard was $3500 for his ND in 2010. I expect something in this range will be forthcoming

 

[Haggis]

I believe that the fine for then BGen Menard was $3500 for his ND in 2010. I expect something in this range will be forthcoming

That was the one with his C8 carbine, right?  Not the other "ND".