Allowances - Post Living Differential (PLD) [MERGED]

[dapaterson]

Tied to rank, or tied to CAF pay? The latter would seem more reasonable. Better still if it were to be graduated and not binary...

 

[brihard]

Tied to rank, or tied to CAF pay? The latter would seem more reasonable. Better still if it were to be graduated and not binary...

However that could also potentially neuter the incentive (or retention) effect of spec pay or certain allowances.

Lots to balance here…

 

[dapaterson]

Since in theory allowances are compensation for conditions, it would strike me as reasonable to exclude allowances. But I'm not writing the policy...

 

[Halifax Tar]

Tied to rank, or tied to CAF pay? The latter would seem more reasonable. Better still if it were to be graduated and not binary...

Ive been told rank. But as below:

Considering the amounts aren’t out yet, that seems like a bit of a flinch.

Have to wait to see it come out.

 

[brihard]

Ive been told rank. But as below:



Have to wait to see it come out.

That’s not what we do here. Speculation is not encouraged, it’s obligatory. The more rampant the better.

 

[Furniture]

Ive been told rank. But as below:



Have to wait to see it come out.

I'd heard it would be rank based as well, hopefully it's well thought out.

A system like this can create unintended consequences pretty easily, as I fail to see a way to give PLD in a meaningful amount that doesn't create a situation where Jr. ranks are taking home as much money as more Snr. ranks.

 

[brihard]

I'd heard it would be rank based as well, hopefully it's well thought out.

A system like this can create unintended consequences pretty easily, as I fail to see a way to give PLD in a meaningful amount that doesn't create a situation where Jr. ranks are taking home as much money as more Snr. ranks.

Realistically what it should do is somewhat compress the pay gap between junior ranks, and SNCOs/commissioned officers.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Realistically what it should do is somewhat compress the pay gap between junior ranks, and SNCOs/commissioned officers.

We also have to remunerate people in positions of responsibility appropriately.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Ive been told rank. But as below:



Have to wait to see it come out.

So a spec 2 Cpl could get more “benefit” than a Standard pay Sgt.

Majors won’t get it, but a SAR Tech Jnr NCO would.

If so; fail. I’ll wait to say “fucking idiots” til after details are released.

COL is going up and as a WO, I stand to drop in disposable income if my PLD vaporizes. My GAFF and commitment and all that will likely follow my PLD.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Realistically what it should do is somewhat compress the pay gap between junior ranks, and SNCOs/commissioned officers.

That isn’t the intent of PLD though. It’s to compensate for high COL areas. Specialist pay does that for trades that qualify.

 

[Halifax Tar]

So a spec 2 Cpl could get more “benefit” than a Standard pay Sgt.

Majors won’t get it, but a SAR Tech Jnr NCO would.

If so; fail. I’ll wait to say “fucking idiots” til after details are released.

COL is going up and as a WO, I stand to drop in disposable income if my PLD vaporizes. My GAFF and commitment and all that will likely follow my PLD.

Ya this could be a disaster. And I think folks are expecting the worst.

We have to be careful. We are already hollow in the middle.

 

[Jarnhamar]

[Aug 31, 2005] Anyone have any idea when these are supposed to come out? The date always seems to get pushed back, then we either end up paying back money or getting a big bag O'cash..

Soon.

 

[Furniture]

Realistically what it should do is somewhat compress the pay gap between junior ranks, and SNCOs/commissioned officers.

The Jr. members may love that when they're Jr., but when the responsibilities stack up, and they're making slightly more than they did with far less responsibility they may change their mind.

 

[brihard]

That isn’t the intent of PLD though. It’s to compensate for high COL areas. Specialist pay does that for trades that qualify.

Yes, but high COL areas have brutally distorted against a formula that used Ottawa as a baseline. The baseline itself has now become unaffordable for many CAF members, which means that the policy allowing for PLD is now broken, because honest application would see many high PLD places lose substantially. Since it’s now a fiction that the baseline is affordable, the defensible policy foundation has quietly been removed, and something’s gotta give.

Obviously the existent compensation considerations all still remain. More responsibility should still mean more pay, to the extent needed to appropriately recruit and retain. Specialist pay and environmental allowances have their own merits and need to not be broken by whatever is done. No matter how you slice it though, an inconvenient discomfort for a major is a crisis of affordability for a Corporal. Something’s gotta give.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Yes, but high COL areas have brutally distorted against a formula that used Ottawa as a baseline. The baseline itself has now become unaffordable for many CAF members, which means that the policy allowing for PLD is now broken, because honest application would see many high PLD places lose substantially. Since it’s now a fiction that the baseline is affordable, the defensible policy foundation has quietly been removed, and something’s gotta give.

The best solution would then be to adjust PLD. I’ve also been a supporter of a “fixed federal income tax rate” for all Reg force mbrs who are posted outside their province of recruitment. There are other ways to fix this.

Obviously the existent compensation considerations all still remain. More responsibility should still mean more pay, to the extent needed to appropriately recruit and retain. Specialist pay and environmental allowances have their own merits and need to not be broken by whatever is done. No matter how you slice it though, an inconvenient discomfort for a major is a crisis of affordability for a Corporal. Something’s gotta give.

Yes. TB should have to give. Not CAF memberswho, thru education, effort and career success have made it to higher compensation level than others.

 

[Eaglelord17]

I still think the solution is to build more on base/near base housing which takes a fixed percentage of your pay for rent to be the way to go. If you choose to live off base it's on your dime and it's your decision. But it guarantees housing across the country no matter what base or location. No need for PLD or any other allowance if that was to happen.

Mind you it would take years to come in effect just to build of them, let alone DND getting its act together to make it happen.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

No need - unless you consider provincial tax rates; COL isn’t just about mortgage amounts.

 

[Halifax Tar]

The best solution would then be to adjust PLD. I’ve also been a supporter of a “fixed federal income tax rate” for all Reg force mbrs who are posted outside their province of recruitment. There are other ways to fix this.

I've argued for sometime that we should all be taxed at the Ont rate regardless of where we are posted.

This would go a long way.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

This is going to piss so many people off. Especially those who have been left in the lurch for the entirety of PLD. Plenty of Sgts and WOs that have had to stretch a buck because the lost ina Posting Message roulette over the years. Especially when they were posted in as Cpls.

What should have happened was applying a similar common sense approach akin to what we use for OUTCAN postings and other governmental departments:

You are posted to X location, the cost of rent for a 2 bdrm is 2350, and the newly mandated, national standard rent of a 2 bdrm from CFHA is 800. Mbr is on the hook for 800. GoC, as the employer forcing the relocation, is on the hook for the remainder. This only applies to high COL locations and would not apply to buying or selling homes. If members wanted to buy, have at'er; but you're on the hook for your mortgage and the benefit doesn't apply. This would also make it rank agnostic, as it's based on local area and not on how much a member makes based on skill, responsibility, education, or experience.

If this is a hack job like it sounds, I honestly see this making the problem worse.

 

[dimsum]

I've argued for sometime that we should all be taxed at the Ont rate regardless of where we are posted.

This would go a long way.

Cue wails from BC, AB, etc

What should have happened was applying a similar common sense approach akin to what we use for OUTCAN postings and other governmental departments:

Yes. What OGDs do that as well? GAC?

The problem I could see is how we'd get the money to cover the rest of the costs. The GoC isn't exactly giving away cash to DND.