Cadets vs Boy Scouts (role, "child soldiers", etc.)

[Gunner]

Sorry, I thought you were implying that you were something that you are not.

 

[ArmyBoyzGurl]

lol, oh no! i‘m just agreeing with whomever said that when cadets are at staff during the summer, they ARE technically NOT civilians, because we are employed by DND...and when at our home units, we are civilians, because during the summer, we‘re on a contract, just as regular foce members are on 3 year (ish) contracts, we are on 8 week contracts to follow the military code of conduct, n such. big job for a bunch of 16-18 yr olds.. *wipes brow*
:warstory:

 

[Ian]

Civilians employed by DND are still civilians.

 

[ArmyBoyzGurl]

mehn..we still work under the military code of conduct during the summer if we‘re staf cadets..whatever.. dont wanna argue about it...

 

[Gunner]

they ARE technically NOT civilians, because we are employed by
DND

In this case you are completely incorrect. A cadet is a civilian, whether they are on a paid contract or not. I‘m not sure why you would even suggest that you were a member of the CF. I don‘t believe you are subject to the code of service discipline...why would you be?

 

[Lawrence]

They actaully might be subject to the CSD. I just cant recall if civilian emplyees that are working on contract for DND are subject too. If they are then in theroy so are cadets if not well...

 

[garb811]

Errr...no! Having policed a Cadet Camp or three I can assure you Cadets are not, and never will be. If a Cadet gets in the poop, even if staff at a Camp, the case *must* go downtown if prosecution is warranted.

 

[combat_medic]

You are subject to the rules of the camp on which you‘re located. You‘re NOT subject to the code of service discipline, but you‘re still a part of this country and subject to the rules and laws governing it. You‘re not prosecuted by military courts, and cannot be fined, or have any military action taken against you. You can still get charged in civilian courts and go to jail, like anyone else in this country.

I worked at an air cadet camp this summer and saw PLENTY of infractions that would have merited charges under the CSD, but the cadets were sent home, or sent through civilian police (depending on the severity of the case).

Cadets ARE civilians. Whether you‘re staff or not, you‘re still a civilian. Just as was mentioned previously, DND employs civilians everywhere, and while they may have a service number and sign a contract, they‘re civilians nonetheless.

 

[MP 811]

Actually combat_medic, I was called to the Albert Head Cadet Camp on several occaisons to investigate cadets for various offences throughout the time frame of the cadet camp.We never called in the civilian police because its not their jurisdicition. Your right about civilian court though, we would just process the charge through there instead of military court.

securitas

 

[BestOfTheBest]

FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT! :fifty: :mg:

 

[GGHG_Cadet]

Cadets are civillians we may do similiar things as the military but we‘re civillians. Cadets is a youth program that introduces teenagers to the military.

 

[Jason Jarvis]

It‘s been just over ten years since I graduated from the air cadets (WO2, 507 Kentville RCACS), and I‘m looking into joining the CIC. I had tried to join after graduation, but the medical standards for the CIL (as it was known at the time) were as tight as the PRes, and my uncorrected vision was -- and remains -- terrible.

However, after a lot of encouragement from an old cadet buddy who is currently a Capt in the CIC, I went down to the CFRC and asked them whether anything had changed -- and it has. I apparently just need to find a unit with an opening and convince the CO to accept me "as is" -- I‘ll only be instructing cadets, after all, not climbing mountains in Afghanistan.

Anyways, now that you know my life‘s story, how much have things changed in ten years?

I attended the Aircrew Survival Instructor Course in Bagotville in 1991, and it was pretty tough -- we did 5 days with no food in the bush, a 2.5 km cold water swim, timed overnight land navigation exercises, 10 km canoe trip with multiple portages, etc., all in just six weeks.

I taught the next summer at Greenwood, and the regional version of this course was extremely watered down -- no night marches, solo survival treks or isolation camps, only a 1 km swim. Wimpy, wimpy, wimpy.

I would prefer to join an army cadet unit, primarily because army cadets USED to do all the fun things I wasn‘t allowed to do as an air cadet: largebore target shooting, jump course, adventure training, etc. Is this still the case?

I just want to know what I can expect. Thanks!

 

[GGHG_Cadet]

Army Cadets is totaly different now becausew of CHAP. My Corp does tons of shooting we‘ve shot largebore but it is still wimpy and very slack. I really wish I could do something u get no respect at all from cadets mainly cause I‘m only 13 and there all 15-16. According to CHAP I‘m not allowed to give push-ups.

 

[ArmyBoyzGurl]

as a present WO2 of 386 RCAirCs in comox BC, the giving of pushups, ghcg cadet, is that you have to do them as well. CHAP is not set up to make cadets slack, it was set up to protect cadets... the same reason we have the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

In response to the first post, one of my Fsgts went on the Survival Instructor Course last summer, i can get a run down of what they did and get back to you if you want. you also might want to check out www.cadets.ca there‘s tons of stuff on the website including how to join the CIC.

have fun!

 

[ArmyBoyzGurl]

sorry, my bad.. GGHG_cadet...

 

[Irish]

I‘m a master warrent officer with 2915 IROC in Sudbury Ontario, The standard for CIC applicants has dropped dramtically in the past years, not only can you fail you physical but aptitude test as well and you can still be accepted. It‘s a good system and is very benefical to the cadets and the CIC can use as many competent officers as they could get.

As for the chap issue it helps in certain situations but is still a nucince when it comes down to training, cadets are not boy scouts so the should not be treated like them and if this invlovs yelling and some firmness so be it chap should not get in the way of that.

 

[Jason Jarvis]

What does CHAP stand for? How easy is it to work around? I was never a hard-*** , sadistic SoB, but I strongly believe there‘s value in "tough love!" :mg:

 

[GGHG_Cadet]

CHAP stands for Cadet Harassment Abuse Prevention (I think). I do know that it is there to protect cadets but it can be a real pain in the A$$ at times because there are those cadets who are awalys outta line and really need discipline but cause of CHAP u cant. And yes we also do it with them but we are realyy not supposed to be giving them unless we‘re doin the fitness badges.

 

[ArmyBoyzGurl]

Well, CHAP is a pain, and some people do find it tough to deal with cadets that constantly need "reminders".. you need to develop a leadership style that enables you to deal with those situations. Use the cadets‘ attitude to your advantage, and also, use your NCO‘s, WO‘s, and Officers if need be. If you dont have the necessary chain of command in your corps, how do you expect anyone in your corps to respect eachother and the ranks held???

respect is not a right, its a privelege.

 

[Jarnhamar]

"I attended the Aircrew Survival Instructor Course in Bagotville in 1991, and it was pretty tough -- we did 5 days with no food in the bush, a 2.5 km cold water swim, timed overnight land navigation exercises, 10 km canoe trip with multiple portages, etc., all in just six weeks."

This is something the reserves should put into their basic training. I don‘t think many reservests are taught to fend for themselves in the woods for 5 days. (By that i mean none) Thats something i really respect about the cadets.
A lot of cadets seem to complain that they don‘t get to do "army" stuff like section attacks (Their not very fun after the 3rd time) or shooting guns etc.. but you guys make up for it in a lot of other areas.