W
wern32
Guest
meni0n said:
thats why THEY got in Sh!@.
- Status
thats why THEY got in Sh!@.
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 210
I just have to jump in here with 2.......take it or leave it.
1) Wern32 - you are pretty _______ for one. (Please insert your choice of word in the blank - stupid, ignorant, brave, or naive) With all the information you have in your profile and all of your "opinions" on this whole situation, you might as well just have posted your name, rank, and svc #. You've insulted people much more experienced than you for bascially giving you the facts, dismissed their ideas because they may have come from a different time than you have, and have made a pretty strong remark against your course directors. I'm not sure if your goal was to bring attention to what happened to you and your course (last I checked, you weren't in a union), but I'm quite sure that with the CF being a very small world, the word is out and your course directors likely have pegged you. Believe me, I KNOW who these course directors are. And I'm very sure when I say they (course directors) agree with every bit of advice everyone here has shared with you.
2) The way I see it, you were going with the old, "Well that's the way I learned it was supposed to be - so it must be the way it is" routine. Then you come up looking for a reference in search of some backing for your "defence". But alas, you come up short. And in the end, you give everyone the "in your face" like statement telling everyone that the decision was re-thought to meet your liking......or at least the way you thought it was to be done. I personally think that with the way the military is so over sensitive nowadays, that the decision was probably adjusted to avoid any potential harassmant complaints (I said the H word) or possible trips to see the Base Padre. We wouldn't want to upset the students now would we? It could jeopardize our careers. Good people have unfortunately been forced to walk on eggshells because of people like you.
3) Your seach for help was a very big mistake. I hope I never get so desparate to find info that I ruin my integrity as you have in order to fight a battle like this. I also wonder if the others who this situation directly affected, were even as brave so as to try and argue this fact. Perhaps they complained (as we sometimes do as a way of venting) but picked up and carried on. You play yourself as a great leader, as someone who tries to follow the written rules by the books. Too bad you forgot who you work for. You don't work for your troops/co-workers, you work for the Crown. When you eventually put your leaf up, I suspect you may change your tune. You may want to always do what is right, but right now, I don't think you know what right is. Right is not taking care of your troops when it comes at the expense of the mission. "Sorry Sir, I know I have a mission - but I just don't want my guys to be unhappy right now." Thousands of dollars are being spent to get you trained up for a job - and minor sacrafices may have to be made.
4) Your comments about Reservists and running the show like a movie are such a joke to me. The school doesn't really tolerate too much crap, and just like any other full time training site, CFSCE keeps it's students in line with some regular inspections, parades, and chin ups. Sorry you have to put up with calling a Reservist a Master Corporal when you probably don't respect him. Must be tough having those 8 years in the Reg Force and having to put up with that. I've seen guys with 20 years (16 as a Corporal) and they still maintained their professionalism day in - day out. But it's the world you're in - and with all the shortages in the CF now, you may bump into a lot of Part-Timers doing the full time thing. I think you should change your attitude towards the individual themselves, not whether they are Reg or Res Force. Sounds to me like you may have a pretty close knit group there on course and that you don't really agree with some things that are happening. You've been on courses so you should know the one thing you all have in common is sometimes not liking what your instructors/course directors do. Sometimes your opinions get the best of you and you feel mad. You should also know how to work through it properly with some integrity while accomplishing the mission. I would direct you to some of the principles of leadership and how you've failed to practice them, but I'll let everyone else point out which ones you've missed the figure 11 on completely, for my post is getting far too long.
I choose to end this by wishing you luck on your course. Hopefully you gain the trade knowledge you need to do your job as a 227. As for being in charge of others, I really hope you learn a lot more before you are put in that position. It seems to me that you have a lot to learn. But what do I know? I only have 8 years under MY belt.
Bin
1) Wern32 - you are pretty _______ for one. (Please insert your choice of word in the blank - stupid, ignorant, brave, or naive) With all the information you have in your profile and all of your "opinions" on this whole situation, you might as well just have posted your name, rank, and svc #. You've insulted people much more experienced than you for bascially giving you the facts, dismissed their ideas because they may have come from a different time than you have, and have made a pretty strong remark against your course directors. I'm not sure if your goal was to bring attention to what happened to you and your course (last I checked, you weren't in a union), but I'm quite sure that with the CF being a very small world, the word is out and your course directors likely have pegged you. Believe me, I KNOW who these course directors are. And I'm very sure when I say they (course directors) agree with every bit of advice everyone here has shared with you.
2) The way I see it, you were going with the old, "Well that's the way I learned it was supposed to be - so it must be the way it is" routine. Then you come up looking for a reference in search of some backing for your "defence". But alas, you come up short. And in the end, you give everyone the "in your face" like statement telling everyone that the decision was re-thought to meet your liking......or at least the way you thought it was to be done. I personally think that with the way the military is so over sensitive nowadays, that the decision was probably adjusted to avoid any potential harassmant complaints (I said the H word) or possible trips to see the Base Padre. We wouldn't want to upset the students now would we? It could jeopardize our careers. Good people have unfortunately been forced to walk on eggshells because of people like you.
3) Your seach for help was a very big mistake. I hope I never get so desparate to find info that I ruin my integrity as you have in order to fight a battle like this. I also wonder if the others who this situation directly affected, were even as brave so as to try and argue this fact. Perhaps they complained (as we sometimes do as a way of venting) but picked up and carried on. You play yourself as a great leader, as someone who tries to follow the written rules by the books. Too bad you forgot who you work for. You don't work for your troops/co-workers, you work for the Crown. When you eventually put your leaf up, I suspect you may change your tune. You may want to always do what is right, but right now, I don't think you know what right is. Right is not taking care of your troops when it comes at the expense of the mission. "Sorry Sir, I know I have a mission - but I just don't want my guys to be unhappy right now." Thousands of dollars are being spent to get you trained up for a job - and minor sacrafices may have to be made.
4) Your comments about Reservists and running the show like a movie are such a joke to me. The school doesn't really tolerate too much crap, and just like any other full time training site, CFSCE keeps it's students in line with some regular inspections, parades, and chin ups. Sorry you have to put up with calling a Reservist a Master Corporal when you probably don't respect him. Must be tough having those 8 years in the Reg Force and having to put up with that. I've seen guys with 20 years (16 as a Corporal) and they still maintained their professionalism day in - day out. But it's the world you're in - and with all the shortages in the CF now, you may bump into a lot of Part-Timers doing the full time thing. I think you should change your attitude towards the individual themselves, not whether they are Reg or Res Force. Sounds to me like you may have a pretty close knit group there on course and that you don't really agree with some things that are happening. You've been on courses so you should know the one thing you all have in common is sometimes not liking what your instructors/course directors do. Sometimes your opinions get the best of you and you feel mad. You should also know how to work through it properly with some integrity while accomplishing the mission. I would direct you to some of the principles of leadership and how you've failed to practice them, but I'll let everyone else point out which ones you've missed the figure 11 on completely, for my post is getting far too long.
I choose to end this by wishing you luck on your course. Hopefully you gain the trade knowledge you need to do your job as a 227. As for being in charge of others, I really hope you learn a lot more before you are put in that position. It seems to me that you have a lot to learn. But what do I know? I only have 8 years under MY belt.
Bin
W
wern32
Guest
Bintheredunthat said:
All that bitching, I truely beleive you have no place in the military.
W
wern32
Guest
I have spent 8 years in the infantry, which is the front line. This is were most of you !@cks pretend you are.
I have almost died because of hypothermia, dehidration and enemy fire as well as friendly fire. I am a true veteren,(but I do not brag about it ) not like these clowns I see with the poppy's on their plate. I was one of the first pesr to participe in combat missions since the Koreon war(OP Apollo). F!@#k all of you that question me.
I am an expert when it comes to military doctrin and if you dont agree you are out right wrong.
Im sure some may disagree but this is a new army, my army and if YOU dont like it then get the F!@k out.
How many of you posting are past your retirement and are doing extentions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Leave us so we can carry on
I have almost died because of hypothermia, dehidration and enemy fire as well as friendly fire. I am a true veteren,(but I do not brag about it ) not like these clowns I see with the poppy's on their plate. I was one of the first pesr to participe in combat missions since the Koreon war(OP Apollo). F!@#k all of you that question me.
I am an expert when it comes to military doctrin and if you dont agree you are out right wrong.
Im sure some may disagree but this is a new army, my army and if YOU dont like it then get the F!@k out.
How many of you posting are past your retirement and are doing extentions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Leave us so we can carry on
W
wern32
Guest
I have witnessed an afghan kill a sheep and was about to open up on us simply because we saw him do it. I dont care if your an CSM or not but you have no idea how the military really works. In the infantry you need to common sense and all I have seen in all these post are ignorant old men stating their feelings. I have sent many of these post to my co-workers and they are shocked at what they have seen.
You old timers need to realize that it is 2005 NOT 1895. I respect my elders but you folks question that.
You old timers need to realize that it is 2005 NOT 1895. I respect my elders but you folks question that.
W
wern32
Guest
TCBF
have a statement or dont bother me.
You sound old as well
have a statement or dont bother me.
You sound old as well
W
wern32
Guest
TCBF said:
\WO
Unit: CMTC
you know very little about how the real military works. Im sure you tell your friends at party's how it is but come om you know nothing about the dangous patrts of the military
- Reaction score
- 94
- Points
- 530
Oh Wern,
Too too bad for you. My heart bleeds. Too bad also that you aren't coming over to my trade. Because the first time I told your butt to be in at work that evening and you failed to show....I would charge your ass. I would win. You would lose. Period. Plain and simple. AWOA. Thank god that you are no longer a member of the infantry because with "leader's" such as yourself none of them would need any enemies.
Do not presume to call me a bad leader, dinosaur or any other of your self-serving comments and notions that you have used in this forum. You my dear, do not know where I have been and with whom I have served. I can guarantee that I have more field time than yourself and have been on more Ops.
I know that my personnel respect me. They know that I do not bring them into work (sometimes with as little as 1 hour notice) unless it is necessary. When I do call them in they understand it is for a reason and they don't whine about it. They actually have excellent morale, which apparently you lack. Morale is a leader's responsibility....you should retake all those 'leadership' courses that ONLY YOU have apparently absorbed and learned so well...and figure out that DISCIPLINE is a factor in it.
You think you'll be a good leader...(I'm rolling on the floor laughing now!!)? Well then, I have some advice for you (coming from an ignorant old woman please when you choose to rebuff me)...
With such a piss-poor attitude and condescending demeanour such as that you posess (PS...I wouldn't brag about being a 'good' leader if I was yourself either), you should seriously do the CF a favour and get the hell out...if not...
Take a good hard look in the mirror and sort yourself the %&$@ out. Because it is only a matter of time before someone does it for you and I hope to god it's one of those old men with 60s mentality. And YOU truly are deserving of it. Thank god as well that I do not have such an insubordinate, insolent, mindless, the 'world owes me everything' little Gen Xer working for me. I really hate recommending pers for release, but it your case, I would be honoured. Enough said.
PS...I think the suggestion earlier was that you should offer to look after the kids (they didn't say your kids) so as such a consumate professional leader why didn't you jump right in there and offer to babysit so that your apparently lacking course-mates could benefit from your initiative, ethos and leadership?
:crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby:
Too too bad for you. My heart bleeds. Too bad also that you aren't coming over to my trade. Because the first time I told your butt to be in at work that evening and you failed to show....I would charge your ass. I would win. You would lose. Period. Plain and simple. AWOA. Thank god that you are no longer a member of the infantry because with "leader's" such as yourself none of them would need any enemies.
Do not presume to call me a bad leader, dinosaur or any other of your self-serving comments and notions that you have used in this forum. You my dear, do not know where I have been and with whom I have served. I can guarantee that I have more field time than yourself and have been on more Ops.
I know that my personnel respect me. They know that I do not bring them into work (sometimes with as little as 1 hour notice) unless it is necessary. When I do call them in they understand it is for a reason and they don't whine about it. They actually have excellent morale, which apparently you lack. Morale is a leader's responsibility....you should retake all those 'leadership' courses that ONLY YOU have apparently absorbed and learned so well...and figure out that DISCIPLINE is a factor in it.
You think you'll be a good leader...(I'm rolling on the floor laughing now!!)? Well then, I have some advice for you (coming from an ignorant old woman please when you choose to rebuff me)...
With such a piss-poor attitude and condescending demeanour such as that you posess (PS...I wouldn't brag about being a 'good' leader if I was yourself either), you should seriously do the CF a favour and get the hell out...if not...
Take a good hard look in the mirror and sort yourself the %&$@ out. Because it is only a matter of time before someone does it for you and I hope to god it's one of those old men with 60s mentality. And YOU truly are deserving of it. Thank god as well that I do not have such an insubordinate, insolent, mindless, the 'world owes me everything' little Gen Xer working for me. I really hate recommending pers for release, but it your case, I would be honoured. Enough said.
PS...I think the suggestion earlier was that you should offer to look after the kids (they didn't say your kids) so as such a consumate professional leader why didn't you jump right in there and offer to babysit so that your apparently lacking course-mates could benefit from your initiative, ethos and leadership?
:crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby: :crybaby:
- Reaction score
- 2
- Points
- 210
Well as an OP Apollo vet myself I must defend some of the person (wern excluded) Most on that tour were professional and great soldiers. TCBF included. Its easy to hide behind a pseudo name and slag someone else abilities just based on their age and era they joined the military. But alas it is a new military and the last 10 years have taken a dive in regards to the "suck it up" and soldier on mentality. I have been in for 18 years and watch us go from getting our A_____ kick behind the barracks in Cornwallis to now being asked to polish your boots. Ptes telling MCpl's that they don't know how to do their jobs and nothing gets done about it. IMHO we need the old days and that old mentality its the threat of harassment is ruining the army. Wern I have no idea who you really are but I think the infantry is grateful to get rid of you that one less disrespecting soldier they have to deal with. Just my rant to a thread that shouldn't have every been started.
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 160
My wife, Kirsten ^^^^^^, told me about the gist of this thread over breakfast, and I nearly spit my food out of my mouth. "Can they do this to us????" Indeed.....
I think wern is an example of a pure shite combat arms soldier going on to becoming a pure shite tradesman. I've seen more than my share of deadwood leave the Armour Corps go on to be deadwood in their new trade. I've also seen a lot of good soldiers go on to be good MPs, firefighters, bin-rats, etc, so this isn't a slag against those that OT or the trades they go to.
You are an expert on military doctrine, hmmm????!!!! What lofty education do you have in that?? Doing endless section-attacks and combat team attacks. I smell bullsh!t here.... I was on Op Palladium with 2VP in 97 and 00-01, do tell what tactical genius you were, working out of CS 8.
And yes, I am an old dinosaur (18 years in, 37 years old), and I know TCBF, and there is something to be said for the old days and the old ways. Not that I agree with all of those things, but they did allow real soldiers to overcome real adversities, not just having to scramble for a baby-sitter, or cancel social plans. If you want us oldtimers to get out so you can run the military in a Club Med style setting, don't worry: a lot of good guys from the old days ARE getting out, mainly because of the jam-tart mentality of pseudo-soldiers like wern, who keep harping on about their rights but keep forgetting about one thing that trumps rights: responsibilities.
Oh yeah wern, you techno-wonder, stop wasting bandwidth by copying an entire post and putting something lame under it: just copy the pertinent bits. You can do that, can't you?!?!?! It might be on your PO check......
Al
I think wern is an example of a pure shite combat arms soldier going on to becoming a pure shite tradesman. I've seen more than my share of deadwood leave the Armour Corps go on to be deadwood in their new trade. I've also seen a lot of good soldiers go on to be good MPs, firefighters, bin-rats, etc, so this isn't a slag against those that OT or the trades they go to.
You are an expert on military doctrine, hmmm????!!!! What lofty education do you have in that?? Doing endless section-attacks and combat team attacks. I smell bullsh!t here.... I was on Op Palladium with 2VP in 97 and 00-01, do tell what tactical genius you were, working out of CS 8.
And yes, I am an old dinosaur (18 years in, 37 years old), and I know TCBF, and there is something to be said for the old days and the old ways. Not that I agree with all of those things, but they did allow real soldiers to overcome real adversities, not just having to scramble for a baby-sitter, or cancel social plans. If you want us oldtimers to get out so you can run the military in a Club Med style setting, don't worry: a lot of good guys from the old days ARE getting out, mainly because of the jam-tart mentality of pseudo-soldiers like wern, who keep harping on about their rights but keep forgetting about one thing that trumps rights: responsibilities.
Oh yeah wern, you techno-wonder, stop wasting bandwidth by copying an entire post and putting something lame under it: just copy the pertinent bits. You can do that, can't you?!?!?! It might be on your PO check......
Al
- Reaction score
- 25
- Points
- 430
Wern
Perhaps you ought to look in your own mirror, with your remarks on how you respect people, especially those ahead of you.
You've dug yourself a fine deep hole.
Perhaps you ought to look in your own mirror, with your remarks on how you respect people, especially those ahead of you.
wern32 said:
wern32 said:
wern32 said:
You've dug yourself a fine deep hole.
- Reaction score
- 5,881
- Points
- 1,360
MODERATOR NOTE
Not that he hasn't earned the kicks to the groin but I think we should slide this one back to the original question and the way he says it played out.
Anyone here familiar with the school and/or course that could shed some light from the other side?
I really would like to know if apologies[ and if so, why] were made to the students of a military course for making them do forced study time.
Thanks
Not that he hasn't earned the kicks to the groin but I think we should slide this one back to the original question and the way he says it played out.
Anyone here familiar with the school and/or course that could shed some light from the other side?
I really would like to know if apologies[ and if so, why] were made to the students of a military course for making them do forced study time.
Thanks
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 60
Hello:
I find Wern's statements to be extremely rude and disrespecful to those who are older and more experienced than him. I have read this entire post with fresh eyes and have seen that this person has no ability to respect the foundations of tradition or experience. I believe the military can only be operated upon principles of respect, team work and knowledge.
What am I to say anyway? I am not even in the military yet so I obviously have no experience, wisdom or intellect.
Take it or leave it,
I find Wern's statements to be extremely rude and disrespecful to those who are older and more experienced than him. I have read this entire post with fresh eyes and have seen that this person has no ability to respect the foundations of tradition or experience. I believe the military can only be operated upon principles of respect, team work and knowledge.
What am I to say anyway? I am not even in the military yet so I obviously have no experience, wisdom or intellect.
Take it or leave it,
- Status
