CMMA - replacing the CP140 Aurora

[dapaterson]

Well sure, the three months ACSOs spend on "wheeled suitcase selection" doesn't leave much time for other stuff.

 

[dimsum]

Well sure, the three months ACSOs spend on "wheeled suitcase selection" doesn't leave much time for other stuff.

Top tip - get the 4-caster ones that roll in all directions

 

[Spencer100]

Important people and families are mad Boeing so there will be no P-8. Full stop.

 

[Good2Golf]

I get that everyone wants Canada to get the P8. I was just pointing out limitations in putting all of the Capabilities in a 737ng or a A320neo.

Don’t mistake “will get the P8” for “wants to get the P8.”

Important people and families are mad Boeing so there will be no P-8. Full stop.

Can we quote you on that? Which ‘important people and families’ would be capable of refusing US direction, camouflaged as ‘continental defense concern’, to buy the P8?

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Don’t mistake “will get the P8” for “wants to get the P8.”

I’ll add, not everyone is the LRP world or RCAF wants “to get P-8” although it’s the east, visible replacement.

I think I can say, in the fleet, a huge majority want and see a new for a replacement, and we’ll before the GoC does anything about it. I’ll say 99.99% want a replacement because there might be that 0.01% that don’t (aside from the Flt Engr trade).

Sadly I think our place as a respected member of the “VP community” globally will dwindle further and further. You can’t operate the way we are right now and into the next decade and still reasonably believe you’ll be viewed the same as, the RAAF is by Allies, for example.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Top tip - get the 4-caster ones that roll in all directions

That might be the first Prof Level 5 I’ve ever seen right there!!

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I’ll add, not everyone is the LRP world or RCAF wants “to get P-8” although it’s the easy, visible replacement.

I think I can say, in the fleet, a huge majority want and see a need for a replacement, and well before the GoC does anything about it. I’ll say 99.99% want a replacement because there might be that 0.01% that don’t (aside from the Flt Engr trade).

Sadly I think our place as a respected member of the “VP community” globally will dwindle further and further. You can’t operate the way we are right now and into the next decade and still reasonably believe you’ll be viewed the same as, the RAAF is by Allies, for example.

Edited after my second coffee for Islander English errors due to iPhone autocorrect.

 

[Good2Golf]

Another soon-to-be US FragO to Canada…

Uncle Sam: “Get ‘er done, poutine-eaters!”

 

[CBH99]

I’ll add, not everyone is the LRP world or RCAF wants “to get P-8” although it’s the east, visible replacement.

I think I can say, in the fleet, a huge majority want and see a new for a replacement, and we’ll before the GoC does anything about it. I’ll say 99.99% want a replacement because there might be that 0.01% that don’t (aside from the Flt Engr trade).

Sadly I think our place as a respected member of the “VP community” globally will dwindle further and further. You can’t operate the way we are right now and into the next decade and still reasonably believe you’ll be viewed the same as, the RAAF is by Allies, for example.

From the viewpoint of someone that actually works & operates inside the LRP community, what other realistic options are out there besides the P8?

Our allies increasingly use it, so spare parts/training/maintenance in theatre/crew familiarity, etc - it seems like the easiest decision.


Are there any other realistic options out there? What are your thoughts/preferences on a replacement? (If any)

(I feel like someone should ask you guys. I mean, apparently nobody asked the SAR techs what their thoughts were... )

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Realistic options. I’d love to include the P-1 but I don’t think that fall into the realistic side.

The P-8 seems be the only realistic platform that is currently operating and proven. Ours should have the MAD system on it.

8 to 12 are NOT ENOUGH. 14 Auroras are not enough.

The realistic option must also provide enough airframes for the maintenance cycle, FG, FE and FD requirements. 12 - nope. If 14 isn’t enough 12 will short.

 

[KevinB]

8+12…

 

[dimsum]

The P-8 seems be the only realistic platform that is currently operating and proven. Ours should have the MAD system on it.

My spidey-sense is tingling, wondering why of all the countries using it, only the Indians ordered the one with MAD.

Not the Americans, Brits, Aussies, Kiwis, Norgies, etc.

 

[GR66]

8 to 12 are NOT ENOUGH. 14 Auroras are not enough.

This to me signifies the absolute stupidity of the GOC in terms of Defence policy and the weakness of our military leadership.

We're surrounded by water on three sides and have the World's longest coastline so we're looking at a fleet of 8 to 12 MPA's??? And we plan to use these for deployed ops as well???

FFS Air Canada has a fleet of 667 aircraft.

This line item is probably one of the easiest sells in the Defence budget. Being able to see what's going on in our maritime domain is absolutely fundamental to maintaining our sovereignty and without that basic capability we simply cannot fulfill the primary task of the military which is the Defence of Canada.

The fact that nobody is screaming HELL NO from the rooftops about this literally makes me weep for the state of this country.

[/rant]

 

[dimsum]

This to me signifies the absolute stupidity of the GOC in terms of Defence policy and the weakness of our military leadership.

We're surrounded by water on three sides and have the World's longest coastline so we're looking at a fleet of 8 to 12 MPA's??? And we plan to use these for deployed ops as well???

FFS Air Canada has a fleet of 667 aircraft.

This line item is probably one of the easiest sells in the Defence budget. Being able to see what's going on in our maritime domain is absolutely fundamental to maintaining our sovereignty and without that basic capability we simply cannot fulfill the primary task of the military which is the Defence of Canada.

The fact that nobody is screaming HELL NO from the rooftops about this literally makes me weep for the state of this country.

[/rant]

Personally, unless someone in the RCAF is publicly stating that we're getting 8-12 aircraft (which, AFAIK, no one did), I'd take those numbers with KFC-levels of salt.

 

[KevinB]

I suspect 18 is the minimum number that will be acceptable. 20-24 would be a better number though.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I suspect 18 is the minimum number that will be acceptable. 20-24 would be a better number though.

I suspect the RCAF has blinders for anything isn't fast air and inappropriate call signs.

 

[KevinB]

I suspect the RCAF has blinders for anything isn't fast air and inappropriate call signs.

I’m of the opinion that the RCAF is getting a directed requirement from higher….

 

[dimsum]

I suspect the RCAF has blinders for anything isn't fast air and inappropriate call signs.

I'm not so sure about that. DComd (MGen Keiver) is a Herc guy.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I should have put in a lol emoji...

Lighten up, its a coffee and JD Shore Rum Cream morning.

 

[Weinie]

Personally, unless someone in the RCAF is publicly stating that we're getting 8-12 aircraft (which, AFAIK, no one did), I'd take those numbers with KFC-levels of salt.

Ummmmmmmmm.........KFC.