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Commons defence committee arrives in Afghanistan

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Commons defence committee arrives in Afghanistan
Updated Tue. Jan. 23 2007 7:04 AM ET Associated Press
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KANDAHAR -- Eight members of the all-party Commons defence committee, including an outspoken opponent of the war, have arrived in southern Afghanistan to assess Canada's role there.


They arrived at Kandahar Airfield early Tuesday amid tight security aboard a Canadian Forces transport plane.


The army has a series of briefings prepared for them on all aspects of the war and reconstruction effort.


Liberal MP Carolyn Bennett says she's looking forward to seeing the Conservative government's so-called three-D approach - defence, development and diplomacy - in action.

But it remains to be seen how much MPs, including New Democrat Dawn Black, get to see because the committee will not be allowed outside of the airfield to view reconstruction efforts.

Black, whose party has called for the withdrawal of Canadian troops from Afghanistan, says she doesn't think soldiers will give her a hard time and adds she's keeping an open mind about the mission.
End
 
Shame they can't see much.....

Shared in accordance with the "fair dealing" provisions, Section 29, of the Copyright Act.

(Canadian Press story below)

Commons defence committee confined to Kandahar Airfield
Doug Schmidt, CanWest News Service, 23 Jan 07
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KANDAHAR AIRFIELD, Afghanistan - A group of MPs charged with overseeing Canada’s mission in Afghanistan landed at Kandahar Airfield Tuesday to measure what progress is being made but was promptly told by its military hosts its three-day visit would be spent closeted inside the NATO base.

The eight members of the all-party Commons defence committee were told that, for security reasons, they wouldn’t be visiting any troops in the field, they couldn’t see first-hand any of the reconstruction efforts underway "outside the wire," and there were no plans for them to meet with any locals.  Instead, there would be plenty of in-camp briefings. 

"The limitations of where they can go have been directed by the minister," said their host, Brig.-Gen. Tim Grant, who is the commander of the 2,500 Canadian troops in Afghanistan. 

"We just hit the ground - perhaps that’s open to negotiation and change," said NDP defence critic Dawn Black upon arrival. 

Black said the committee had been told it could only leave the base by air and that helicopters might be made available. Grant didn’t reject that idea but told reporters Tuesday morning: "As it stands right now, aviation support is not available for this group."  He said security reasons prevented him from explaining why. 

"Suddenly we find out that the minister has ordered the general to not let us go outside of the wire because of safety. I thought the general makes that decision," said an angry Ujjal Dosanjh, the Liberal party’s foreign affairs critic.

Security was tight for the arrival of the delegation, whose members exited the Hercules in flak jackets and helmets ....



Commons defence committee to assess successes, failures in Afghan mission
MURRAY BREWSTER, Canadian Press, 23 Jan 07
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KANDAHAR, Afghanistan (CP) - Parliamentarians, replete with flak jackets and helmets, stepped off a military transport Tuesday looking as though they were ready for battle, but theirs will be the battle of the briefing room.

Eight members of the all-party Commons defence committee, charged with examining Canada's role in this war-torn country, are not expected to meet any local Afghan officials, nor set foot off Kandahar Airfield to view reconstruction projects.

Their assessment of the Conservative government's deepening involvement in this nasty guerrilla war, which could shape party positions in an anticipated spring election, will largely be based on a barrage of prearranged briefings and PowerPoint presentations from Canadian military and government officials.

They will, however, tour various facilities at the NATO base, including a recreational boardwalk, a cement factory, a newly installed banking machine and the hangout of soldiers, dubbed Canada House.

"We're not going to see much, but maybe that will change," New Democrat defence critic Dawn Black said of the itinerary.

Black, whose party has called for Canadian troops to be withdrawn from fighting militant Taliban forces, has asked to meet with Afghan officials.

"It's not on the itinerary, but we'll see," she said as she wrestled to get out of her bulletproof vest. "I've got a number of questions to ask them."

Among the questions she hopes to ask is whether Canadians are "truly making a difference for the lives of the men and women in Afghanistan" - something her party is skeptical about. In the Commons, the NDP has repeatedly accused the Conservative of being more interested in fighting a war than the humanitarian side of the mission.

Not allowing the committee outside the airfield was a decision of Defence Minister Gordon O'Connor, said Brig.-Gen Tim Grant, commander of Canadian troops in Afghanistan.

"The movements of the party, the limitations on where they can go, have been directed by the minister," he said.


While not expected to travel in convoys along the sometimes treacherous highways of Kandahar, other visiting dignitaries have been shuttled to different locations by U.S. helicopter, but Grant said given the pace of operations there isn't a lot of air transport to go around.

The military said it would try to find some helicopter time with the Americans, Dutch or British.

"If they could see the (reconstruction) projects, it would be an added bonus," said Grant. "There's no doubt about that.

The general conceded security was a concern, but refused to elaborate on the arrangements, suggesting reporters direct those questions to the minister's office ....



Canadian MPs miffed at Afghan travel curbs; minister says it's for safety
MURRAY BREWSTER, Canadian Press, 23 Jan 07
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....  O'Connor had informed committee members before they left Canada that any travel outside Kandahar Airfield must be by air because road transport is too dangerous, said Isabelle Bouchard, the minister's spokeswoman. She mentioned roadside bombs as one of the dangers.  "The people on the ground, they must request helicopter support because Canada does not own this kind of helicopter in theatre," she said in a telephone interview.  At the moment, none of the allies could provide helicopter transport because of operational factors, she said. "Maybe the opposition members would support our procurement in this process" so that Canada could get its own helicopters, she added.  She denied that the minister was blocking committee members from seeing Afghanistan. "On the contrary, the minister wants them alive and well, back next week in the House.  We were surprise to hear" their complaints, she said, "because they were well aware of what they were getting into."  While not expected to travel in convoys along the sometimes treacherous highways of Kandahar, other visiting dignitaries have been shuttled to different locations by U.S. helicopter ....

- edited to add CP stories -
 
I say send them to FOB's take them to the talks with the locals, since the NDP wants to negotiate, this is a perfect place for them to practice, lets see if they can distrube some aid without mucking it up.
 
Am I the only one thinking this bit from the Def Min's spokesperson was a bit of a political cheap shot?

"The people on the ground, they must request helicopter support because Canada does not own this kind of helicopter in theatre," she said in a telephone interview.  At the moment, none of the allies could provide helicopter transport because of operational factors, she said. "Maybe the opposition members would support our procurement in this process" so that Canada could get its own helicopters, she added.

I can't read minds, but it sounds a pretty political move to keep the committee CB'ed.  If it wasn't safe, why not just say it's not safe enough from the get-go, and NOT let them go?  There are others who haven't been allowed to go for "safety" reasons, so the precedent is set.  How much $ was spent to get this crowd there to tour Tim's and get PowerPoint overdose?
 
well.... we all know why we don't have any helicopter resources of our very own at this particular time.
Also... if the minister has told the TFA Cmdr not to let the ministers bully their way into getting rides beyond the wire - then it makes decisions real easy for TFA Cmdr.  He can say no and refer all questions to the MND ... after they get home.  In truth, he'll prolly work out a little something for everyone.
 
It looks like the situation changed while the party was enroute, one can hardly fault the MND with not having a premonition of the 10 deaths and the shooting that the party seems to arrived in the midst of the mop up. 
 
niner domestic said:
It looks like the situation changed while the party was enroute, one can hardly fault the MND with not having a premonition of the 10 deaths and the shooting that the party seems to arrived in the midst of the mop up. 

Possible - it would be interesting to know EXACTLY what the group was told before they left.  If we believe the quote from the Def Min's spokesperson (or, rather, the reporter's paraphrase) saying, "O'Connor had informed committee members before they left Canada that any travel outside Kandahar Airfield must be by air because road transport is too dangerous, said Isabelle Bouchard, the minister's spokeswoman," the group knew there were no guarantees, so the politicking is on THEIR side.

well.... we all know why we don't have any helicopter resources of our very own at this particular time.  Also... if the minister has told the TFA Cmdr not to let the ministers bully their way into getting rides beyond the wire - then it makes decisions real easy for TFA Cmdr.  He can say no and refer all questions to the MND ... after they get home.  In truth, he'll prolly work out a little something for everyone.

I have to wonder if the good TFA Cmdr would be willing to tell the Def Min, or the PM, that it's not safe enough to head into bandit country....

Since it was safe enough over Xmas for Tory MP's to get into the boonies, based on what I see so far, I remain to be convinced this isn't politically motivated. 

That said, I admit I don't know the exact security situation at any given moment (apart from what I read here or in the who-knows-how-close-to-reality MSM coverage), so I stand to be (gladly and humbly) corrected in any way that'll not compromise OPSEC.
 
On CBC news at 6 tonight they interviewed the Bloc member. He was going on about wanting to dress up as an Afghan and go out and distribute aid.....hey, bud, this ain't Halloween Apples!!
 
GAP said:
On CBC news at 6 tonight they interviewed the Bloc member. He was going on about wanting to dress up as an Afghan and go out and distribute aid.....hey, bud, this ain't Halloween Apples!!

Now THAT's outrageous - if he meant it (hell, even if he didn't), he's not exactly making the strongest case for the opposition being interested in realistically assessing things on the ground, is he?

Can you say, "own worst enemy"?
 
I guess it would be an endorsement of our troops abilities that these folks seem to feel that as long as they have us beside them whilst they ditty bop along, they are bullet proof. 
Give them an "invincible" G-Wagon, a map and a radio, raise the gate.  Cheers, baby!  For added safety, issue them baby blue helmets.  EVERYONE respects those!  ::)
 
zipperhead_cop said:
I guess it would be an endorsement of our troops abilities that these folks seem to feel that as long as they have us beside them whilst they ditty bop along, they are bullet proof. 
Give them an "invincible" G-Wagon, a map and a radio, raise the gate.  Cheers, baby!  For added safety, issue them baby blue helmets.  EVERYONE respects those!  ::)

sure... give em a ramp ceremony where one of theirs is the main guest & see how they react
 
zipperhead_cop said:
I guess it would be an endorsement of our troops abilities that these folks seem to feel that as long as they have us beside them whilst they ditty bop along, they are bullet proof. 
Give them an "invincible" G-Wagon, a map and a radio, raise the gate.  Cheers, baby!  For added safety, issue them baby blue helmets.  EVERYONE respects those!  ::)

I'm glad that you think enough of them to think that they can read maps  ;D
 
GAP said:
On CBC news at 6 tonight they interviewed the Bloc member. He was going on about wanting to dress up as an Afghan and go out and distribute aid.....hey, bud, this ain't Halloween Apples!!

That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard yet!  I'll put that one right next to all the celebrities who want to go "see for themselves what things are like".  As if their own star power can stop a war.  ::)
 
beach_bum said:
That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard yet!  I'll put that one right next to all the celebrities who want to go "see for themselves what things are like".  As if their own star power can stop a war.  ::) 

On this one, I have to disagree with you....

Sean Penn headed to Iraq to "report"?  Can't see much use.  People we elected (for better or worse) wanting to see the reality on the ground of a situation that's costing a lot of Canadian lives and money?  I think that's not unreasonable.

That said, the Bloc-boy who said he'd like to dress like a local to hand out aid doesn't make it EASY to defend politicians wanting to have a look....
 
They sure look like an alert bunch. Helmets askew, vests swallowing any resemblance of a human body. they kind of reminded me of walking thumbtacks. Best of all was the doe-eyed stare that implied absolute cluelessness and incomprehension. They should do very well for their respective party bosses while conveying the usual Canadian ignorance of anything military. Never mind sitting on the fence,these people are probably gratefull they don,t have to leave the the Compound at all.
 
Exarecr said:
They sure look like an alert bunch. Helmets askew, vests swallowing any resemblance of a human body. they kind of reminded me of walking thumbtacks. Best of all was the doe-eyed stare that implied absolute cluelessness and incomprehension. They should do very well for their respective party bosses while conveying the usual Canadian ignorance of anything military. Never mind sitting on the fence,these people are probably gratefull they don,t have to leave the the Compound at all.

Still can't beat the photo op of Jean Chrétien in Bosnia with his helmet on backwards (I didn`t know it would fit that way)
 
Exarecr said:
They sure look like an alert bunch. Helmets askew, vests swallowing any resemblance of a human body. they kind of reminded me of walking thumbtacks.

I don't know what happens before hand, but I see a lot of the clunkiness of the kit on such VIP's -- does anybody know what kind (if any) of briefing, or even guidance on how to wear eqpt, they may get before they hit the ground?

Best of all was the doe-eyed stare that implied absolute cluelessness and incomprehension. They should do very well for their respective party bosses while conveying the usual Canadian ignorance of anything military ....

Indeed - just for the record, here's the mix o' parties, to help track said cluelessness and incomprehension in later statements to the media....

Steven Blaney (Conservative)
Rick Casson (Conservative)
Cheryl Gallant (Conservative)


Carolyn Bennett (Liberal)
Joe McGuire (Liberal)
Ujjal Dosanjh (Liberal)


Dawn Black (NDP)

Claude Bachand (Bloc)

 
Even in a War Zone, Ujjal Dosanjh is an idiot.  Last night he was going on about "political interference" in their visit and the fact that they could not go outside of the wire.  In my opinion, they should turn their backs and let him take a stroll out the gate.  He can take Dawn Black along for company.  Let them go down to the local "Bus Station" and get on one of the 'buses' and go for a small 'tour'.  We would never hear the end of it, if they never came back.  The NDP and Liberals would not change their tunes, but they would accuse the rest of us (the Military and the Conservatives) with negligence.  You can't win with those twits.  We will always be wrong......it is how they try to BS the common folk.
 
More likely he wants to nip out and visit one of his relatives contracting jobsites to make sure the workers aren’t being to lazy. The best part is that he told that the airfare was one way, but the good news is that Timmies is hiring.  ;D
 
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