CPC Leadership Discussion 2020-21

[FJAG]

And when things level out, which they will invariably will, climate alarmists will find another windmill to tilt at.

Climate cooling? Winter is coming?

 

[FJAG]

And that's exactly why the Conservatives need a new leader.

The current incumbent can't do much about changing that brand in the eyes of the consumer....

The first step in changing the brand is admitting that it needs to change. He's been doing that and made it public in his speech to the convention. Let's give him more than a minute and see what he comes up with.

He wasn't my first choice either but so far he's impressed me with having more abilities then I originally gave him credit for.

 

[Halifax Tar]

The first step in changing the brand is admitting that it needs to change. He's been doing that and made it public in his speech to the convention. Let's give him more than a minute and see what he comes up with.

He wasn't my first choice either but so far he's impressed me with having more abilities then I originally gave him credit for.

I agree, I am not a O'Toole guy but hes trying to change the brand. The problem is the members of the party and divisions within.

The most popular personalities decided to take a pass on the party leadership this time around. Reasons and speculation abound as to why, but none of that matters now. We have who we have now and that's who we need to work with.

I can see now why Rona Ambrose didn't run. I would imagine she saw these divisions.

 

[Haggis]

My belief is that it will be extremely hard - if not impossible - to beat Trudeau in the next election and possibly the one after that. None of the popular personalities (Ambrose, Polievere) wanted to be the leader that presided over the inevitable defeat of the CPC. Maybe they are hoping to come back as the saviour of the post O'Toole CPC.

 

[ModlrMike]

My belief is that it will be extremely hard - if not impossible - to beat Trudeau in the next election and possibly the one after that. None of the popular personalities (Ambrose, Polievere) wanted to be the leader that presided over the inevitable defeat of the CPC. Maybe they are hoping to come back as the saviour of the post O'Toole CPC.

I'm not convinced. There is the very real possibility that the Liberals and NDP are going to try and "out left" each other. For example, I notice the NDP has proposed forgiveness of university tuition. In addition, the Liberals are going to hand down a budget soon. Someone will have to pay the tab for the 400BN we've spent, and it's going to be the middle class. It will be framed as a budget targeting the rich, but "rich" will be what the politicians define it as. Will the NDP support it? Who knows... it depends on what bones the Liberals throw them.

 

[LittleBlackDevil]

I'm not convinced. There is the very real possibility that the Liberals and NDP are going to try and "out left" each other. For example, I notice the NDP has proposed forgiveness of university tuition. In addition, the Liberals are going to hand down a budget soon. Someone will have to pay the tab for the 400BN we've spent, and it's going to be the middle class. It will be framed as a budget targeting the rich, but "rich" will be what the politicians define it as. Will the NDP support it? Who knows... it depends on what bones the Liberals throw them.

While this is certainly a possibility, perhaps even likely, I don't think anything will be enough to overcome the massive wave of support that will go Trudeau's way if Canadians are allowed outside to live relatively pre-COVID style lives. I have been predicting for a while a scenario similar to the New Zealand election, where they end lockdowns a month or so before election, the PM then campaigns on a "I let you have your freedom back" campaign and the majority of the people welcome said PM as a saviour and the Liberals ride to an historic election victory.

EDIT: And I don't see a CPC platform of "the federal government should have invoked the Emergencies Act and been EVEN MORE oppressive" during COVID is going to be a recipe with success. The CPC base won't like it, and it won't win over anyone who's just happy to be outside again.

 

[Weinie]

While this is certainly a possibility, perhaps even likely, I don't think anything will be enough to overcome the massive wave of support that will go Trudeau's way if Canadians are allowed outside to live relatively pre-COVID style lives. I have been predicting for a while a scenario similar to the New Zealand election, where they end lockdowns a month or so before election, the PM then campaigns on a "I let you have your freedom back" campaign and the majority of the people welcome said PM as a saviour and the Liberals ride to an historic election victory.

EDIT: And I don't see a CPC platform of "the federal government should have invoked the Emergencies Act and been EVEN MORE oppressive" during COVID is going to be a recipe with success. The CPC base won't like it, and it won't win over anyone who's just happy to be outside again.

Watch for the "poison pill" goodies in the upcoming budget, many of which will be designed to enhance the LPC as committed to Canadians, while forcing the CPC to take a stance, either fiscal responsibility to appease the base, or concurrence to attempt to retain/sway voters

 

[Quirky]

For example, I notice the NDP has proposed forgiveness of university tuition.

The liberals will throw in some UBI and dental coverage to buy off the NDP. Canada is a nation of freeloaders who attracts narcissists who aren't capable of achievement. This pandemic has shown only one thing - Canadians support free socialist payment from government for doing absolutely nothing. CPC doesn't stand a chance.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I'm going to wait until they present their climate plan and platform before rushing to judgement. I'll admit, I didn't vote for O'Toole in the race. I voted for Lewis. However, pending the details, I'm willing to dance with the one what brung me.

 

[FJAG]

I'm going to wait until they present their climate plan and platform before rushing to judgement. I'll admit, I didn't vote for O'Toole in the race. I voted for Lewis. However, pending the details, I'm willing to dance with the one what brung me.

I didn't vote for Lewis, but watched her during the convention as one of the two masters of ceremony. Was more impressed by her after that than previously.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Some detailed proposals for mitigating specific environmental externalities would be better than a "climate plan", since "plan" in the mind of politicians and journalists is often misused in place of "aim" - a nebulous statement of good intentions and wishes.

 

[daftandbarmy]

The liberals will throw in some UBI and dental coverage to buy off the NDP. Canada is a nation of freeloaders who attracts narcissists who aren't capable of achievement. This pandemic has shown only one thing - Canadians support free socialist payment from government for doing absolutely nothing. CPC doesn't stand a chance.

So, like, does that include everyone, or just people like me, eh?

 

[Loachman]

Leslyn Lewis was my top pick. She had clear, well-thought-out policies and the most positive vision of the lot.

Watching the woke left criticize her would also have been deliciously entertaining.

She has a Youtube channel, but hasn't posted anything in a while.

I thought that Erin O'Toole would have been alright, but am underwhelmed and growing even less whelmed as time passes.

I see little difference between his ideas and Liberal ones. Those that find his ideas attractive will be unlikely to find them attractive enough to draw them away from Trudeau, and many of those who want to vote for a conservative leader will not bother to vote or will vote PPC.

His poll ratings are not trending well, and are likely dragging the Party's ratings down with them.

Given Trudeau's growing mountain of blunders, failures, and scandals, this should be an easy electoral win for the Conservatives. Instead, I expect a significant loss of seats.

And another leadership campaign to follow shortly afterwards.

Maybe we'll finally get it right then.

 

[LittleBlackDevil]

Leslyn Lewis was my top pick. She had clear, well-thought-out policies and the most positive vision of the lot.

Watching the woke left criticize her would also have been deliciously entertaining.

She has a Youtube channel, but hasn't posted anything in a while.

I thought that Erin O'Toole would have been alright, but am underwhelmed and growing even less whelmed as time passes.

I see little difference between his ideas and Liberal ones. Those that find his ideas attractive will be unlikely to find them attractive enough to draw them away from Trudeau, and many of those who want to vote for a conservative leader will not bother to vote or will vote PPC.

His poll ratings are not trending well, and are likely dragging the Party's ratings down with them.

Given Trudeau's growing mountain of blunders, failures, and scandals, this should be an easy electoral win for the Conservatives. Instead, I expect a significant loss of seats.

And another leadership campaign to follow shortly afterwards.

Maybe we'll finally get it right then.

I agree with pretty much everything you've written here, although I have zero optimism that the CPC will finally get it right after a crushing defeat next election. I hope I'm wrong, but the CPC seems much more likely to go for an even redder Red Tory because they seem to think that it's conservatives that is losing them elections rather than the things you've outlined.

I thought O'Toole was going to be much better and he started out okay, but like you I've been very underwhelmed. VERY underwhelmed.

At this point I am among those who "want to vote for a conservative leader" and will "not bother to vote or will vote PPC". I am heavily leaning towards voting PPC as a protest vote rather than abstaining.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I think the party is dead, schism anyone ?

Leslyn Lewis is a SoCon ... That's never going to win in this country. No matter what her other platform stances are those SoCon values will keep her from ever winning the PM seat.

 

[Good2Golf]

Perhaps the CPC is in the process of dissolving into its Reform and PC components, and we’ll have to wait and see how things go from there?

 

[Brad Sallows]

The fundamental problem is that the CPC has to be different than the LPC, and in ways which are seen as either progressive (useful changes not the same as the hockey sock of changes proposed by the LPC or NDP) or corrective (fix sh!t the LPC didn't do very well or should not have done). Corrective change can't look regressive.

 

[LittleBlackDevil]

I think the party is dead, schism anyone ?

Leslyn Lewis is a SoCon ... That's never going to win in this country. No matter what her other platform stances are those SoCon values will keep her from ever winning the PM seat.

In my view Andrew Scheer didn't lose because he was a SoCon, it was because he ran a very poor campaign. Even so he still came close. I think that a capable, confident, compassional SoCon could win an election and I think Leslyn Lewis would fit that bill. That said, I think many SoCons would settle for someone like Harper who isn't a SoCon but is tolerant of SoCons.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Scheer took the popular vote but lost in the riding race with the Grand Duchy of Toronto giving most of it's seats to trudeau. Lost due to gerrymandering.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Scheer took the popular vote but lost in the riding race with the Grand Duchy of Toronto giving most of it's seats to trudeau. Lost due to gerrymandering.

That's a pretty bold claim; Scheer was personnally quite unpopular anywhere east of Manitoba and had a pretty pro-Alberta platform.

They change the ridings all the time and they still tend to go back and forth between the Liberals and NDP throughout the entire golden horseshoe. Generally they stay liberal strongholds unless you get a really strong candidate from another party, and even when the Liberals were wiped out across most of the country they still won seats in that area.

Gerrymandering is a pretty weak excuse for long term poor performance, not backed up by any actual evidence. We don't have the same political interference in the Elections Canada process that you see regularly in the US.