'Did we push her too much?' Article on Major Michelle Mendes

[54/102 CEF]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/did-we-push-her-too-much/article1190591/

Any comments?

 

[dustinm]

In 2003, despite roaring academic success, she so struggled with battlefield artillery training that she left the trade.

I probably sound very ignorant here, but is there a lot of academics involved in Artillery Officering?

When she landed at the airfield in mid-April, she was set to become the inaugural operations officer at the Kandahar Intelligence Fusion Centre, or KIF-C, the international unit tasked with providing intelligence for the most volatile six southern provinces. The prestigious position had been offered to Canada by NATO for the first time just six weeks before, giving the nation a seat at an important table.

Can you turn down such an appointment, if you feel you're not ready? Perhaps it was a bad judgement call on Major Mendes' part.

Some other interesting parts:

But when she went for the final leg of her [Artillery] training – Phase 4 it's called – she'd been away from the field for 18 months

Still, with the help of Capt. Okros and others, she ultimately won a spot at intelligence. As one retired colonel who went to bat for her said to the branch brass, “Why miss the chance at this gem?

 

[FastEddy]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/did-we-push-her-too-much/article1190591/

Any comments?

Not to sound Harsh or Disrespectfull, "But if you can't stand the Heat, Get out of the Kitchen".

The article I imagine is to sound informative but leans to far towards Canonization.

Thankfully, any error in her assessment, reasoning or judgement was not conveyed to Field Troops which could have been Disastrous considering her Mental state.

Did we push her to hard, isn't that the name of the game.
She wanted the job, she got the job.

For what ever reason, its tragic that this young woman found it necessary to take her life, but speculating and trying to Analise on Hindsight IMO is only self serving.

Leave Maj Mendes rest in peace among the long list of others who chose to Serve their Country.

 

[dapaterson]

To the contrary - we have to look at such incidents and determine , to the best of our abilities, the why, so we can try to prevent it in the future.

 

[The Bread Guy]

To the contrary - we have to look at such incidents and determine , to the best of our abilities, the why, so we can try to prevent it in the future.

Here here, with the following caveat:  All we read isn't necessarily all there is to know in ANY situation, this included.

While the loss of a loved one is horrible in any circumstance, here's hoping Major Mendes' family can eventually move through the pain of this complicated grief....

 

[gaspasser]

Not meaning to sound disrespectful, but wasn't Maj. Ruckpaul also a INT O in KAF who committed suicide?  I had heard that he had told the Social work office that he didn't want to go and that it would be his 3rd+ tour and he would suicide because he had nothing left to give, if they sent him?  It sounds like being an INT O in KAF is not a good thing.  :2c:
My deepest regards to the families of both officers who gave all for the many. 


:yellow:

 

[dustinm]

Not meaning to sound disrespectful, but wasn't Maj. Ruckpaul also a INT O in KAF who committed suicide?

http://www.thespec.com/printArticle/253926

Ruckpaul, who began his military career with the Royal Hamilton Light Infantry (RHLI) and was serving as an armoured officer

 

[PMedMoe]

Maj Ruckpaul was in Kabul, not KAF, IIRC.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Maj Ruckpaul was in Kabul, not KAF, IIRC.

You recall correctly...
http://www.forces.gc.ca/site/news-nouvelles/view-news-afficher-nouvelles-eng.asp?id=2463

During the early morning of August 29, Major Raymond Ruckpaul was found suffering from the wound in his living quarters located within the secure compound of the ISAF Headquarters in Kabul.

 

[bradlupa]

Living in Northumberland County and close to Grafton as this young woman made her trip down the highway of heros the termendous amout of people on the side of the road and or the bridges was astounding.

 

[chris_log]

After skimming the article, I get the impression that Maj Mendes was very much a Type A personality.  She appears to have taken on far too much in too little time and may have wanted to deployment only because it was a requirement for advancement in her career.

Some pretty judgemental comments coming from people who've never met Maj Mendes (in case you're wondering, I did and a number of people I know worked with her).

Your comments are completely off base. And ignorant. And offensive.

Edit: to highlight the comment I take issue with. This site usually dimisses most media articles about the CF as being full of BS (as they usually are) but suddenly this article is treated with an air of legitimacy (by some posters). It's unfair to comment that an abitious young officer (or NCM/NCO, it doesn't matter) takes a tour just to advance their career, especially when the person is now dead.

 

[54/102 CEF]

As for how the article should be a wake-up call, how so?  What do you mean, absolutely no CF comments?  Are you talking from people like us on the G&M site, or official reps?  Perhaps in order to respect the family of the deceased they felt it only prudent to react the same as they would for any other death in theatre immediately after the incident.

No comments on the would have, should have, could have variety we saw in the Christie Blatchford article. I think she throws out her high standards with this article.

 

[Strike]

No comments on the would have, should have, could have variety we saw in the Christie Blatchford article. I think she throws out her high standards with this article.

Hind sight is 20/20.  Commenting on the would have et al in the sense of this article would have defeated the purpose, which seems to have been simply to tell the story of Maj Mendes.

I have no doubt that the questions are being asked within the medical and training community on how to avert such a thing from happening in the future.  I also have no doubt that her superiors, friends and family are all questioning themselves as to whether they should have seen something or maybe pushed her too far.

In the aviation community it's said that very step in the red pages of a check list is there because someone died by doing something different. (Not an actual fact, but you get the point.)  Let's hope that the right people are rehashing their own checklists with what they've learned in this event.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Now, for a bit more of the rest of the story, the family's letter to the Globe:

.... We remain concerned that those who had only tangential involvement with Mic have chosen to speculate about issues of which they have incomplete knowledge. We believe that they and/or you have taken isolated snippets of information out of context to opine that some ignored issues and placed her career and the mission in Afghanistan ahead of her well being. Our conclusion reading your letter is that you are seeking a rational explanation for an irrational act and have decided to portray a vulnerable person pushed into crisis. We strongly encourage you to do more research to understand the more accepted explanations for these events and to avoid perpetuating unfounded views. This letter is provided in the hope that you will opt to provide a factual retelling of the amazing joy, hope and inspiration cast by how Mic lived rather than speculation on the manner in which her flame went out. We do not believe your readers would be well served by conjecture that lacks a factual basis and we know that Mic deserves better than that ....

 

[dustinm]

Some pretty judgemental comments coming from people who've never met Maj Mendes (in case you're wondering, I did and a number of people I know worked with her).

Your comments are completely off base. And ignorant. And offensive.

Edit: to highlight the comment I take issue with. This site usually dimisses most media articles about the CF as being full of BS (as they usually are) but suddenly this article is treated with an air of legitimacy (by some posters)

I don't think the article is really about the CF, as much as it is the life of Major Mendes. It seems pretty clear to me that she showed a pattern of going "above and beyond the call of duty", and took on more than some people (including herself) may have been able to handle.

I would consider it due diligence to regularly assess yourself to make sure you're really capable of functioning effectively in your work environment, whatever it may be, and perhaps Major Mendes made a poor judgement call about what she was able to handle in light of the fact that a deployment (as the article mentioned and I suppose others can prove/disprove) improves one's career opportunities.

Edit: I really should start taking those "someone replied while you were reading" warnings more serious; consider the above conjecture, and take it with a grain of factual salt.

 

[PMedMoe]

Some pretty judgemental comments coming from people who've never met Maj Mendes (in case you're wondering, I did and a number of people I know worked with her).

Your comments are completely off base. And ignorant. And offensive.

Edit: to highlight the comment I take issue with. This site usually dimisses most media articles about the CF as being full of BS (as they usually are) but suddenly this article is treated with an air of legitimacy (by some posters). It's unfair to comment that an abitious young officer (or NCM/NCO, it doesn't matter) takes a tour just to advance their career, especially when the person is now dead.

Note the words may and appears in my statement.  That is why it's called an opinion and not fact.  I have no wish to disparage Maj Mendes, unlike the article that wants to disparage the CF system. 

Here's another article running along the same lines:

Mental Health and the Military: A soldier's descent

Edit to add:  How can you be so certain I never met Maj Mendes?

 

[vonGarvin]

MODS:

Should this thread be split?  EG: from the majority of the thread that discusses Maj Mendes as an ad hoc "in memorium" to one that comments on the Globe Article?

 

[1feral1]

I did not know this woman, hell, she ws not even of driving age when I left the CF. That being said, over the past 33 years I will say that I have known a number of male CF members who have taken their own lives (and one female former soldier). All took their lives with firearms, shy of two (hangers). Some were comissioned, some were not.

There was obviously some internal struggle going on inside her, and she chose to end that on her terms, and for reasons we truly will not ever know. We must all remember its still a tragedy for her family and friends. A death is still a death.

I choose to let this person RIP no matter what the circumstances are/were. I don't think any of us should even attempt to analyse her death on an open public forum.

OWDU

 

[mariomike]

"Suicide in the Canadian Forces":
http://www.forces.gc.ca/site/news-nouvelles/view-news-afficher-nouvelles-eng.asp?id=2870

 

[George Wallace]

My personal feeling on this:

I think that unless you are a commander (at any level) or a member of a A/G/J/N 2 or 3 Staff, and understand the meaning of "Consequences of Error" and its affects on their mental health as individuals, you shouldn't be commenting.  None of us are SMEs on the issues of mental health, and idle speculation only compounds the problem.