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Drug use by Iraqi Insurgents

'You sure you're a coach?  You seem to be missing an awful lot here.  I am sure you picked that quote for some reason other than argumentative.  It doesn't have any relevance to Military rounds, nor Police rounds; if you would have read the whole post. 
 
paracowboy said:
not too mention the use of drugs to enstill fanatical courage and dull pain by forces around the globe, and dating back millenia. The Moros tribesmen in the Phillipines, the Mau Mau and Simbas of Africa, the Chinese in Korea.

Bring 'em home indeed. Once they have achieved their Aim.
Good comeback. By that argument we should be issuing the troops Pot, so they can come down from all the "Speed" we're making them take!
 
coachron said:
So it is good practice generally to shoot the person in the head?  It must be kind of hard to do that.

As with anything practice makes perfect. Anything that is hard to do; well, requires practice.  :eek:

Dude, honestly, what's your purpose here? Argument for arguments sake? Nothing that I wrote states enjoyment of killing, etc. I see myself as a professional, are you?
 
Wound Ballistics

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=273976


If you want some definietive stuff on terminal effects - go to tactical forums www.tacticalforums.com and look sup the terminal effect forum - moderated by Dr Gary K Roberts (L/Cdr USNR)


77gr Mk262 ammunition works a lot better than M855/C77 in soft targets
Kevin113.jpg


Kevin115.jpg


I had some gel shots of it - but I think they are on my home computer

Anyway follow the links.




As far as the drug use goes - who cares -- two in the heart, one in the mind  ;D  


 
George Wallace said:
'You sure you're a coach?  You seem to be missing an awful lot here.  I am sure you picked that quote for some reason other than argumentative.  It doesn't have any relevance to Military rounds, nor Police rounds; if you would have read the whole post.   
[/quote



I can speak to that. coachron was my coach.! one of the most insightful hockey minds you will meet! taught me everything I know about the game!
 
C and P said:
I can speak to that. coachron was my coach.! one of the most insightful hokey minds you will meet! taught me everything I know about the game!

Well that explains it!  Hokey minds don't usually have a clear picture of what is going on.  It takes a clear mind to do that.  If you are the least bit hokey, you should stay home, and not risk injuring yourself.
 
Wouldn't drug use prevent them from obtaining peace in the big "12 virgin orgy in the sky"?
 
George Wallace said:
Well that explains it!  Hokey minds don't usually have a clear picture of what is going on.  It takes a clear mind to do that.  If you are the least bit hokey, you should stay home, and not risk injuring yourself.
Ha ha! Good point!*&^% typing skills!
 
Kev I think you just added a "hole" new meaning to the term "Hearts and Minds Campaign" well done :D
 
Enzo said:
As with anything practice makes perfect. Anything that is hard to do; well, requires practice.  :eek:

Dude, honestly, what's your purpose here? Argument for arguments sake? Nothing that I wrote states enjoyment of killing, etc. I see myself as a professional, are you?

When it comes to killing, argument for argument's sake is not such a bad thing. 
 
HitorMiss said:
Kev I think you just added a hole new meaning to the term "Hearts and Minds Campaign" well done :D

Considering he was talking about wound characteristics .... 
 
LOL -- well actually a buddy - ex MARINE FAST guy, has used that one before - so I cant lay claim to the that.

Coachron - actually wrt killing - you had better figured out that a long before you got your selvf in that postion  - decisions take time - time you dont have.
  Boyd's loop / OODA loop - every action path added doubles your reaction time -- so have a analytical debate on shooting someone is a BAD idea.


 
C and P said:
Good comeback. By that argument we should be issuing the troops Pot, so they can come down from all the "Speed" we're making them take!

OK, explain that one. Who's troops, what 'Speed'?

 
Were getting Speed now? how come I was never issued any... maybe they put it in my water...man and here I thought all my enegery and keeness was coming from my desire to be a better soldier  ::)
 
coachron said:
So it is good practice generally to shoot the person in the head?  It must be kind of hard to do that.

I was in a rush earlier and had to leave. I'm home now and I have to say, I've been stewing about you for awhile now. I took the time to respond to "your" request for clarification and you chose to focus on that one aspect of my reply. Honestly, you didn't answer, what is your purpose here? If you want to debate killing: moral, amoral, legal or ethical reasons for doing so. Then there are other threads, other mediums. If you have a point that you'd like to make, then take your time and make it, as I did for you. The main reason why I'm taking more time now is for the other people who may read this in the hope that they will have a greater understand of the processes involved in regards to the issue of taking down a combatant who may be on stimulants. That and to show that life isn't as simple as you may think that it is. There is a reason for the training and the use of weapons in the military that civilians and non-combat arms personnel may not realise. I responded technically to your query. I decided to leave emotion out of it. I have some personal feelings about the taking of life, but that isn't the topic of this thread so I am choosing to remain on topic. It isn't my wish to proselytize to anyone, but to hopefully inform if I am able. In regards to this once again so that I am perfectly clear; is it good practice to shoot someone in the head? Of course, if that person is trying to do the same thing to you. Is it hard? Technically, it's a matter of a few to the chest and then slowly working up. Psychologically, I haven't had to do so and I don't think I'll have to worry about it this year; but if it is a situation I'm going to place myself in next year, then I will rely upon my training to carry me through. Would it be better to shoot them in the knees so that they fall down in pain, crippled, and decline further attempts to fight? Of course, assuming that they are able to register pain - hence the topic of this thread. Since there are no guarantees in life, that is why the training is as it is. To ensure that you live. It's really as simple as that.

coachron said:
When it comes to killing, argument for argument's sake is not such a bad thing.

Arguing for the sake of arguing, we don't tolerate that in children. Why should any of us have to here? Apparently, you are old enough to know better. If you want to begin a topic of debate, then do so. Take your time, state yourself and then lets see where it goes.

I read your posts. I wondered why you would choose to include a famous photograph of a napalm bombing in Vietnam? You know that war is over correct? You have issues with what you perceive to be propaganda and it's use to dehumanize the combatants that oppose US Forces in Iraq. Honestly, I won't argue that with you, psyops have been going on since before I was born. If that is what you chose to take away from that program, then that is your prerogative. However, what does that have to do with the issue of drugs being used by these combatants? US personnel use drugs as well: coffee, tobacco, pharmaceuticals, alcohol and who knows what else. Drug use is pervasive, we get that. How is that propaganda? Why not start a thread about that (after doing a search to ensure that another thread hasn't already covered it?)?

Finally: murder, death, killing. I'm going to assume that you're against all of those things. Well, here's what you do. You perform your duty as a Canadian citizen and write to: your MP, your MLA, your senator, the Min of DND, the PM and anyone else who has a responsibility to listen to you. Become involved in a campaign against international war, war in general, the clubbing of seals, Celine Dion and anything else that upsets you. Once you've accomplished that, then come back and we'll talk. In the meantime, know this. The Canadian Forces set about the tasks that the Executive initiates for them. The job is to conduct said tasking as professionally as possible within the mandate that is prescribed. Simple. The taking of human life may fall under this via the ROEs (Rules of Engagement) and if it does, so be it. If you want to debate the morality of the taking of life by the CF, you aren't debating a thing; but the people, those professionals who choose to sacrifice in order to ensure that you have the freedom, safety and ability to do so.

Cheers...

P.S.
Infidel, quite the scope for such a short barrel eh?
 
Enzo -- Schmitt and Bender Short Dot 1.1-4x -- allows me to shoot the people I need to without accidentally wacking the wrong guys
  Kinda like a Aimpoint and a ACOG rolled into one.
 
Infidel - Schmitt and Bender Short Dot 1.1-4x eh. Not cheap by any means, but I like the versatility. Your barrel seems short (CQB), you have a longer upper also?
 
Enzo said:
Infidel - Schmitt and Bender Short Dot 1.1-4x eh. Not cheap by any means, but I like the versatility. Your barrel seems short (CQB), you have a longer upper also?

Yeah a few  ;D

But in a pinch at 4x the 10" can drop stuff at ~400m
 
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