Duties and Responsibilities of a junior Corporal

[dutchie]

and crap....and crap

well, I can already you what your 'word whisker' is.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

I wouldn't say I'm junior but my roles for this month are wpns guy as well as stores for admin coy.  I have to place orders as well as pick them up.  I am the CQ for this month.  I am the representative for Adm HQ with regards to the welfare committiee and I'm am tasked with helping plan the Xmas party for my coy.  I must also t up with the QMSI/DCO in regards to the grand opening of the new building and what they will need from HQ.  I have to handle day to day problems. I also have to attend the coy o groups as well as attend the BN A & Q where I sit at the foot of the table surrounded by Coy 2 i/c's as well as other CQ's (which I might add could be a bit overwhelming).

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Which is why we always try to train two up. 

 

[pbi]

I wouldn't say I'm junior but my roles for this month are wpns guy as well as stores for admin coy. I have to place orders as well as pick them up. I am the CQ for this month. I am the representative for Adm HQ with regards to the welfare committiee and I'm am tasked with helping plan the Xmas party for my coy. I must also t up with the QMSI/DCO in regards to the grand opening of the new building and what they will need from HQ. I have to handle day to day problems. I also have to attend the coy o groups as well as attend the BN A & Q where I sit at the foot of the table surrounded by Coy 2 i/c's as well as other CQ's (which I might add could be a bit overwhelming).

Good on you, CFL: you are an example of what we typically expect from our junior soldiers. The fact that guys like you can take this in your stride is, IMHO, one of the qualities that offsets some of our weaknesses.

Which is why we always try to train two up.

And long may we remember that. As I have ranted before, IMHO we need to identify potential leaders in recruit trg, and develop them from there. Matt Fisher.....my understanding of the Crucible USMC recruit training system (I visited Lejeuene and Pendleton in 1997/98 and saw Crucible under way) is that it has this focus. Can you enlighten us? Cheers.

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

"Good on you, CFL: you are an example of what we typically expect from our junior soldiers."



Seriously though that xmas party is more intensive then I thought.  Esp when you have to factor in DD and liabilty etc. and how to get everyone home safely.

 

[dglad]

Without good Cpls, we're dead in the water as an army.  Now, I suppose that could be said about any rank, but Cpl is the "proving ground" for our junior leadership, which is where the rubber meets the road leadership-wise.  In our current less-than-effective DP system, it's (unreasonably) difficult to produce MCpls, and therefore Sgts, etc.  We count on our Cpls to be our first line of leadership.  And, frankly, it's been that way for a long time, Reg and Res F.  In the Res, in fact, where units are small and cohesion has to be built on one parade night a week and occasional weekends, Cpls are often the glue that holds the unit together.  Want to get the troops out for an event?  Motivate the Cpls...and especially those few, key, "hard-core" Cpls that act as the pivotal informal group leaders.

I also find that by watching Cpls perform, I can begin to see future Snr NCOs and, in some cases, Officers.  And few things are more pleasant than watching a young soldier, full of P & V, turn into a dynamic and effective leader.

 

[pbi]

True, dglad, true. And I do agree that we need to re-look the DP system, particularly as it pertains to producing the Section-level NCOs: we may be strangling ourselves (actually, I think we are....) Cheers.

 

[rounder]

I always give my newly promoted corporals that same comment "anyone can be a corporal in the Army... but not everyone can be a good one, which will you be?"

 

[PPCLI Guy]

I always give my newly promoted corporals that same comment "anyone can be a corporal in the Army... but not everyone can be a good one, which will you be?"

That's great - I may use that...

 

[Pencil Tech]

I just have to say that this discussion is really great for me to read as I just got promoted Corporal and really appreciate the chance to read all your submissions. Please keep this one going!

 

[Infanteer]

Without good Cpls, we're dead in the water as an army. Now, I suppose that could be said about any rank, but Cpl is the "proving ground" for our junior leadership, which is where the rubber meets the road leadership-wise. In our current less-than-effective DP system, it's (unreasonably) difficult to produce MCpls, and therefore Sgts, etc. We count on our Cpls to be our first line of leadership. And, frankly, it's been that way for a long time, Reg and Res F. In the Res, in fact, where units are small and cohesion has to be built on one parade night a week and occasional weekends, Cpls are often the glue that holds the unit together. Want to get the troops out for an event? Motivate the Cpls...and especially those few, key, "hard-core" Cpls that act as the pivotal informal group leaders.

I also find that by watching Cpls perform, I can begin to see future Snr NCOs and, in some cases, Officers. And few things are more pleasant than watching a young soldier, full of P & V, turn into a dynamic and effective leader.

Wouldn't it be fair to say that you could do the same with a "switched-on" private.  I've noticed that having two ranks (Pte/Cpl) for one position (Rifleman/Crewman/etc) often leads to seniority moving to the fore - hard-charging privates are relegated to the support because a guy who has an extra year on him (and thus got a second hook) is delegated to a leadership role, despite the fact that he may be a complete boob.

"Hmm, this needs to be done; Cpl X, take these privates and sort it out."

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

It all gets sorted out in the wash.  If Cpl X is a glue bag and private y is switched on the masses will follow the pte.

 

[Spr.Earl]

It all gets sorted out in the wash.   If Cpl X is a glue bag and private y is switched on the masses will follow the pte.

Also higher finds out very quickly to.

 

[pbi]

This discussion reminds of a book I read a few years ago, written by a US Army officer. It was one of those "military advice" books that the US PXs carry quite a selection of. Had a lot of good ideas in it. Anyway, the author described a situation in which the First Sgt (=Cdn "CSM") he had been assigned was useless. As OC, he selected the sharpest of his Sgts First Class (=Cdn "Pl WO") and made him the "Field First" or "unofficial CSM". The "real" CSM was shunted into the office to do paperwork. What do folks think about that course of action, when confronted with a useless senior subordinate? (Personally, I can't imagine this happening in one of our units-the RSM would be all over it in a second....) Cheers.

 

[rounder]

(Personally, I can't imagine this happening in one of our units-the RSM would be all over it in a second....) Cheers.

  I guess the comand sgt major (RSM) was a glue bag too...

 

[dglad]

This discussion reminds of a book I read a few years ago, written by a US Army officer. It was one of those "military advice" books that the US PXs carry quite a selection of. Had a lot of good ideas in it. Anyway, the author described a situation in which the First Sgt (=Cdn "CSM") he had been assigned was useless. As OC, he selected the sharpest of his Sgts First Class (=Cdn "Pl WO") and made him the "Field First" or "unofficial CSM". The "real" CSM was shunted into the office to do paperwork. What do folks think about that course of action, when confronted with a useless senior subordinate? (Personally, I can't imagine this happening in one of our units-the RSM would be all over it in a second....) Cheers.

I don't like it, frankly...it's just dodging the problem, and potentially allowing this guy to end up darkening somebody else's doorstep.  I've always hated what I call the "Special Projects Officer" syndrome--to wit, when you encounter someone with this title, they are either a) actually a Special Projects Officer, with a special project that needs to be done or b) a rations-sink who has been shunted into the job to get him/her out of the way.  Unfortunately, the ratio of a) to b) isn't, in my experience, very high.  Making someone a SPO, or equivalent, is abrogating the responsibity to develop the individual (or, in an extreme case, take action to employ him/her differently, or not at all).  Worse, in the above case, some poor 1st Sgt ended up with a second job to do, because the nominal CSM couldn't do it...and yet, the "real" guy was still around and able to pee in this 1st Sgt's pool. 

The OC should have started a process, in consultation with the RSM (or US equiv), of counselling and development (and documentation) of this guy's shortcomings, with a view to improving his performance, or building a case to turf him.

 

[Michael Dorosh]

This discussion reminds of a book I read a few years ago, written by a US Army officer. It was one of those "military advice" books that the US PXs carry quite a selection of. Had a lot of good ideas in it. Anyway, the author described a situation in which the First Sgt (=Cdn "CSM") he had been assigned was useless. As OC, he selected the sharpest of his Sgts First Class (=Cdn "Pl WO") and made him the "Field First" or "unofficial CSM". The "real" CSM was shunted into the office to do paperwork. What do folks think about that course of action, when confronted with a useless senior subordinate? (Personally, I can't imagine this happening in one of our units-the RSM would be all over it in a second....) Cheers.

Field First is a very old tradition in the US Army, and though it may be unofficial, I am led to believe the practice was widespread by at least the Second World War.  I don't think it is a reaction to incompetents, but rather, a generally accepted way of easing the load of the First Sergeant.  From the research I did for a website on ranks and responsibilities during the Second World War:

Apparently, a common practice was to designate one of the Platoon Sergeants (generally a staff sergeant) as "Field First Sergeant".  The Field First would act as First Sergeant in his absence, or assist him with his duties as needed, with a squad leader taking over his Platoon Sergeant duties.  This Field First was generally the senior platoon sergeant in the company, but this unofficial appointment was at the discretion of the company commander and could go to any of the platoon sergeants.

Note that this was "at the discretion of the company commander".  Quite possible it was used in the situation you described, but apparently it had the blessing of "the system."  Did the Americans have the equivalent of an RSM (Battalion First Sergeant?)

 

[pbi]

Michael: My distinct impression (I no longer have the book, unfortunately...) was that he made the change because of a weak CSM. And, yes, there is a Battalion Command Sgt Maj (CSM) in the US Army. There is a CSM at every level from Bn up, pretty much as  we have. Cheers.