Freedom Convoy protests [Split from All things 2019-nCoV]

[Humphrey Bogart]

OK this made me mad. I did not choose to layoff people, I had too. I did not close my doors I was told to! I was ordered to check everyone coming for their medical records, oh its a nice QR code now. I didn't want to have 400 people lose their jobs I had too. Plus more to come. Oh guess it was a choice but not a real one.

I have watched my kids schooling go to shit. My marriage on rocky grounds. The choice of laying off people! I so beyond upset with the protected government and civil service workers who in most part have had the least impact of this pandemic. My wife being an RN on the "frontline" will even acknowledge this fact.

I have spend the capital of an almost 80 year old business to stay afloat. Hundreds of employees lives changed.

And yes I am mad.

Some common sense!

The Government will break your legs, give your
a pair of crappy wooden crutches then tell you to be grateful for giving you the crutches without acknowledging that they were the ones who broke your legs, much less even apologizing for it.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Some common sense!

The Government will break your legs, give your
a pair of crappy wooden crutches then tell you to be grateful for giving you the crutches without acknowledging that they were the ones who broke your legs, much less even apologizing for it.

And break your arms if you don't accept their crutches

 

[QV]

if this group would go home and have regional meetings and pick candidates in the next federal election to back they would be a super power to deal with.

They have proven the fundraising power they can amass. Yes I know Elections Canada has strict rules on fund raising. But no political party seems to be able to fund raise this kind of money on weekend. They could put their war chest behind select candidates and get their people elected. Only problem is some of their leadership is Anti-Canada and that might pose problems if they retain membership in the west exit party.

This group as united Canadians on 3 coasts on both sides of the fight.

So much for a fringe minority of racists, eh?

Some of their leadership could be considered “not anti-Alberta“ as opposed to “anti-Canada”…this is debatable.

 

[Haggis]

You're right, they don't have to, but what happens when 10K turns into 20K, 100K, or 1 million.

Or 2.2 million?

 

[Altair]

So much for a fringe minority of racists, eh?

Some of their leadership could be considered “not anti-Alberta“ as opposed to “anti-Canada”…this is debatable.

The point remains, where would this money and fundraising power do the most good for their cause?

Maverick party, PPC or CPC?

And could the convoy people come to a rational conclusion on that?

 

[The Bread Guy]

... They have proven the fundraising power they can amass. Yes I know Elections Canada has strict rules on fund raising. But no political party seems to be able to fund raise this kind of money on weekend ...

Well, if the Attornies General of at least Texas and Florida are concerned about their folks getting ripped off by GFM on this one, while the grand total is big, can't tell how much of that is homegrown dollars.

if this group would go home and have regional meetings and pick candidates in the next federal election to back they would be a super power to deal with ...

It WOULD be interesting to see how protest would translate into political power. To grossly oversimplify, though, if you look at historical insurgencies (no I don't think THIS is anywhere close to that, just making a general analogy), not all groups good at protesting and opposing the government made transitions into governing.

 

[QV]

The point remains, where would this money and fundraising power do the most good for their cause?

Maverick party, PPC or CPC?

And could the convoy people come to a rational conclusion on that?

Neither.

They wouldn’t be where they are now without the protests across the country. Now they have millions and a lot of attention.

 

[Furniture]

Except that they wont give any ground and these protests will end.

Win Win.

The only losers here are Ottawa and the OPS who allowed this nonsense to turn into an occupation. Quebec city and other jurisdictions showed over the weekend that they would not put up with this nonsense, and they were all over by monday.

You're right the protest will end, but the manner of its ending is as important as the fact it ends.

When the railroads were blockaded, things ended peacefully because the government spoke respectfully to the people protesting, and allowed everybody to walk away feeling like they had accomplished something. If they had said "enough is enough" and used force to end things, blockades would likely have popped up at nearly every rail line that crossed First Nations claimed land.

Looking at the truck protest, the government has already essentially set themselves up to only have force, or boredom as an options to end this. Based on the way the media, and government have spoken about the protest boredom is likely out, because the more rhetoric they use the more the protesters dig in. That leaves force as the only option... What happens when the OPS decide that batons and tear gas are the right tool? We have already seen peaceful protests pop up across the country in support of the one in Ottawa, is it unlikely to see less-peaceful ones if this gets ugly in Ottawa?

 

[Altair]

Neither.

They wouldn’t be where they are now without the protests across the country. Now they have millions and a lot of attention.

They have a lot of attention and a lot of money and no results.

They would do better to pivot and turn this money and attention to political power, if they have the organization to do so.

CPC already makes a boatload of money, so they wouldn't get the most attention there.

PPC or Maverick would be natural bedfellows, but Maverick is a separatist party so that would limit appeal.

PPC it is then. Lets see if Bernier and the convoy team up.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Well, if the Attornies General of at least Texas and Florida are concerned about their folks getting ripped off by GFM on this one, while the grand total is big, can't tell how much of that is homegrown dollars.

It WOULD be interesting to see how protest would translate into political power. To grossly oversimplify, though, if you look at historical insurgencies (no I don't think THIS is anywhere close to that, just making a general analogy), not all groups good at protesting and opposing the government made transitions into governing.

What they really want is some action from government so they can go home and get on with their lives. These are not professional protesters. Most are taking a significant income hit to be there.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

And we are back at square one again. Talking about political parties LOL

The fact all three levels of Government are presently sitting around a table pointing fingers at each other to do something is highly amusing

 

[QV]

Wait, is OPS exempt from vaccine mandates? Can anyone confirm this?

 

[daftandbarmy]

Police bosses have given the order. Police on the ground have been recorded watching jerry cans go by, at the same time the Chief was announcing it again at a press conference.

Oh FFS....

But I have to sympathize, to a certain extent.

Proper cordons, even small ones, consume an enourmous amount of resources ....

.... like political capital

 

[Furniture]

Or 2.2 million?

Interestingly, 2.2 million firearms owners didn't raise 10 million dollars, and park 8k protestors on Parliament Hill for a weekend, which makes me think there are more than ~800K people backing the protests happening across the country...

 

[The Bread Guy]

And we are back at square one again. Talking about political parties LOL

The fact all three levels of Government are presently sitting around a table pointing fingers at each other to do something is highly amusing

Ah, Canadian federalism in action ...

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Oh FFS....

But I have to sympathize, to a certain extent.

Proper cordons, even small ones, consume an enourmous amount of resources ....

.... like political capital

I've said enough, I'm just gonna grab a bag of popcorn, sit back and enjoy the show.

I do genuinely feel compassion for the people who are bystanders in all of this that are being impacted.

I also feel bad for the Police, they are paid well but not that well. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

[QV]

Interestingly, 2.2 million firearms owners didn't raise 10 million dollars, and park 8k protestors on Parliament Hill for a weekend, which makes me think there are more than ~800K people backing the protests happening across the country...

Earlier I said it was likely 50/50… in retrospect it’s probably far more against mandates and restriction. The “for“ category is likely only now largelylimited to three categories:
1. Old vulnerable retirees;
2. Public servants or those who will still get paid when everything is shutdown
3. Those who’ve not been able to suss out the real risks of C19

And the numbers in these three keep dwindling (omicron, acquired natural immunity, etc)

This is almost over, only the government stubbornness hanging on.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Earlier I said it was likely 50/50… in retrospect it’s probably far more against mandates and restriction. The “for“ category is likely only now largelylimited to three categories:
1. Old vulnerable retirees;
2. Public servants or those who will still get paid when everything is shutdown
3. Those who’ve not been able to suss out the real risks of C19

And the numbers in these three keep dwindling (omicron, acquired natural immunity, etc)

I don't think that's actually correct either. I think there is a substantial portion of the population, probably 40-50% that don't give much of a crap either way.

Then there is 25-30 percent either side that are strongly in their respective pro camps, hence why this is no longer a "fringe" movement.

You can tell just by the lively discussion here that this isn't some sort 95% consensus for something.

The real question I have is what are we going to do when the pandemic is all over and what's the plan for the 3+ million people we have that still aren't vaccinated? Are we going to roll back to pre March 2020 rules or are we going to end up with a bunch of anti-vaxx refugees?

In other words.... what's the end game here?

 

[PMedMoe]

Wait, is OPS exempt from vaccine mandates? Can anyone confirm this?

No.

Fewer than 10 Ottawa police officers suspended for refusing COVID-19 vaccine

 

[QV]

I don't think that's actually correct either. I think there is a substantial portion of the population, probably 40-50% that don't give much of a crap either way.

Then there is 25-30 percent either side that are strongly in their respective pro camps, hence why this is no longer a "fringe" movement.

You can tell just by the lively discussion here that this isn't some sort 95% consensus for something.

The real question I have is what are we going to do when the pandemic is all over and what's the plan for the 3+ million people we have that still aren't vaccinated? Are we going to roll back to pre March 2020 rules or are we going to end up with a bunch of anti-vaxx refugees?

In other words.... what's the end game here?

The reason I disagree with your 40-50% don’t give a crap is that everyone has been 8mpeded one way or another in this. For some it’s as simple as unrestricted border crossing, others it’s school issues, many it’s employment… the number that GAF is definitely high.

Good question, what and when is the end game? We’re way passed “two weeks to slow the spread“.