Georgia and the Russian invasions/annexations/Lebensraum (2008 & 2015)

[Korporaal]

Russia claims 10 of there peacekeepers were killed by the Georgians and that this was one of the reasons for the invasion.

Isn`t this a bit like the Taliban sending peacekeepers to Afghanistan.

Common sense and politics make strange bed fellows.

 

[The Bread Guy]

A bit of a map, showing some of the hot spots (also shows the airfield base - zoom in on the tiny red flag - of Ex Immediate Response 2008,  which reportedly, "united forces from several nations to participate in small arms, combat lifesaver, and situational training exercises. Countries involved include the United States, Georgia, Ukraine, Azerbaijan, and Armenia."

Apologies for lack of map info in Georgia and other Caucasus republics - don't know if this is a recent Google development, or something long standing.

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Should I start planning the southern front offensive?  >

Remember to keep your flanks strong this time.  >

 

[GAP]

That is, if our major customer slips deeper into recession it wouldn't do us a lot of good. 

Right now, a recession in the US is good for them....it forces them to deal with/block future sub prime type garbage ( much like they did with the other crisis over the last couple of decades). It also forces them to take a good look, not that it will do much good, at the offshore production they depend on so much, but that is killing jobs at home. (think china and Indonesia)

 

[tomahawk6]

The US economy isnt in as bad a shape as the media portrays. Anyone else in the world have 5.7% or less unemployment ? Didnt think so thats hardly a recession.

 

[GAP]

The US economy isnt in as bad a shape as the media portrays. Anyone else in the world have 5.7% or less unemployment ? Didnt think so thats hardly a recession.

I agree, but the recession mentality is still there, especially with an election in November...

 

[Kirkhill]

As I understand it the media keeps reporting that the US is in danger of slipping into recession.  It just never seems to get there.  :

It has yet to "achieve" two quarters of sustained reduction in GDP.

 

[tomahawk6]

The media is trying to create the impression of an economic downturn because they are trying to help the democrats. There are segments of the economy in a downturn some of its due to high fuel prices RV industry for one,trucking and airlines are others.The housing market is down. All economies have sectors that are cyclical.Not sure what this has to do with the conflict in Georgia. The danger is that the Russians may want to simply take Georgia and install a government friendly to Russia this would solve many of their problems in the region but give them heartburn internationally.I dont see the US intervening to save Georgia which in turn makes the US look weak. We have fewer options and I dont like that at all.

 

[JayJay144]

Pretty smart to attack during the Olympics, everyone distracted and looking eleswhere.

I have to say, I'm quite irritated. This could be the start of a major war in Europe, and I can't even watch a damn thing about it on the News because Senator John Edwards cheated on his wife two years ago. Priorities, eh?

Midget

Does this mean Israel will attack Iran during the Olympic time frame? What are the chances I wonder.

 

[JayJay144]

The US economy isnt in as bad a shape as the media portrays. Anyone else in the world have 5.7% or less unemployment ? Didnt think so thats hardly a recession.

I wouldn't be so sure of that. You might want to read this article from Paul Craig Roberts. He's known as the Father of Reaganomics.

http://www.counterpunch.org/roberts05232008.html

 

[oligarch]

Since everyone else says this - how about this ogliarch guy posting details of his name etc... or does this genteleman reperesent the Russian embassy?

Would you like SIN number while we are at it? I live in Canada and I hold dual citizenship. I have many relatives and friends in Russia; fortunately, none of them have been caught up in this conflict. This should be enough information for you if you want to make some sort of personal attack to discredit me on the forums. Actually, you got me! I represent the Russian embassy. I also work for KGB, which actually still exists, and my assignment is to go on the forums and brainwash members of the Canadian Forces. I should also make you aware that I make tons of money from oil, that I am from Nothern Siberia, that I learned to shoot hunting bear and I love to drink vodka by the litre. I also have a beard and play the balalaika.

But I am just saying that I find it ridiculous how many news sources, especially British and American, make it look like Russia started this conflict. I have been reading comments on other Canadian forums and newspaper responses and I find it surprising how many Canadians can actually see through this corporate media BS that we are being fed. Russians intervened after some crazy nut-job BOMBED A POPULATED CITY INDISCRIMINATELY!!! I don't see how this does not constitute genocide, seeing as Ossetians were the population there, somebody Georgia would prefer to see somewhere much higher North. Below I quote one of these responses:

"So, when Russian forces bomb a city on Russian territory (Grozny in Chechnya for instance) it is a humanitarian crisis and ethnic cleansing, but when Georgian forces bomb a city on Georgian territory - what do we call that? Why is it OK for the West to help Kosovo break away from Yugoslavia, but it is not OK for Southern Osetia to break away from Georgia? Why is it OK for US to bomb Bosnia to protect the lives of its soldiers, but not OK for Russia to bomb Georgia to protect the lives of its soldiers? Sure, both Georgia and Russia are to blame for this conflict, but at least the newsmedia should try and remain objective."

 

[Michael OLeary]

Actually, you got me! I represent the Russian embassy. I also work for KGB, which actually still exists, and my assignment is to go on the forums and brainwash members of the Canadian Forces. I should also make you aware that I make tons of money from oil, that I am from Nothern Siberia, that I learned to shoot hunting bear and I love to drink vodka by the litre. I also have a beard and play the balalaika.

Nice.  Instead of working to establish your credibility, you choose to mock that challenge you should have expected.  Would you like to try again, in order to be able to present a credible alternate perspective of ongoing events?

 

[oligarch]

Здравствулте!  I did read about the Georgians shelling the capital of South Ossetia. I also know it's not a simple case of "good Georgians" vs. "Bad Russians".

In the event you have relatives over there (on either side), I wish them well.
До свидания!

Благодарю!

Luckly, my relatives are not directly involved in the conflict, but I thank you anyway and hope your wishes live on and serve someone who really needs them at this terrible time. Believe me, in spite of stereotype, media hype, and sometimes popular opinion in the west, the Russian people do not want war. The Russian people have gone through so much conflict, fighting, oppression, and revolution that I think it offensive for outsides to regard us as "trigger happy". There is no single Russian familly, including my own, that has not been somehow affected by one of the wars Russia has lived through in the last century. I and all Russians sincerely hope that the fighting stops, but not at any cost. The Russian government and the Russian people are not prepared to abandon their national and security interests, just as the Canadian government is not prepared to abandon theirs.

С глубочайшим уважением,
Олигарх

 

[oligarch]

Nice.  Instead of working to establish your credibility, you choose to mock that challenge you should have expected.  Would you like to try again, in order to be able to present a credible alternate perspective of ongoing events?

A challenge to post my name? I don't know about you but I've been told never to post my name or give out personal information in public forums. So yes, because I find the challenge to be childish, pointless, and quite immature I did indeed opted to mock it. If you read the post that individual responded to you will indeed find my case, which nobody really has made a levelheaded logical response to. There is no "alternate perspective"! There is the twisting of facts and misrepresentation of the timeline I see on BBC news, which being of the more objective English speaking sources on the conflict, makes it appear as though this incident began the moment that the 58th Army of the Russian Federation entered Ossetia. I am so confident in my point of view that I am willing to say this and I challenge anyone who disagrees to prove me wrong. My identity does not matter in an argument, because it is the argument, not the arguer, that should be addressed in a formal debate. To do so otherwise would be to commit a logical fallacy. Georgia spent all night shelling innocent civilians, killing over 1400 of them (the number now could be up in 2000), it then proceeded to shell and execute peacekeepers. Pardon me for seeming a bit upset but my people are dying and your media spin and blind following of anything Rupert Murdoch tells you to believe upsets me to say the least.

 

[Michael OLeary]

I did not challenge you to post your name, only to present a logical set of facts, and possibly alternate sources of information, to support your views.

 

[JayJay144]

A challenge to post my name? I don't know about you but I've been told never to post my name or give out personal information in public forums. So yes, because I find the challenge to be childish, pointless, and quite immature I did indeed opted to mock it. If you read the post that individual responded to you will indeed find my case, which nobody really has made a levelheaded logical response to. There is no "alternate perspective"! There is the twisting of facts and misrepresentation of the timeline I see on BBC news, which being of the more objective English speaking sources on the conflict, makes it appear as though this incident began the moment that the 58th Army of the Russian Federation entered Ossetia. I am so confident in my point of view that I am willing to say this and I challenge anyone who disagrees to prove me wrong. My identity does not matter in an argument, because it is the argument, not the arguer, that should be addressed in a formal debate. To do so otherwise would be to commit a logical fallacy. Georgia spent all night shelling innocent civilians, killing over 1400 of them (the number now could be up in 2000), it then proceeded to shell and execute peacekeepers. Pardon me for seeming a bit upset but my people are dying and your media spin and blind following of anything Rupert Murdoch tells you to believe upsets me to say the least.

Oligarch you should take it easy and stop flipping out. If you bothered to read the original post of this thread you'd see that everyone here knows it wasn't Russia that started the incident. it's all right there with the thread starter. If you want to get political you should look for conspiracy websites because it appears that kind of thing would be up your ally.

 

[meni0n]

oligarch, I'm sure Russia 'accidently' had tanks ready to roll in at the border to defend the poor 'separatists' of SO.And the video and pictures of the  bombing of Gori is a huge propaganda on behalf of the Western world to show how Russia is truly evil. Don't forget, Russia is the only country in the world to recognize SO. I'm sure they're just innocent peacekeepers out to do good in the world. :

 

[JackD]

Dear Mr. Oligarch.. childish and immature? Interesting - since i am 52 years old, teach, spent 11 years in the Canadian Armed Forces and have posted on this website for several years. I asked a legitimate question in view of your sudden appearance parroting the usual Russian line and indeed used similar rhetorical flourishes found in the commentary sections on many news websites in the last couple of days. vis a vis articles discussing this conflict.. i was simply asking that you fill in your profile... You see, I was known personally to several of the posters to this website.. but you are not.
   As to the conflict itself - i am rather amazed at how muted the response is to it in the media, and by western governments....

 

[Franko]

A challenge to post my name? I don't know about you but I've been told never to post my name or give out personal information in public forums. So yes, because I find the challenge to be childish, pointless, and quite immature I did indeed opted to mock it. If you read the post that individual responded to you will indeed find my case, which nobody really has made a levelheaded logical response to. There is no "alternate perspective"! There is the twisting of facts and misrepresentation of the timeline I see on BBC news, which being of the more objective English speaking sources on the conflict, makes it appear as though this incident began the moment that the 58th Army of the Russian Federation entered Ossetia. I am so confident in my point of view that I am willing to say this and I challenge anyone who disagrees to prove me wrong. My identity does not matter in an argument, because it is the argument, not the arguer, that should be addressed in a formal debate. To do so otherwise would be to commit a logical fallacy. Georgia spent all night shelling innocent civilians, killing over 1400 of them (the number now could be up in 2000), it then proceeded to shell and execute peacekeepers. Pardon me for seeming a bit upset but my people are dying and your media spin and blind following of anything Rupert Murdoch tells you to believe upsets me to say the least.

Oligarch,

Welcome to Army.ca....a Canadian website. Fox News doesn't have much sway here.

Back on topic troops.

The Army.ca Staff

 

[vonGarvin]

Getting back on topic, there was a post that made it look as though Russia "accidentaly" had tanks on the border.  For heaven's sake, Russia and Georgia have had "differences" over the years, including several persons of Russian ethnicity (and citizenship) in the de-facto independant "state" of South Ossetia.  Things have come to blows, and the Russians have responded.  I don't even want to pretend to know whom to "blame" for this one.  All I know is that I hope it's over soon and that bloodshed, especially for the citizens of both sides.