Harper announces major upgrades to navy frigates

[GAP]

Harper announces major upgrades to navy frigates
Updated Thu. Jul. 5 2007 9:44 AM ET CTV.ca News Staff
Article Link

Standing aboard the deck of a ship in Halifax Thursday morning, Prime Minister Stephen Harper announced major upgrades to Canada's fleet of 12 Halifax-class frigates.

Harper, flanked by Foreign Affairs Minister Peter MacKay and Defence Minister Gordon O'Connor, said the $3.1 billion project will begin in 2010, and the work will be done by Canadian shipyards.

He said the ships have proven their value to Canada time and time again in peacekeeping efforts around the world, disaster relief, maintaining Arctic sovereignty and protecting Canada's coasts.

"Today we are announcing our intention to proceed with a refit of the entire Halifax-class fleet," Harper said from the deck of the frigate HMCS Halifax.

"New updated equipment will make these ships stronger, safer and better able to do all that we ask them to do. They are the backbone of the Canadian navy so by upgrading them we are making the entire navy stronger."
More on link

 

[Spencer100]

Wow, he flew to Halifax to announces this....Have they even got a contractor yet picked?  :threat:

Sounds like a Liberal annoucement of an annoucement...urgh!

 

[NCS_Eng]

What he was announcing is known as the FELEX Project (Frigate Life Extension) and has been around for years. Most of the work package will be done by different contractors or FMF's during extended refits and slowly rolled out throughout the fleet. Some of the Felex projects have already been initiated.

This is nothing new, the money was already allocated and the project has been in planning since the late 90s. The announcement was simply a political gesture.

 

[GAP]

And a kiss off to the NS Premier.

 

[TN2IC]

And a kiss off to the NS Premier.

;D

Yup... I was there.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Wow, he flew to Halifax to announces this....Have they even got a contractor yet picked?   :threat:

Sounds like a Liberal annoucement of an annoucement...urgh!

Halifax Shipyard and the Victoria Shipyard were both invited to submit propsals

 

[newfin]

The CBC reporter Rob Gordon in his report (http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2007/07/05/harper-navy.html) says that the Halifaxes will get:
new sensors (not specified)
a new gun
harpoon missiles
sea sparrow missiles
command and control centres



My questions:
A new gun?  This is the first I have heard about the main gun being replaced.  Has the Navy already selected which one they want?

Command and Control Centre - I always thought that one of the problems with trying to operate a task force from one of these ships was a lack of physical space in the interior.  Does the Navy plan to reconfigure the internal layout of the ship to accomodate a large Operations Room?

Doesn't anyone find it strange that thre is very little mention of this plan on the DND site?  Think back to exactly one year ago when on 4 out of 5 business days in one week the government commited to multiple projects and billions in spending.  The DND site had "Backgrounders" and News Releases" al ready to coincide with each new project announced.  In this case, the first official notice (and the one carried on the CBC website) was from the PMO.  Here is the link to the only place on DND.ca that I could find mention of this big news:
    http://www.navy.forces.gc.ca/cms_news/news_e.asp?category=7&id=615&x=2

It looks like the PMO thought it was much bigger news to be able to sneak into Halifax at such a contentious time, make a big spending announcement and take off to Saskatchewan.

One more observation.  I guess we now know the solution the Navy came up with to solve the loss of the C&C function of the 280's.

 

[Allen]

There is plenty mentioned about the project here. This project office site has been up at least two years:

http://www.forces.gc.ca/admmat/dgmepm/pmofelex/index_e.asp

If you check out some of the presentations, you'll find they plan to upgrade just about everything, not just what was mentioned in the CBC report. The ships already have Harpoon & Sea Sparrow, but these will be upgraded to more modern versions. Installation of ESSM is already underway. I believe there is something about a new gun in there.

 

[Brockvegas]

I hate to point out the obvious here, but this "announcement" is nothing more than Harper making an attempt to draw peoples attention away from the whole "not extending the mission without concensus from the house" B.S. that was announced last week.

This means two things: 1) He knows that the concensus is not going to happen. AND 2) He has realized that his political advisors took the SHORT BUS to school, and is trying to backtrack now.

Just my $ 0.02.

 

[NCS_Eng]

My questions:
A new gun?  This is the first I have heard about the main gun being replaced.  Has the Navy already selected which one they want?

Not a new gun but an upgraded version of the Bofors.

Command and Control Centre - I always thought that one of the problems with trying to operate a task force from one of these ships was a lack of physical space in the interior.  Does the Navy plan to reconfigure the internal layout of the ship to accommodate a large Operations Room?

All the new kit that's being put on is 1/2 to 1/3 the size of the old stuff. So you can maximize internal space without knocking down bulkheads.

Doesn't anyone find it strange that there is very little mention of this plan on the DND site?  Think back to exactly one year ago when on 4 out of 5 business days in one week the government committed to multiple projects and billions in spending.  The DND site had "Backgrounders" and News Releases" all ready to coincide with each new project announced.  In this case, the first official notice (and the one carried on the CBC website) was from the PMO.  Here is the link to the only place on DND.ca that I could find mention of this big news:
    http://www.navy.forces.gc.ca/cms_news/news_e.asp?category=7&id=615&x=2

It looks like the PMO thought it was much bigger news to be able to sneak into Halifax at such a contentious time, make a big spending announcement and take off to Saskatchewan.

URL of the PMO Felex site has already been posted

One more observation.  I guess we now know the solution the Navy came up with to solve the loss of the C&C function of the 280's.

Its a little more contentious than that, because we still aren't sure on how the living arrangements will work out, but this is a nice stopgap till we get to SCSC.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Its a little more contentious than that, because we still aren't sure on how the living arrangements will work out, but this is a nice stopgap till we get to SCSC.

The problem still is we will lose our AAD until the first SCSC hull joins the fleet.

 

[DaveTee]

Just a silly question from someone who has no idea about naval matters...is there even a slight chance that the Navy could get a carrier? I don't mean a huge nuclear one or anything but something like the British light carriers with a squadron of harriers or some similar aircraft? I know it seems unlikely now, but anyone think it might / should happen?

 

[Spencer100]

Just a silly question from someone who has no idea about naval matters...is there even a slight chance that the Navy could get a carrier? I don't mean a huge nuclear one or anything but something like the British light carriers with a squadron of harriers or some similar aircraft? I know it seems unlikely now, but anyone think it might / should happen?

I think the closest thing Canada is looking at is the "BHS"  (Big Honking Ship).  As was stated somewhere on this site that program is delayed or shelved. 

Also if you are interested about "light carrier" type things, the Australians are building something along the lines of what you are thinking with the Canberra class LHD. http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/australias-canberra-class-lhds-03384/

 

[newfin]

Well the Big Honkin Ship (BHS) has apparently been put on hold for the time being.  That was the closest vessel that was being contemplated with a flat-top on it. (at least partial flat-top) And besides there are so many other issues that the Navy needs to sort through right now because of so many years of being ignored that it is probably a very prudent idea to shelve it for now.

Current issues that are being dealt with:
FELEX (Halifax Class Modernization)
APV's (Arctic Patrol Vessels)
Sub upgrades
SCSC (single class surface combatant - still many years off)
Orca integration into training
Kingston class
never ending deployments overseas and off our three coasts
CH-148 Cyclone integration in 1.5 years
...and constant manpower shortages

That's a long list that will keep them very busy for many, many years.
Have I missed anything?  I am sure I must have missed something.

 

[DaveTee]

It seems that in the distant future something like the Canberra class would be useful for Canadian purposes...but as was also said the navy seems to have a lot to do already...
Thanks for the info

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Also in the Navy section you will find the "carrier" topic discussed in more detail

 

[DaveTee]

I'll check it out, thanks.

 

[Haletown]

The contenders gear up for contractual battle 

"Canada: Battleground for European Combat Management Systems


Canada's program to give up to 12 Halifax-class frigates a mid-life upgrade has turned into a battleground for European naval combat management systems. Three European companies (EADS-owned Atlas Elektronik, Saab Systems and Thales) are offering their latest technology through teaming agreements with Canadian-based primes."

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/defense/index.jsp?plckController=Blog&plckScript=blogScript&plckElementId=blogDest&plckBlogPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog%3a27ec4a53-dcc8-42d0-bd3a-01329aef79a7Post%3aff401cd0-62d3-4649-af22-31e7ceb3bb69