"Hegseth: Flu Vaccine Optional"

[The Bread Guy]

Would you agree that there are forces on “both sides of the aisle “ (but not to say in the US only) to are deliberately trying to pit us against each other in order to further their own ends?

That's why this still seems pretty relevant, especially with social media commentary ...

#PoliticalRorschach

 

[Brad Sallows]

With X in particular, it's best to wait a while before latching onto something.

If you post an X "gotcha" before the "Community Notes" have had time to pass through the gate, you risk looking like a fool.

 

[mariomike]

View attachment 99991

When cornered or cooped up with someone on the ( political ) spectrum , or any spectrum, I nod and say, "ok".

That gives them their "win".

Which, usually, seems enough to satisfy them.

 

[OldSolduer]

Let’s not lose sight of the fact that the USA is a foreign nation with an elected government.

It’s their choice.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Let’s not lose sight of the fact that the USA is a foreign nation with an elected government.

It’s their choice.

And this decision is very similar to our current policy.

 

[brihard]

With X in particular, it's best to wait a while before latching onto something.

If you post an X "gotcha" before the "Community Notes" have had time to pass through the gate, you risk looking like a fool.

Which is why it’s so important, when using X, to treat it like an aggregator and not a source in and of itself unless the person posting original content is already proven reliable or speaks with some particular authority they themselves hold. Even the knowledgeable experts are still usually building off something else they’ll cite.

 

[lenaitch]

I support and will fight for your right to make that choice. All I ask is just leave it a choice and we don't hinder freedoms for making that choice.

Agreed, so long as people who are potentially contagious exercise the requisite protection or discretion in public or congregate settings. I grew up with a kid who had polio - crippled for life, my dad had TB and lived with one lung and know a family who's kid died of meningitis. Having said that, I don't want to re-kindle the vaccine debate.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Agreed, so long as people who are potentially contagious exercise the requisite protection or discretion in public or congregate settings. I grew up with a kid who had polio - crippled for life, my dad had TB and lived with one lung and know a family who's kid died of meningitis. Having said that, I don't want to re-kindle the vaccine debate.

Fair all I will add from my position is:

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

Ben Franklin

 

[mariomike]

Agreed, so long as people who are potentially contagious exercise the requisite protection or discretion in public or congregate settings.

On some departments, no vax = full PPE.

Big change for the U.S. military after 80 years. Some might call it progress.

As far as Liberty / Freedom goes, some might say that when it comes to public health, personal freedom / liberty can endanger others.

"Safety" (the preservation of life) is a necessary precondition for the exercise of liberty / freedom.

I think most of our readers understand the difference between defending one's country and supporting public health.

If quoting Benjamin Franklin,

Benjamin Franklin was a vocal advocate for smallpox inoculation (a primitive form of vaccination) later in life, using his newspaper to promote it as a "safe and beneficial Practice". He strongly regretted not inoculating his 4-year-old son, Francis, who died of the disease in 1736, and advocated for others to choose the safer option over the risk of natural infection.

'I Long Regretted Bitterly, and Still Regret That I Had Not Given It To Him'

Benjamin Franklin's writing about losing his son to smallpox is a must-read for parents weighing COVID-19 vaccines today

time.com

 

[Halifax Tar]

On some departments, no vax = full PPE.

Big change for the U.S. military after 80 years. Some might call it progress.

As far as Liberty / Freedom goes, some might say that when it comes to public health, personal freedom / liberty can endanger others.

"Safety" (the preservation of life) is a necessary precondition for the exercise of liberty / freedom.

I think most of our readers understand the difference between defending one's country and supporting public health.

If quoting Benjamin Franklin,

'I Long Regretted Bitterly, and Still Regret That I Had Not Given It To Him'

Benjamin Franklin's writing about losing his son to smallpox is a must-read for parents weighing COVID-19 vaccines today

time.com

I advocate that the Yankees are best team to cheer for in baseball, and I also support your right to make your own decision. And your basic rights and freedoms, as being Canadian, should not be infringed by that.

 

[brihard]

I advocate that the Yankees are best team to cheer for in baseball, and I also support your right to make your own decision. And your basic rights and freedoms, as being Canadian, should not be infringed by that.

Sure. Just a reminder than the context here is while in voluntary military service. Where the immunization line gets drawn - Covid, Flu, Measles, Hepatitis, Yellow Fever - is obviously a matter where an arbitrary call gets made at some point. In the case of mandatory vaccinations for military service, clearly the unlimited personal freedom yields at some point to the larger needs of the organization. Just where those needs land becomes a policy question.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Sure. Just a reminder than the context here is while in voluntary military service. Where the immunization line gets drawn - Covid, Flu, Measles, Hepatitis, Yellow Fever - is obviously a matter where an arbitrary call gets made at some point. In the case of mandatory vaccinations for military service, clearly the unlimited personal freedom yields at some point to the larger needs of the organization. Just where those needs land becomes a policy question.

You're moving the goal posts becuase you want to diagree.

We should compare vaccination books, I bet I win for most pokes.

 

[brihard]

You're moving the goal posts becuase you want to diagree.

I am not. Just gently reminding that amidst the personal freedom discourse, the underlying issue here is vaccinations in the context of military fitness to deploy. I wasn’t disagreeing with anything said above, just tying back in to the specific nuance of this case. In some other discussions you take a more maximalist personal rights over the state/society view, which is fine; there’s just a distinction when it comes to uniformed service. And I know you know that already; I’m not trying to be condescending and suggest you don’t.

We should compare vaccination books, I bet I win for most pokes.

Oh, no doubt. It’s not a competition, and there wasn’t a shred of scorn or personal attack aimed at you in this; and certainly not questioning your dedication to your own personal readiness. I’m not sure why you took it like it there was.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I am not. Just gently reminding that amidst the personal freedom discourse, the underlying issue here is vaccinations in the context of military fitness to deploy. I wasn’t disagreeing with anything said above, just tying back in to the specific nuance of this case. In some other discussions you take a more maximalist personal rights over the state/society view, which is fine; there’s just a distinction when it comes to uniformed service. And I know you know that already; I’m not trying to be condescending and suggest you don’t.

Oh, no doubt. It’s not a competition, and there wasn’t a shred of scorn or personal attack aimed at you in this; and certainly not questioning your dedication to your own personal readiness. I’m not sure why you took it like it there was.

You fail to understand nuance. And I think you are trying to frame me a some sort of anti vaxxer. Which I am not.

What I am is pro choice and personal decision.

My vaccintion book will litterally speak volumes about this, I have more than 1 book. I've had vaccinations we had to order in from over seas. But I have also turned down anti malarial and the flu shot.

 

[brihard]

You fail to understand nuance. And I think you are trying to frame me a some sort of anti vaxxer. Which I am not.

What I am is pro choice and personal decision.

My vaccintion book will litterally speak volumes about this, I have more than 1 book. I've had vaccinations we had to order in from over seas. But I have also turned down anti malarial and the flu shot.

Dude. Take a step back and take a breath, and reassess. I’m not saying or suggesting anything negative about you at all. I quoted your post as the context or what I was adding to the discussion but absolutely none of my comment was aimed at you personally. I’m not trying to frame you as anything. You’re completely misreading it.

I was chiming in on the larger philosophical discussion this thread has drifted towards, and just noting the distinction when we balance individual freedoms versus the demands of military service. Your reply, which was also speaking generally, was simply the one that happened to bring my comment on that in. Yes I was replying to you, but I wasn’t talking about you. Just because we sometimes take opposite positions on things doesn’t mean I feel some need to find a way to attack you. I have nothing but respect for you, even when we disagree.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Dude. Take a step back and take a breath, and reassess. I’m not saying or suggesting anything negative about you at all. I quoted your post as the context or what I was adding to the discussion but absolutely none of my comment was aimed at you personally. I’m not trying to frame you as anything. You’re completely misreading it.

I was chiming in on the larger philosophical discussion this thread has drifted towards, and just noting the distinction when we balance individual freedoms versus the demands of military service. Your reply, which was also speaking generally, was simply the one that happened to bring my comment on that in. Yes I was replying to you, but I wasn’t talking about you. Just because we sometimes take opposite positions on things doesn’t mean I feel some need to find a way to attack you. I have nothing but respect for you, even when we disagree.

If I am misunderstanding you I apologize.

 

[brihard]

If I am misunderstanding you I apologize.

You are, and it’s all good man. Wall of text effect; I know I can be bad for that.

 

[Navy_Pete]

By the time QV made that post there was only a single reply here that was describable as a harsh response, the one by Navy_Pete. And only Navy_Pete has posted further along that same vein here; any other criticism or skepticism has been quite mild. I recognize there’s some hyperbole on your part here, and I also recognize that elsewhere you would find responses like what you describe. But QV inaccurately and unfairly described the character of this thread when he said that. I was correcting his somewhat over the top take on the army.ca response, and I was doing so reasonably gently.

Framing a DoD policy from 1945 as 'woke garbage from the Biden administration' is regressive.

The outcome makes sense, but like a broken clock, even an incompetent drunk white supremascist like Hegseth can accidentally be get something right. He's an unqualified fraud that is winging the running of the largest military on the planet, and regularly firing people just because their expertise and professionalism means they don't agree with whatever is the toilet tweet direction of the day, or commit war crimes.