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Medical Technician - Unskilled, Semi-skilled, Skilled Application

    Wow guys, interesting stuff and a lot to think about.

    Adam, you mentioned spec 1 pay as of Sept; Since the PCP is a requirement now, not overly new, will this starting contract of P3/ CPL most likely stand in your opinion, or do you think i'm hearing a lot of things that aren't goiong to happen. I'm hoping you got some new insight at the conferance you mentioned.
 
You were told wrong.

There is a Sgt in the PA class at school who said he was first told med techs were going to get spec pay when he was on his QL 3 course 22 years ago.

Believe it when you see it on the CANFORGEN.

 
Unglunk,

Ptes do not get spec pay.

The conference was an update of things trying to get done...not things that are going to happen.
 
I can provide some additional guidance on this issue.

QL3 (Apprentice) Med Tech is a three "part" qualification.

I - The Clinical Care part (anatomy, physiology, basic nursing care, casting and a continued indoctrination into the military life as a basic training list candidate). 

II - The Emergent Care part.  This is the PCP qualification contracted to an accredited civilian college.  In the case of English speakers it is currently the Justice Institute of British Colombia.

III - The Field Operations part.  This teaching you how to work as a member in a field medical unit. 

It is somewhat common to find people with civilian paramedic qualifications to being given a PLA bypass (Prior Learning Assessment) for Phase II.  It is rare to see Phase I and/or III given a PLA bypass.

The QL4 Med Tech course does not exist in the Regular Force. 

The QL5A (Journeyman) Med Tech program is also a three "part" qualification.  Students are returning to the Canadian Forces Medical Services School 18-36 months after completing the QL3 program. 

I - The Clinical Care part (medical patho-physiology [common conditions], clinic medicine, suturing, more nursing skills such as IV medications).

II - The Emergent Care part.  This is currently not being offered but will be in the near'ish future.  There was some thought for quite a long period of time that is was going to be the ACP civilian qualification.  Now that does not look like it will be the case as we are going in a different direction.  I cannot comment much on it as I am not sure what is releasable in the public forum. There is still the thought that this part will be provided by a civilian college provider. 

III - The Field Operations part.  This teaching you how to work as a field medical detachment commander. 

I have never seen someone with only civilian medical qualifications given a PLA for QL5A.  After your QL5A the next step (if you demonstrate leadership potential) is the Primary Leadership Qualification.  This is a non-medical service common qualification and a PLA will not happen for any medical qualification you come to the table with. 

QL6A qualification is currently (but subject to change) a short (2 week) course in medical administration.  It is aimed at the Master Corporal and teaches topics such as medical finance, medical estimates, total quality management, medical regulating, medical supply, etc.

The QL6B qualification is the Physician Assistant course. One must be a Sergeant prior to being nominated for this course. Prairie Dog is right on the mark with respect to time lines for career progression to be eligible for this qualification.

So there you go.  No comments on pay rates.  Entry as a Cpl seems to be more of a myth than a reality (I have seen a few of Privates told they will get it as they were semi-skilled, but are never offered it).  This could be changing however due to the fact Med Tech (737) is now in the red for numbers.  I have never seen a civilian ACP paramedic (or PCP) paramedic without prior military service given a PLA bypass for QL3 or QL5A. 

I hope that is of some help.  It is important to remember that the Medical Technician is not a civilian paramedic.  They are two different beasts with only a somewhat limited overlap in job or skill set. 

Cheers,

MC
 
    That does clear up a few things for me, much appreciated.

    Just out of pure curiosity, what would happen if someone took the civilian Physicians assisstant course and then applied to the CF? Has this ever occured? I suspect not, since it's a fairly new program outside of the military, but thought i would ask.
 
Good question. And one the CF has yet to answer. One thing for sure, they will not come into the Reg Force directly as WOs.

And it will not happen until after July 2010, earliest.

But the good bet, as the number of civvie PAs will be small (less than 20), that they will earn significantly more than military PAs, and the number of opportunites for them in Ontario, let alone the rest of the country, is that even if they were "interested", there is no good incentive for any of them to join up.
 
It's worth pointing out that given the entry requirements at the CivU PA courses, joining as a Sgt or WO wouldn't make much sense to an applicant.  If I was required to do 2-4 years of post-secondary education before even getting into the PA program, I'd be looking at DEO, or CF-sponsored MOTP.  I think Prairie Dog is correct in assuming Civ PAs would have little incentive to join up.  Going up the ranks and becoming a PA would be a more natural transition.

I would not be surprised if the CF sees a major overhaul to their medical structure in the near future, especially with PAs rolling out.  Major urban centres are now frothing at the mouth to see more ACPs fill the ranks.  It is my humble prediction that PCPs will not exist a decade from now in the civilian world...ACP will become the standard.  I speak mostly of Ontario services, who are currently hiring p/t PCPs with no guarantee of f/t unless they work for 2 years continuous.  There are such things as f/t PCP for sure, but ACP is the direction most services are trying to push their staff to attain (either by themselves, or through sponsorship).  Some services sponsor their own PCPs through ACP training, so obviously that is the direction they'd like to see their staff go.

Anyway, not looking to kick the hornet's nest here on what SHOULD be done, but I'd say if the CF wants to keep Med Techs (or potential civ applicants) interested, mirroring the civilian world closely is the way to go.  Just look at MPs getting Cpl rank at BMQ grad - a move to make the trade more comparable to the civ trade.  When I took my AEMCA, I wrote it with a few Med Techs who were itching to get certified in ON, then leave the Forces.  The medical sector is exploding, and inventing all sorts of new jobs and qualifications that the CF would do well to try and recruit, Registered Respiratory Therapists come to mind, as they are essentially ER personnel specializing in life support, but aren't quite nurses or paramedics, nor PAs.

Can someone flesh out the comparison between Civ medics (PCP) and Med Techs?  I'll break down PCPs for reference:

- CPR level C (infant, child, adult)
- First Aid cert. (I'll just lump all bandaging and maintaining sterility here)
- BVM and resp. assistance
- spinal (board, collar, Kendrick Extrication Device [KED] in some services)
- MAST pants
- 4 lead ECG (some services allow 12 lead but NO INTERPRETATION) *Ottawa has a pilot study where PCPs can look for STEMI and bypass ER to go directly to the local Heart Institute
- Nasal and oral airway (some services have combitube or LMAs...anything short of full intubation with the Miller blade)
- medication (this area is tricky as it varies from service to service...I'll just list a few with the caveat that some are not used, where they are elsewhere)
---- ventolin by spacer, BVM, or humidified air
---- O2 (any percentage) by nasal, simple mask, venturi hi-flo, BV, etc.
---- ASA 81mg
---- Narcan
---- Epinephrine SC or IM
---- Benadryl
---- Nitro
---- Nitrous Oxide gas
---- * IV endorsement is possible with some services, however there are drastic differences on what can be delivered.  Some services don't allow PCPs to start IVs, just maintain them, others allow IV starts but saline only, or D5W
---- glucagon
---- glucose gel
---- semi-automated defibillation

Please compare that to MTs...I can see right away that MTs get casting training, which would never be a paramedic job.

Also, ACP cert. through the CF is a pipe dream in my opinion...it will just never happen.  ACP training covers so much more on the care of infants and  children, cardiac conditions, and various other skills that are more geared to a civilian setting.  Skill stagnation would be quite high at the ACP level if MTs were expected to maintain the civilian standards...which require regular recertification.

The end result is two careers with different aims and skills attached to them, and a medical field having a bit of an identity crisis as it grows exponentially for different reasons in and out of the CF.
 
It is important to remember that the fully qualified (QL5A) Regular Force Med Tech is a Primary Care Paramedic in either BC or Quebec.  On top of the civilian pre-hospital para-medicine skill set they also get a healthy dose of practical ward nursing skills (akin to a RPN), clinical medicine skills (in order to conduct and assist in sick parade medicine, which is akin to the walk in clinic) and military medicine. 

They also find themselves on occasion doing other medical type work like pharmacy technician, physiotherapy assistant, wilderness paramedic (remote and isolated para-medicine), helicopter evacuations (only limitation the Med Tech as is with respect to fixed wing aircraft, this requires additional training).

Here is a quick outline from memory for the QL5A Med Tech with TCCC:

Pre-hospital and military medical skills:

Airway:  OPA, NPA, Combitube
Breathing: BVM, O2, Suction, Needle Decompression
Circulation: IV's, Dressings, Hemostatic Agents, Tourniquets, CPR Level C, AED, 3 Lead EKG
Bones: Board, Collar, KED, traction splint, SAM Splint

Clinic / Ward Medicine:

12 Lead EKG
IV Meds set up / maintain and administer under direction (Secondary Line)
Urinary Catheters
Basic Casting
Patient Hygiene
Dressing changes, wound irrigation and packing
Admit / Discharge Patient / Prep and Receive Patient from OR
Teaching Crutches and canes
Flushing ears
Basic Suturing
ID / SQ / IM injections

Meds that can be given if they pass the OTC exam:
(this varies, I might have an older version [2004] of the list, but it looks close):

Emergency Meds:

ASA
D5W IV
Dextrose Injection
Benadryl
Epinephrine
Glucose Gel
Oxygen
N/S IV

Clinic Meds:

Tylenol
ASA
Gaviscon
Burrow's Solution
Burosol Otic
Maalox Plus
Diovol Plus
Polysporin Ophth / Otic
Polysporin Topical
Oragel
Benzoin Tincture
Benzoyl Peroxide Gel
Bisacodyl
Pepto-Bismol
Dimetapp Cold Syrup
Calamine Lotion
Reactine
Chlorhexidine
Clotrimazole
Collodion Flexible
Surgical Scrub
D5W
Dubucaine
Gravol (Oral and IM)
Benadryl
Dimethylpolysiloxane Cream
Gastrolyte
Aquatain
Allegra
Novo-Fibre
Fluorescein Sodium Ophth Strip
Glycerin Supp
Hemorrhoidal Ointment
Hydrogen Peroxide
Isopto Tears
Ibuprofen
Isopropyl Alcohol
Lidocaine 1% (with Epi and without)
Lidocaine Jelly
Lindaine
Immodium
Claritin
Epsom Salts
Bonamine
Mineral Oil
Multivitamin
Mupriocin Oint
Nicotine Gum and Transdermal
Eyestream
Norflex
Dristan
Nix
Providone Iodine
Promethazine HCl (oral and injection)
Sudafed
Salicyclic Acid (Duofilm and Soluver Plus and Sebcur)
Scopolamine Transdermal
Versel
Silver Nitrate
Dakin
Actifed
Zinc Oxide

Military Meds (these fall under various directives):

Morphine
Narcan
Fentanyl Lozenge
Atropine and HI-6 for IM Injection
Valium for IM Injection
Reactive Skin Decontamination Lotion

Again... this is not all encompassing, but is an overview.  I hope it helps to clear up the civilian paramedic versus the CF Medical Technician. 

Cheers

MC 
 
MC,
you missed probably the most important skills of a QL 5 medic: introductory history taking, physical exam skills and clinical impression judgements. All basic skills that are taught to a QL 5 that are part of more advance skills further developed on the PA course.
 
PD,

Agreed, I guess I just took those things for granted (which I should not have, especially seeing how much time we spend training Med Techs in these critical skills).

It really is hard to articulate everything the multi-faceted Med Tech does.

Cheers,

MC 
 
It looks like Med Techs are trained in a lot more on the RPN/clinic/hospital care end of things.

PCPs in the civilian setting encounter so much variation in what they are permitted to do across the country.  CMA-approved courses are not required to be PCPs in all provinces, ON being one.  This means training levels can be higher or lower than the CMA marker.

I got significant focus and evaluation on history taking, and reporting to accepting hospital staff, physical exams, and clinical judgment calls known as a "working diagnosis" (because a "diagnosis" is a medical act, and is left to the MD even if it's obviously going to be the same thing ;) )

I think the CF has the decisive advantage of more standardized training.  I know PCPs working with partners that couldn't take a patient history, or make a judgment call based on patient presentation.  This might not be their fault, as some provinces don't need the CMA stamp, and some programs don't provide essential training, just because CMA doesn't require it.

It's good to see that switching my career to fall under the CF would be a significant skill upgrade, and more responsibility.  Needle decompression alone is huge.  If a pt has a pneumo/hemothorax a PCP in the civ world would just "drive faster" or call for ACP backup if it's available.  I've never heard of PCPs being allowed to do a procedure that invasive.

How about full intubation?  Is that an available skill, perhaps at the PA level?  Or is that left to RNs?

One of the better instructors at my school repeatedly said "we are training you to be clinicians, NOT technicians".  With respect to the list of clinic meds, and wide breadth of duties Medical Technicians have, I'd say their job title isn't doing them justice. ;)
 
Dark Chivalry said:
It looks like Med Techs are trained in a lot more on the RPN/clinic/hospital care end of things.

How about full intubation?  Is that an available skill, perhaps at the PA level?  Or is that left to RNs?

To the first statement, the scope of practice of a Med Tech isn't limited to the point of injury/transport to definitive care - depending on where they work, they're also primary care providers, so they need that extra training.

And yes, PA's intubate.  Not overly sure about the RN's though, save the NP's.

MM
 
And to think Medical Technician is the new title. Not all that long ago the title was Medical Assistant.  The MOC has come along way and is still moving forward with AEC (Advanced Emergency Care) that will be added to the QL5A course, the expansion of the QL6A course and the allowance for trade progression to Med Tech Warrant Officer / Master Warrant Officer once the PA MOC becomes commissioned all being in the works at various progress levels. 

Nursing Officers (RN's) can intubate, training, location and situation dependent. Truth of the matter most cannot maintain the skill (due to the lack of OR time available doing the procedure under supervision) even when they are trained in it.  That being said, I know of no Nursing Officer who can do rapid sequence intubation vice PA where (someone correct me if I am wrong) is a taught and required skill.

Needle Decompression - well it is a skill that is required at the lowest levels (in fact, the CF even trains non-clinicians, like Infantrymen, to do this skill) due to the fact that blast injuries necessitate it's performance in a timely manner.  There is good research (as well as anecdotes) to support this, in that 21% of severe but survivable battle casualties die from a pnuemothorax.  This often happens in the second mode of the trimodal death distribution (a few minutes to six hours) and hence requires treatment very far forward by anyone who is brave enough to attempt it and who has the required training. 

<edit to add>: Both of our PCP programs are CMA accredited. 

Cheers,

MC
 
RSI involves the use of paralytics, and as such, PAs can not do RSI. PAs can intubate using Fentanyl and Midazolam as the induction agents, but no Succinylcholine, Etomidate or similar agent.
 
MedCorps said:
once the PA MOC becomes commissioned all being in the works at various progress levels.   

I'm curious but is this move seen to be very likely in the CF Health Services community?  Does anyone know if progress has already been made in this transition?
 
Snakedoc said:
I'm curious but is this move seen to be very likely in the CF Health Services community?  Does anyone know if progress has already been made in this transition?

The transition is just in the planning stage...2-5 yrs from implementation.
 
After Ungluck's post I contacted the CFRC regarding the Med-Tech trade semi-skilled entry and my file. I was told by a great recruiter who has been honest and kept me motivated the whole time that there is/was indeed a Recruiting allowance for Semi-Skilled Med-Tech but no rank incentive yet. 10k after BMQ and then 10K 1 year later. I jumped at it but was told that unfortunately all Med-Tech positions for the fiscal year had been filled???? Now I am waiting for April 1st. It's been over a year now and I passed every step along the way 1st time and was told I did very well on my interview, I'm fit, Experienced Paramedic- ALS in a high volume setting etc. Willing to learn new ways of doing things and want some new challenges. Still hoping to serve alongside you fine people but after a year I'm starting to look around at other options for a career change as I'm looking for something new.

Still hope things work out for me with the CF. Just wanting to update the thread.
 
This is a serious problem, Recruiting and Retention, and one that is recognized and has many people frustrated but trying on numerous levels of the CF to rectify.
 
    For all of those that are interested in an update, since i initially posted this, i have got some new information. I was merit listed a week ago for a semi skilled Med Tech spot, as they are hoping to have me in for BMQ for March 2009.

    The Captain i spoke with explained that in the last year A LOT has changed. If your are a PCP, applying semi skilled, from a CMA accredited course on the CF list of accepted schools, you will recieve the following: A $10,000 signing bonus, $5000 on completion of BMQ, and another $5000 at the end of your first year. You will start out as a Private 3rd class on completion of BMQ and will receive back pay for your previous BMQ time. You will receive promotion to CPL in a year, or on completion of QL3, which ever comes first. You will bypass the PCP portion of your QL3 training, but still do the rest of it.

    I explained that this all sounded very solid, was exactly what i was looking for etc, but i would need this in writing before signing a 6 year contract first; he said he expected no less from me and agreed.

    I would also like to mention that this 6 year contract is worded very poorly. All it means is that the military is willing to employ you for 6 years, but you can leave after 3 years on good terms. People think this means that the applicant can't leave for 6 years. It ALWAYS means that this is the time they are willing to keep you employed.

    I asked why  this  semi skilled entry plan had changed recently, and was told that it makes your starting wage far more comparable to that of a Civvi medic, and that they just weren't getting the semi skilled applicants because of the previous wage. It also makes you "deployable" that much faster, and Med Tech is very understrengthed right now.

    The wage is still not all that close to the Civvi side of things, but is good enough to make due on until you make it through a few years with Post Living diff and PMQ option. It's actually not a bad opportunity now, even for a guy with a family. This is assuming that these facts are accurate. I'll keep you guys posted when i finally see this contract.

    Hope this shedded some light on things for anyone curious.
 
Unglunk said:
     For all of those that are interested in an update, since i initially posted this, i have got some new information. I was merit listed a week ago for a semi skilled Med Tech spot, as they are hoping to have me in for BMQ for March 2009.

     The Captain i spoke with explained that in the last year A LOT has changed. If your are a PCP, applying semi skilled, from a CMA accredited course on the CF list of accepted schools, you will recieve the following: A $10,000 signing bonus, $5000 on completion of BMQ, and another $5000 at the end of your first year. You will start out as a Private 3rd class on completion of BMQ and will receive back pay for your previous BMQ time.

The term does not exist. At the end of BMQ you would be Pte (IPC 3) where IPC stands for Incentive Pay Category. You will get and extra 1200 dollars give or take a month more than most of your course mates who would Pte (IPC 1)
 
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