Navy could shift to Pacific

[GAP]

Navy could shift to Pacific
August 2, 2013 - 9:16pm By PAUL McLEOD Ottawa Bureau
http://thechronicleherald.ca/novascotia/1145828-navy-could-shift-to-pacific

OTTAWA — The growth of China could push the Royal Canadian Navy’s focus to the Pacific and away from Halifax, according to some defence analysts.

Military resources are jealously guarded by politicians and local governments, but some recent papers by defence analysts wonder how long the navy’s status quo can last.

The American navy is already “rebalancing” its fleet away from the Atlantic in what’s been dubbed the “Pacific pivot.”

Canada’s fleet still tilts toward the Atlantic. There are currently seven Halifax-class frigates and two Iroquois-class destroyers on the East Coast, versus five frigates and one destroyer on the West Coast.

Theoretically there will be two submarines for each coast when they are fully repaired.

This is at a time when Canada’s trade policy is focused on Asia and former defence minister Peter MacKay lobbied for Canada’s entry into a conference of defence ministers for the Association of Southeast Asian Nations.

In a 2012 paper for the Canadian Defence and Foreign Affairs Institute, retired rear admiral Roger Girouard argued the only way to make headway on these goals is for Canada to “be a Pacific player, not an afterthought.”

That comes down to having a consistent navy presence in the region, said Girouard, former commander of Maritime Forces Pacific.
more on link

 

[Edward Campbell]

It's about time for an about turn to recognize that our strong, right arm, needs to be extended towards Asia, not Europe.

 

[Transporter]

And just this summer the CF put a BGen in HQ USPACOM to serve as deputy J3, which is unprecedented at the US Geographic Combatant Command level.

 

[Lumber]

C Jetty is looking a little crowded as it is...

 

[ModlrMike]

C Jetty is looking a little crowded as it is...

But if they get rid of the MCDVs as mentioned in another thread, then Y jetty will open up.  >

 

[Lumber]

But if they get rid of the MCDVs as mentioned in another thread, then Y jetty will open up.  >

But then we bring the AOPS in...

Bell, even without shifting the focus west we'd be hardpressed to find room for them.

Actually, I'd be curious to know if the higher ups actually have figured out just how many ships a given base CAN support. Forget parking space for the ship's, I mean everything from clothing stores to base services. I .e. "CFB Halifax can support 13 Heavies max"

 

[Halifax Tar]

But then we bring the AOPS in...

Bell, even without shifting the focus west we'd be hardpressed to find room for them.

Actually, I'd be curious to know if the higher ups actually have figured out just how many ships a given base CAN support. Forget parking space for the ship's, I mean everything from clothing stores to base services. I .e. "CFB Halifax can support 13 Heavies max"

You bring up a very valid point.  Its not just as simple as sailing a few hulls from the right coast to the left...  This would be a huge logistic undertaking

 

[Stoker]

I don't know if I missed any news on TV but lots still going on in Europe and the Middle East. I doubt if we'll see any redeployment anytime soon, and if there were lots of releases.

 

[Kirkhill]

Why wouldn't you base all the AOPSs out of Halifax?  Assuming open waters in the North you are looking at Canadian coastal waters all the way from Grand Manan to Inuvik.

The west coast is cut off from the North by Alaska.

Esquimalt seems to make more sense for a Pacific bluewater fleet.

 

[Lumber]

Why wouldn't you base all the AOPSs out of Halifax? 

Lack of sufficient manning, jetty space or dor support?

Imagine no MCDVs and no AOPs on the west coast. How will SHADs get their navigation experience?

 

[Cronicbny]

Lack of sufficient manning, jetty space or dor support?

Imagine no MCDVs and no AOPs on the west coast. How will SHADs get their navigation experience?

Teaching RFPs how to navigate in Orcas?

 

[Lumber]

Teaching RFPs how to navigate in Orcas?

We'd nerd more Orcas.

 

[ringo]

Forward base frigate at Pearl, should help with crew retention.

 

[Lumber]

Forward base frigate at Pearl, should help with crew retention.

Where is the like button!!

 

[Underway]

I would still prefer Canada absorbing the turks and cacos and building a navy base there.

As for AOPS I think there are plans for around least two to go on the west coast.  If you move the orcas off the heavies jetty and place them over with the tenders or find them space on Y jetty or across the harbor at FDU you could find some space.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Where is the like button!!

haha I think I woul re-muster to Navy just for this  >

 

[dimsum]

And of *course* we'd have to get in with the USN's MQ-4C Triton UAV program, attaching Canadians to their planned squadrons at Pearl-Hickam, NAS Point Mugu (Los Angeles) and Kadena AB, Japan. 

I'll even let others take Hawaii and Japan; I'll go to LA  >

 

[Baz]

All the ISR Ops will be out of Jacksonville:
http://www.navytimes.com/article/20130205/NEWS/302050316/UAV-squadron-stand-up-Oct-1-1st-since-2007

There was some talk of Whidbey Island as well, but it looks like there isn't enough money.

 

[McG]

More media discussion on this possibility.

Navy should shift warships to West Coast in response to China’s aggressive military buildup, defence analysts say
Peter O’Neil,
Postmedia News
11 Aug 2013, 9:45 PM ET

Canada should get out of is cold war mindset and move the majority of its warships from Halifax to the B.C. coast in response to the Chinese navy’s aggressive military buildup, say defence analysts.

The U.S. government has already announced its plan to put 60 per cent of its naval assets on its west coast by 2020 as part of its plan to make the 21st century “America’s Pacific Century” — a term coined by former U.S. secretary of state Hillary Clinton.

The Canadian military’s tiny fleet of warships is split up on a 60-40 basis favouring the Atlantic coast, with seven frigates and two destroyers in Halifax compared to five frigates and one destroyer in Esquimalt.

When submarines, maritime patrol and supply vessels are included there are a total of 18 vessels assigned to Halifax, where approximately 5,000 military and 2,000 civilian personnel are located, and 15 to Esquimalt, where roughly 4,000 military and 2,000 civilian employees are stationed.

Analyst David McDonough said Ottawa should reverse the emphasis, with at least 60 per cent of the frigates and destroyers in B.C.

He also argued that once the submarine fleet is fully operational two of the three subs in service (one will always be in the Esquimalt dry dock undergoing repairs and upgrades) should be based out at Esquimalt.

“Nowadays, the threat on the East Coast is pretty mild, whereas the Pacific is a more dangerous environment,” McDonough, a post-doctoral fellow at the University of B.C.’s political science department, said in an interview Friday.

The U.S., Japan and Australia have all taken steps to expand their military muscle in response to the Chinese military’s naval buildup. Fears of a potential Pacific conflict have been exacerbated by China’s territorial disputes with the Philippines and Japan.

McDonough argued in a blog post last month that Canada could use its Victoria-class diesel submarines to develop an anti-submarine warfare capability in the region, though such a commitment would ultimately require costly purchases of a new fleet of subs and a replacement for the aged Aurora maritime patrol aircraft.

Such a contribution would help the cash-strapped Americans “at a time when China is expanding its own naval fleet and showing greater assertiveness in its maritime disputes with its neighbours,” he wrote.

Canada could pay for higher capital costs by reducing personnel, he argued.

Roger Girouard, a retired rear admiral who now teaches at the Royal Roads University in Victoria, says Canada should seek to become a “Pacific power.”

“Canada should not expect to make windfall profits from the positive outcomes of Asian markets if it is completely unwilling to invest in the security and stability that creates the positive environment for these very markets to flourish,” Girouard wrote in an essay published by the Canadian Defence and Foreign Affairs Institute.

A shift of assets and employees from Halifax to Esquimalt would face some tough political hurdles that start with Peter MacKay — an ambitious Nova Scotian and by far Atlantic Canada’s most powerful minister — who recently moved from the defence to the justice portfolio.

The Halifax Chronicle-Herald noted last week that the Halifax mayor and provincial politicians kicked up a huge fuss four years ago when the navy contemplated, but later abandoned, the notion of moving a single frigate to Esquimalt.

“There’s a certain military tradition in Halifax, so I can imagine they might not be that friendly to the notion of having more warships in Esquimalt than Halifax,” said McDonough.

But he said the “Pacific pivot” won’t result in a serious blow to Halifax’s status as a naval hub, given Canada’s commitment to North Atlantic Treaty Organization operations and exercises. Halifax will also be the base for the Arctic patrol vessels once they are built.

While a spokeswoman for new Defence Minister Rob Nicholson didn’t reply to request for comment Friday, federal officials have argued in the past that it is making a strong effort to respond to the Pacific’s soaring importance..

Both Prime Minister Stephen Harper and MacKay, when he headed the department, have taken steps to improve military ties with Asia-Pacific countries in concert with Canada’s successful bid to enter the trans-Pacific Partnership trade talks involving the U.S. and a number of important regional economic players.

And last year more than 1,400 Canadian military personnel took part in a U.S.-led military exercise that has taken place every two years since 1974. That was a record number, with Canadian officers occupying senior roles for the first time, McDonough noted.

Vice-Admiral Paul Maddison, who stepped down in June as head of the Royal Canadian Navy, told a Senate committee last year that Canadian naval forces have been “as present as we could be” in the Asia-Pacific in recent years.

“I believe we have balanced — to the best of our ability — the ships that we have and the sea days that we have with the opportunities to work alongside our allies in the Pacific, in the European NATO area and, of course, in other areas of the world, such as, increasingly in the past 20 years, the Persian Gulf; the Indian Ocean; the Caribbean, especially in the counter-narcotics mission; and in the Arctic,” he explained.

“It is a question of balancing all of these priorities to get maximum strategic effect for Canada.”

But retired commodore Eric Lerhe, who also favours more forces in the Pacific, told the Halifax Chronicle-Herald last week that Canada has only put up “token” resources in the Pacific.

“We need something to demonstrate this is real, that this is a credible, long-term, and, I argue, forward-presence contribution.”

http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/08/11/navy-should-shift-warships-to-west-coast-in-response-to-chinas-aggressive-military-buildup-defence-analysts-say/

 

[dimsum]

All the ISR Ops will be out of Jacksonville:
http://www.navytimes.com/article/20130205/NEWS/302050316/UAV-squadron-stand-up-Oct-1-1st-since-2007

There was some talk of Whidbey Island as well, but it looks like there isn't enough money.

Seems like that article is pay-per-view or something.  So Jax instead of Creech is basically the story there?