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New Canadian Shipbuilding Strategy

  • Thread starter Thread starter GAP
  • Start date Start date
Good2Golf said:
Dare one ask what a "Maritime Support Ship" is? ???

My bet is that it's a way for Irving to draw billions more from the public purse to deliver (late and in a state of disrepair) a platform that offshore builders could deliver for a fraction of the price in a timely manner.
 
I'm going to go out on a limb and predict it will have stalls to embark Unicorns, and special holds to store rainbows...

:2c:
 
Good2Golf said:
I'm going to go out on a limb and predict it will have stalls to embark Unicorns, and special holds to store rainbows...

:2c:
Don't forget the Sunny Ways catchers on the top.
 
dapaterson said:
My bet is that it's a way for --insert company here-- to draw billions more from the public purse to deliver (late and in a state of disrepair) a platform or product that offshore builders or vendors could deliver for a fraction of the price in a timely manner.
And there's you have Canadian defence acquisition policy in an almost-Twitter-length passage.

My haiku version
Forces need some stuff.
Off the rack?  Nope.  Too cheap and
no local content.

 
Lumber said:
Here comes the Navy!
All fat and filled with gravy!
Irving gets money.
Now, if only they'd let us do haiku summaries for briefing notes  >:D
 
IRO cracked in two.
A replacement, we can do!
Build it in Quebec.

This is fun!  ;D
 
MilEME09 said:
Apparently irving is trying to pitch some kind of "maritime support ship" for humanitarian operations to the goverment. To be revealed at CANSEC on wednesday.

Sent from my LG-D852 using Tapatalk

A RO/RO with a helipad on top and crane, with a portable hospital inside, done!
 
Colin P said:
A RO/RO with a helipad on top and crane, with a portable hospital inside, done!
Honkin' big ship here.
No Forces need?  Too easy -
Make it a "help" ship!
 
Colin P said:
A RO/RO with a helipad on top and crane, with a portable hospital inside, done!

pkugwglxj2eqbdqycnhg.jpg


MV Cragside

http://gizmodo.com/the-u-s-a-s-floating-special-forces-base-sure-doesnt-lo-1603035635
 
I think the actual purpose of this Cragside vessel needs clarification. The Gizmodo article makes no sense:

Craigside apparently can launch and recover "numerous" UAV and house weapons, small craft, 200 special forces, is cheap to operate etc etc.  Ok, I get that. Plus it does not tie up a large warship like an LPD/LPH etc. 

But then they go to say a benefit is that this is a platform leased and converted to supposedly deal with whatever undefined legal issues there may be with deploying special forces from a warship by remaining in international waters. This makes no sense since presumably US military aircraft (Osprey, Sea Stallion etc) would cross into sovereign airspace and deliver the goods. What it does create is a legal issue and hell of a risk of having a civilian flagged vessel attacked in International Waters in retaliation for whatever the mission of the special forces might undertake. It would be an act of war if the vessel was a warship or an act potentially leading to war it it was a civilian ship with military personnel on board. In any event, a warship can also remain in International Waters and conduct special ops insertion evolutions.  Most retaliatory attackers would think twice about that, since a warship is usually armed,  can defend itself and can call on nearby friends for help.  On the other hand, PMC personnel could operate from such a ship, and if it was attacked, there might be lesser consequences all around? other than cost, I do not see any real advantage here. It is not as if the ship is a stealth ship whose locations and activities cannot be monitored by any half decent intel organization.
 
Need a ship right now?
No, well, here's one anyways!
Davie is Satan.

>:D
 
Lumber said:
Need a ship right now?
No, well, here's one anyways!
Davie is Satan.
But a polite Satan, it appears - this, from the Davie Info-machine ...
Davie commends Irving Shipbuilding on taking a positive and innovative approach to solving some of the major capability gaps facing the Royal Canadian Navy and Canadian Coast Guard with regards to the current federal shipbuilding programs.

Last week, Irving Shipbuilding provided an unsolicited proposal to the Government of Canada for the provision of a converted ship for humanitarian relief operations.

Over the past months it has become widely acknowledged that Canada faces significant and long-term capability gaps in its fleet capability, particularly as a result of delays in the delivery of Canada's much-needed non-combat vessels.

Realizing this, East coast shipyards in Canada's key shipbuilding hubs in Nova Scotia and Quebec have pro-actively provided alternative, cost-efficient and innovative ways to convert existing commercial vessels to fill gaps in Canada's non-combat fleet. In particular, for Humanitarian Relief, Icebreaker and Multirole Support vessels.

Speaking at the CANSEC exhibition in Ottawa, Alex Vicefield, Davie's Chairman today commented "Irving Shipbuilding is confirming what has been universally recognized over the past months, including by the Government of Canada in the Canada Transportation Act review. That there are several classes of ship which Canada urgently needs and the current shipbuilding program is not capable of delivering. This is a great initiative from Irving Shipbuilding - these kind of unsolicited proposals where industry takes what it has learnt in how to provide fast-track, cost-efficient solutions to address critical operational gaps, is exactly what is needed right now."

Mr. Vicefield added "We must pursue these kind of interim and supplementary programs to ensure that we can close the capability gaps which either currently exist, or shortly will, in Canada's federal fleet. Of course this can't be done without bringing in the capacity of Canada's largest and highest capacity shipbuilder. We must look back to the origins and the original recommendations that industry made to the previous government and reconsider how the full capacity of Canada's shipbuilding industry can optimize fleet renewal and ensure a continuous work flow."

Just prior to the launch of the National Shipbuilding Procurement Strategy, Davie and Irving Shipbuilding signed a Memorandum of Understanding to ensure sufficient capacity within the shipbuilding programs to deliver the number of ships required, on budget and on time. The agreement was based around seven key principles involving collaboration in technology, management, shipbuilding capacity and work sharing to ensure value for money for Canada ...
 
whiskey601 said:
I think the actual purpose of this Cragside vessel needs clarification. The Gizmodo article makes no sense:

Craigside apparently can launch and recover "numerous" UAV and house weapons, small craft, 200 special forces, is cheap to operate etc etc.  Ok, I get that. Plus it does not tie up a large warship like an LPD/LPH etc. 

But then they go to say a benefit is that this is a platform leased and converted to supposedly deal with whatever undefined legal issues there may be with deploying special forces from a warship by remaining in international waters. This makes no sense since presumably US military aircraft (Osprey, Sea Stallion etc) would cross into sovereign airspace and deliver the goods. What it does create is a legal issue and hell of a risk of having a civilian flagged vessel attacked in International Waters in retaliation for whatever the mission of the special forces might undertake. It would be an act of war if the vessel was a warship or an act potentially leading to war it it was a civilian ship with military personnel on board. In any event, a warship can also remain in International Waters and conduct special ops insertion evolutions.  Most retaliatory attackers would think twice about that, since a warship is usually armed,  can defend itself and can call on nearby friends for help.  On the other hand, PMC personnel could operate from such a ship, and if it was attacked, there might be lesser consequences all around? other than cost, I do not see any real advantage here. It is not as if the ship is a stealth ship whose locations and activities cannot be monitored by any half decent intel organization.

The US (and the Brits) already deploy military assets from civil fleets on the high seas.  They have being doing it forever.  The Royal Navy started with pressed civilian vessels.

Regardless of the manning issues, and the status varying on the threat level and employment, the point is that the vessel represents a transport and basing capability.  Yes, it has no defensive capability, but that gives a Task Force something to do.
 
I had a look at their model today.  Weird looking bastard.  They have a ton of containers up forward under the weather deck.  Not exactly clear how they get there or out.  :dunno:

Davies on the other hand had a good VR headset where you took a bit of a tour inside and out to a Cyclone and up during a two point RAS.  Their booth while smaller, seemed to want you to come see.  Irving were acting like they owned the place and weren't necessarily wanting uniformed visitors.
 
jollyjacktar said:
I had a look at their model today.  Weird looking *******.  They have a ton of containers up forward under the weather deck.  Not exactly clear how they get there or out.  :dunno:

Davies on the other hand had a good VR headset where you took a bit of a tour inside and out to a Cyclone and up during a two point RAS.  Their booth while smaller, seemed to want you to come see.  Irving were acting like they owned the place and weren't necessarily wanting uniformed visitors.

Is there a website that has that info?
 
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