New Canadian Shipbuilding Strategy

[Stoker]

Yeah, that's not going to happen. MCDVs are already being transferred to the East coast in preparation for future scrapping.

The demilitarization is the big driving factor, there is all kinds of weird things that are controlled goods (and ITAR specifically).

Maybe ask for the Oriole and get started now?

There isn't a shortage of possible vessels to convert though, so no reason it has to be RCN vessels.

Dual purpose really. Yellowknife and Edmonton was sent as they had time on this SSI's, they were in rough shape. They should be deploying in a few weeks. Heading out to BC this fall to conduct a readiness program on another. I would imagine the rest will either be tugged out or under their own power eventually.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Dual purpose really. Yellowknife and Edmonton was sent as they had time on this SSI's, they were in rough shape. They should be deploying in a few weeks. Heading out to BC this fall to conduct a readiness program on another. I would imagine the rest will either be tugged out or under their own power eventually.

Makes sense to do it a bit early for East coast deployments, but also seems like it would be a pretty memorable trip for the crew generally, so not a bad last big sail.

Last I heard, the intent was for them all to do it under their own power before being wound down, but as with all plans, reality sometimes gets in the way so will see if that happens. Hopefully it does, as I think it would be a good experience (and great training opportunity), but also long distance planned tows are a lot more work, and all the normal things we are normally waived from as a military vessel apply as soon it's hooked up to a civilian tug as basically a barge.

 

[YZT580]

Not all the Reef Societies and whoever dreamed up that policy had better take a hard look at the new realities of ship scrapping, the costs of scrapping have shot up through the roof. Not to mention the GHG emissions that the government will have to account for.
The only scrapper on this coast has been shut down. It's actually easier to prep a ship for reefing, than it is for scrapping and you can have the asbestos remain on board.

The ARSBC will no longer take custody of a ship, but will assist in planning location, permitting, consultation and developing the sink plan, explosive layout. This removes the issues from all previous reefings, both successful and otherwise.

Hydrocarbons- Must be removed for both scrapping/reefing
PCB's - Must be removed for both scrapping/reefing
bottom paint - depending on the type and age can be left on for reefing
High Value metals (Brass, copper, stainless, etc)- removed for both scrapping/reefing
ITAR items- Likely must be removed for both scrapping/reefing.

Don't know about the maritime facilities but Port Colborne marine recycling is always busy

 

[Stoker]

Makes sense to do it a bit early for East coast deployments, but also seems like it would be a pretty memorable trip for the crew generally, so not a bad last big sail.

Last I heard, the intent was for them all to do it under their own power before being wound down, but as with all plans, reality sometimes gets in the way so will see if that happens. Hopefully it does, as I think it would be a good experience (and great training opportunity), but also long distance planned tows are a lot more work, and all the normal things we are normally waived from as a military vessel apply as soon it's hooked up to a civilian tug as basically a barge.

Never heard about the others under their own power as I thought their SSI's are expired. I suppose they could do a RA. If so good news for me as I love visiting San Diego as we now do all the WC Kingston Class and probably all HDW Class programs now that WC Patrol is no more.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Never heard about the others under their own power as I thought their SSI's are expired. I suppose they could do a RA. If so good news for me as I love visiting San Diego as we now do all the WC Kingston Class and probably all HDW Class programs now that WC Patrol is no more.

Could be, I shifted out of ADM(Mat) last year to a purple job so not keeping track.

I mean, they sailed ATH across the Atlantic through storms with an SSI that was limited to sea state 2, and just RAd that they'd avoid the storms (they didn't) so who knows. I think the actual condition of the hull, in particular the fuel tanks would be critical, but a quick docking for repairs may actually be cheaper than a tow that far. When we checked for PRO, the lift ships were booked something like 3-4 years out, and suspect it's not really any better now.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Could be, I shifted out of ADM(Mat) last year to a purple job so not keeping track.

I mean, they sailed ATH across the Atlantic through storms with an SSI that was limited to sea state 2, and just RAd that they'd avoid the storms (they didn't) so who knows. I think the actual condition of the hull, in particular the fuel tanks would be critical, but a quick docking for repairs may actually be cheaper than a tow that far. When we checked for PRO, the lift ships were booked something like 3-4 years out, and suspect it's not really any better now.

VDC seems a lot less busy and has a new drydock as well, I suspect tariffs have slowed the work.

 

[Nvlgzr]

Yeah, that's not going to happen. MCDVs are already being transferred to the East coast in preparation for future scrapping.

The demilitarization is the big driving factor, there is all kinds of weird things that are controlled goods (and ITAR specifically).

Maybe ask for the Oriole and get started now?

There isn't a shortage of possible vessels to convert though, so no reason it has to be RCN vessels.

Plenty of vessels on the used market that could fit the bill: Yachts for Sale

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

Humour aside; the feeling I get from this forum is that Oriole should have been divested decades ago.

She should have been divested before I joined in 1975. She was 54 years old then (yep - Oriole is almost as old as the damn RCN).

She is now over 100 years old, but unlike HMS Victory or Old Ironside in the US, she has absolutely zero historical value.

Everyone feel free to draw your own conclusion.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Plenty of vessels on the used market that could fit the bill: Yachts for Sale

Yachts are generally built to a light standards to save costs and speed. I would prefer a purpose built brigantine to steel hull commercial standards and equipped with adequate berthing and hotel services from the start, roughly 150' long and on the beamy side, so she has the room for training, fuel for Transocean voyages and good seakeeping.

 

[dapaterson]

All we need is a sloop with cracked four pounders.

 

[Nvlgzr]

Yachts are generally built to a light standards to save costs and speed. I would prefer a purpose built brigantine to steel hull commercial standards and equipped with adequate berthing and hotel services from the start, roughly 150' long and on the beamy side, so she has the room for training, fuel for Transocean voyages and good seakeeping.

Sounds like requirements creep to me. If you ask for new, then all sorts of issues crop up that only delay and increase costs. Find something relatively new on the used market that isn’t that much different than present. Otherwise, it attracts too much attention, becoming a big issue and taxpayers start asking questions like, “What does any navy need a sailing ship for?”. Then you end up with a dozen Sunfish or Lasers (if you’re lucky).

 

[Colin Parkinson]

All we need is a sloop with cracked four pounders.

and a dozen broken Cadets on a Halifax pier

 

[Stoker]

Yachts are generally built to a light standards to save costs and speed. I would prefer a purpose built brigantine to steel hull commercial standards and equipped with adequate berthing and hotel services from the start, roughly 150' long and on the beamy side, so she has the room for training, fuel for Transocean voyages and good seakeeping.

There are all kinds of options for a replacement of Oriole. I however suspect there is no appetite for a new sail training ship for the RCN. We'd be better off acquiring the CSC, JSS, RCD, ORCA replacement, Continental Corvettes, Wingman Arsenal ships, submarine rescue and dive and infrastructure support ships before we waste resources on that. Oriole is a sad example of wasted resources for the RCN.

 

[Halifax Tar]

There are all kinds of options for a replacement of Oriole. I however suspect there is no appetite for a new sail training ship for the RCN. We'd be better off acquiring the CSC, JSS, RCD, ORCA replacement, Continental Corvettes, Wingman Arsenal ships, submarine rescue and dive and infrastructure support ships before we waste resources on that. Oriole is a sad example of wasted resources for the RCN.

Let's take Orioles budget and put it towards jetty infrastructure or spare parts.

 

[Nvlgzr]

I take back what I said. Most Canadians aren’t aware that we have a navy. They know that we have an Air Force because they’ve seen the Snowbirds.But a navy? No that’s for Americans and their magnificent aircraft carriers. If they knew that we are buying Frigate/Destroyers for the eye watering price of 5 billion a copy they might be screaming. So, I suggest we buy a 300 foot brigantine. Why if Mexico can have a big ass sailing ship in their little navy; then we need something bigger and better !

 

[OldSolduer]

All we need is a sloop with cracked four pounders.

Oh the year was 1778....

 

[Stoker]

I take back what I said. Most Canadians aren’t aware that we have a navy. They know that we have an Air Force because they’ve seen the Snowbirds.But a navy? No that’s for Americans and their magnificent aircraft carriers. If they knew that we are buying Frigate/Destroyers for the eye watering price of 5 billion a copy they might be screaming. So, I suggest we buy a 300 foot brigantine. Why if Mexico can have a big ass sailing ship in their little navy; then we need something bigger and better !

Mexico has a navy?

 

[GK .Dundas]

Oh the year was 1778....

How I wish I was in Sherbrooke now .

 

[lenaitch]

Mexico has a navy?

Yes, they sailed it into the Brooklyn Bridge.

 

[Stoker]

Yes, they sailed it into the Brooklyn Bridge.

Being sarcastic of course.. No honking big sailboat less likely to sail it into things with people up aloft.