PSAC Strike Actions and Some Reactions- Merged Thread

[bossi]

If the forces has an issue with strength does it not make sense that the effect is mitigated by utilizing employees that would not detract from the service strength.

Face it, we don't need janitors that can fire a rifle if all they are needed for is mopping the floor.

Conversely, wouldn't it be nice to have some more personnel who could fire weapons ... ?

I recall a conversation on this topic regarding engineers.  As more and more garrison positions were converted to civilian carpenters, etc. it meant that there weren't as many opportunities for troops to have a pause from operational deployments ... (hmmm ... ya know, the notion of civilianising and out-sourcing sure sounds like "it seemed like a good idea at the time" ... but perhaps short-sighted in the grand scheme fo things ...).

This problem hit home in Kabul in Camp Warehouse.  It became painfully, even embarassing apparent when drawing up the fire picquet roster - all the civvies enjoyed a full night's sleep ...
(and then there was the time our generators all crapped out in the middle of the night, and we had to wait until the next day when the contractor ... you get my point)

 

[childs56]

Yes you must love greed by the people who while their workers are on strike and receiving no money, they are still receiving a decent sum of money. yes lets put it off till christmas time, that way tempers will flare when people have little or no money for Christmas. How does this effect all of us, lets see more taxes= more pay increases,= less money to the average non union person=loss of jobs=more welfare required=more taxes=less for pay raises. As we can see it is a revolving door. From what I can see we are all going to suffer, whether it is lack of fisheries patrolling the poachers or the tax man doing even less for more. As a member of the CF these strikes really dont effect us that much as in pay raises go, but they do effect the way we do business and its the impedence that is the worst.

 

[George Wallace]

CTD

Man....are you ever ill informed.....

GW

 

[portcullisguy]

I understand that this is reality but why are our pay rates directly related to the pay rates of a civilian UNION?   They shouldn't have anything to do with one another.

Yes, it's true.

As members of Canada's military, we are not entitled to form a collective bargaining unit, and we are not entitled to petition for changes to our pay & benefits.

However, the Treasury Board Secretariat defines and sets all pay & benefits policy for the entire public service, including the military and RCMP.   Even when they are not directly negotiating with a bargaining unit, the policies apply, and quite often the pay rates are used as a basis for comparison.

When Revenue Canada (which was under Treasury Board) became the Canada Customs and Revenue Agency (a separate employer), the CCRA kept all the same classification categories, pay levels, and HR policies in the interim, until it wrote new polciies, added classification categories, and made new agreements.   When customs officers were under CCRA, we were still classified as PM-02's.   However, because our agreement with CCRA was different than the rest of the public service under Treasury, their PM-02's were paid less.   Then, in December, we went back under Treasury with the formation of the new Canada Border Services Agency, and now Treasury thinks we have been "overpaid" for the last 3 years, and this is affecting our ability to get a fair and equitable contract offer.

The reason I state all this is to highlight that the Treasury Board runs the show for the entire public service, directly or indirectly.

In the case of the military, our rates of pay are based on equivalents for the rest of the public service.   A PM-02 is roughly paid the same as a Corporal-B (A Master Corporal), and our duties and responsibilities are in the roughest of terms, similar (although as an aside, when customs officers go overseas on UN missions with the military, we are generally given a "equivalent" rank of Lieutenant, and are paid roughly the same).

If the rest of the public service doesn't have a contract, Treasury Board doesn't have a basis or comparison for increasing the pay for the military until the other bargaining units settle.

So, indirectly, the outcome of the public service strike affects our pay in the military.

In fact, right on the DND's website, you are given this information in a very large hint:  

"The Directorate of Pay Policy Development is responsible for the strategic advancement of Canadian Forces compensation policy, within the guidelines provided by Treasury Board, in such a way as to enhance the Forces' ability to attract, retain and motivate its most valuable resource - its members."http://www.forces.gc.ca/dgcb/dppd/engraph/home_e.asp?sidesection=3

 

[brin11]

I've been waiting from the beginining of this thread for someone to bring up hockey.  After all, we are in Canada.  Bossi, you didn't disappoint. 

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

That had civvies in Kabul???

 

[bossi]

That had civvies in Kabul???

Not sure if I understood your question, CFL.
There were PSP civvies to run the rec facilities/clubs and make HLTA bookings.
Also there were civvy CANCAP hires - quite a few young men from Nepal, working in the kitchens and swabbing out the shower tents.

The point being, none of these civvies were eligible to pick up a weapon if push came to shove.

 

[bossi]

I've been waiting from the beginining of this thread for someone to bring up hockey.   After all, we are in Canada.   Bossi, you didn't disappoint.    

Hockey ALWAYS belongs on Army.ca - it's "War on Ice", and one of our two national sports
(Lacrosse being "The Little War").

 

[geo]

This morning started off nicely.
The union was picketing the main gate in Longue Pointe (Langelier entrance).
Everything was kept VERY civil - no effort to block military personnel from entering
Not the same story for PSAC employees who tried to enter though....

They were handing out leaflets that discuss their negociation results so far.... 1.5  1.5  1.2  and 1.2% over the next four years.
Considering the increase in the price of gas.... this isn't going to go very far... is it ???
(they were handing out "joe Louis" snack cakes with the leaflets..... IE - offer is considered "chump change")

BTW - Joe Louis with morning coffee.... not bad

 

[cavalryman]

Considering Public Service executives just got a 2% cost of living increase, I can't blame PSAC for being annoyed.

 

[OldSolduer]

I'm retired from the military and now PRes.

I work in a prison. We've been without a contract for over two years now.
The other day at lunch, the kitchen staff put out peanuts in the shell for us. Very nice.

I guess the provincial government heard we would work for peanuts......(groan here optional).

Meanwhile the government voted themselves a huge raise.

 

[jollyjacktar]

As I mentioned earlier in another thread, one of the tables in FMF Cape Scott received a 22% raise last week.  Needless to say this has set the remainder off and I expect that the negotiations will be nasty.  They were handing out pamphlets at the gates locally too.  Looks like there will be a gun fight between the two sides.  Go get em PSAC!