Retired Soldier Who Died Christmas Day Committed Suicide, Husband Contends

[PMedMoe]

My condolences to the family.  This news event is not helping the cause of PTSD treatment for veterans suffering from an OSI.  This individual did not have an OSI and did not serve anywhere that an OSI was possible.  Yes, PTSD is possible from any traumatic event in one's life dependent on the mental fitness of an individual but this event has nothing to do with the cause of veterans and OSI.  A lifetime mental illness also manifests itself later in life as changes to our older bodies can make it hard to stay on an emotional even keel.

No where in the article did it say she was suffering from an OSI, only PTSD.

I see no mention of a note left to family and friends, nothing to indicate a suicide.

Right from the news article:

MacEachern, who suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder, had left a note for her family.

Also, in regards to her having to leave the forces due to harassment.  I understand that but "frustration" does not equal PTSD.

You equate harassment with "frustration"?  Seriously?

I feel PTSD is a buzzword that's now getting overused and we're attributing every suicide to it.

I agree.  I also agree it seems that her spouse is pushing an agenda.

 

[Bzzliteyr]

You equate harassment with "frustration"?  Seriously?

Maybe I misworded what I was trying to say. I feel people are using PTSD to write off suicides.  If I'm angry with the military (ie, was forced to leave the forces due to harrassment) and then subsequently kill myself, is it PTSD? No. it's me killing myself because of the situation.

I'm actually having a hard time expressing what I mean, I hope you understand.

 

[PMedMoe]

I'm actually having a hard time expressing what I mean, I hope you understand.

Yes, I do.

 

[Danjanou]

The newspaper never said anything about Germany (or the CF) being involved.  I would imagine that overseas bases would have been on some kind of alert though.

I was in Baden In September 1980 and if I remember correctly we went on a higher level of alert, with all the reulting fun and games involved. There was also a couple of shite disturbers in Poland  (a Cardinal and a Union type) making the Soviets a bit antsy that month too. Lot of fun interfering with the normal post Reforger drills of clena kit  and leave.

Re the auto branding of all these cases by the MSN with PTSD I agree. I'm sure in some instances it is something else. There are varius types and forms of depression and other mental health issues that if left undiagnosed or untreated could and have lead to suicide. If memory serves wasn't one of the suicides prior to Christmas a young recently enrolled soldier still in trainiing with no deployments. While it is possible he could have developed PTSD from some where ( accident etc.) most likely this may have been a case of something else.

One of the problems with mental health issues is they often are not as easy to immedialty recognize and therefore treat. A broken leg easy to notice, a broken mind or soul not so. Toss in the stigma still associate dwith this tyoe of illness, especially so in the military, altough not as bad as in my day thankfully ("Ah you're sad buttercup, I don't care , buck ruck up and carry on")  and many will continue to suffer in silence.

End of the day we have lost one of our own and should mourn that. Could it have been prevented, who knows? What was the reason, does it matter except in the instance that we may be able to rpevent the next one? I'll mourn her and at least draw some small comfort that her pain has ended.

 

[Journeyman]

I'm actually having a hard time expressing what I mean, I hope you understand.

Yes, I do.

I think we all do, but it's a slow day and we're content to watch you squirm.    op:

       

 

[Bzzliteyr]

I'll mourn her and at least draw some small comfort that her pain has ended.

Ditto.

 

[winnipegoo7]

The Iran-Iraq War, also known as the First Persian Gulf War was an armed conflict between the Islamic Republic of Iran and the Republic of Iraq lasting from September 1980 to August 1988.

The article doesn't say "First Persian Gulf War." So either the author got the name of the war wrong or got the dates wrong I guess.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

My condolences to the family.  This news event is not helping the cause of PTSD treatment for veterans suffering from an OSI.  This individual did not have an OSI and did not serve anywhere that an OSI was possible.  Yes, PTSD is possible from any traumatic event in one's life dependent on the mental fitness of an individual but this event has nothing to do with the cause of veterans and OSI.  A lifetime mental illness also manifests itself later in life as changes to our older bodies can make it hard to stay on an emotional even keel. 

I see no mention of a note left to family and friends, nothing to indicate a suicide.  I tried to get some information on the incident of harassment, indeed and could not find any.  My memory serves that some allegations were proved but the individual went on to serve and retired successfully under the 20/40 program.  I also remember at the time W5 doing a story on the dental filllings material in question and that the evidence was not conclusive.

Indeed, there is no evidence that this auto accident is self inflicted, this may well be a distracted driver or a medication induced inattention.  I am sorry but this is tragedy for a family at Xmas and nothing more, no conspiracy of government, military, VA and/or the German Dental Guild.

Please post your medical CV. Especially the parts that cover your psychological\ psychiatric expertise in the areas of PTSD, anxiety and depression. Scans of your diplomas in these areas would also be appreciated. I know Dr\ patient confidentiality bars you from talking about your sessions that led you to these determinations.

Otherwise, sit back down in your easy chair and quit trying to Monday morning quarterback someone's mental\ medical condition.

If that's not plain enough for you, STFU about something you know nothing about.

That goes for the rest of you that think you can come on here and determine what the causes and reasons are for the death of this person.

As to her husband's motives, ditto to the above.

This is a tragedy that has happened to one of our own. Leave it at that and have some feeling for the remaining family.

Accident or suicide, it doesn't matter. A cherished life has been lost.

Quit making a circus of it.

 

[OldSolduer]

At this time I would like to extend our condolences to the family, friends and comrades. 

Its a difficult time.

 

[Navy_Pete]

Came across this today as a pretty shameful addendum to a sad story;

I think it's time to stop talking about reforming VAC and just let the motherf*cker burn, then start over from the ground up with an entirely new group of people.  I am appalled and saddened by the callous and automatic bureaucratic follow up, seems indicative of a completely broken system.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/after-veteran-s-death-government-demands-581-benefits-repayment-1.1660614

After veteran's death, government demands $581 benefits repayment
CTVNews.ca Staff
Published Tuesday, January 28, 2014 10:03PM EST
Last Updated Tuesday, January 28, 2014 11:18PM EST

Just days after the funeral of a Canadian veteran who died of suicide on Christmas Day, her husband received a letter from Veterans Affairs saying the family must repay a portion of her monthly disability cheque.

The letter, dated Jan. 9 -- a day after retired Cpl. Leona MacEachern’s husband publicly revealed that her death was in fact a suicide -- expresses condolences to the family while asking for a repayment of $581.67.

In an email to CTV News, Tom MacEachern called it “a slap in the face.”

“(I) didn’t know whether to laugh or cry…was breathless actually,” he said.

The letter from Veterans Affairs begins with: “We have recently been advised of the death of Mrs. MacEachern. Our most sincere sympathy is extended to you and your family at this time.”

It goes on to say that “Earnings Loss benefits paid under the Canadian Forces Members and Veterans Re-establishment and Compensation Act are payable up to the day of Mrs. MacEachern’s death.

“Therefore, an overpayment of $581.67 has been created for December 2013.”

    Read the full letter here

The letter says the family will be contacted by the “Overpayment Unit in the near future.”

On Tuesday, the office of Veterans Affairs Minister Julian Fantino told CTV News that the decision to collect the money has been reversed.

“Minister Fantino has directed the department to not collect any money from the estate or the family of Mrs. MacEachern,” it said in a statement.

“He sends his deepest condolences to MacEachern family during this difficult time.”

After learning of the reversal, Tom MacEachern said that if the condolences “count as an apology, then I guess we will have to accept it at face value.”

“Of course it’s a very small amount of money considering a life was lost that should have been saved,” he said in an email.

MacEachern, a 20-year veteran of the Canadian Armed Forces, died on Dec. 25, 2013 when she intentionally drove her car into an oncoming transport truck on the Trans-Canada highway near Calgary.

The 51-year-old mother had suffered from post-traumatic stress disorder.

Her husband and family were critical of the services offered to MacEachern to treat her PTSD, and said that she had slipped through the cracks of a system that barely exists.

The letter from Veterans Affairs about the $581 repayment “shows Canadians how this department trivializes the humanity of these situations,” her husband said.

Liberal veterans’ affairs critic Jim Karygiannis said the letter "only shows the callousness of this government.

“They should be ashamed of themselves. I'm just horrified.”

With a report from CTV's Richard Madan

 

[Infanteer]

Ahh....bureaucrats at their finest....

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

When people die the paperwork needs to be done,........gettin' sick of lots of folks who think the same rules don't apply because they served.

 

[Jarnhamar]

It's funny how fast VA seems to work when they want money, compared to when they owe it.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Just like any part of the Govt. machine......

 

[PPCLI Guy]

When people die the paperwork needs to be done,........gettin' sick of lots of folks who think the same rules don't apply because they served.

:goodpost:

Amen brother.  We are not nearly as special as we like to think - and we are pissing away the credibility that 10 years of war and too many dead and injured has afforded us.

 

[jollyjacktar]

When people die the paperwork needs to be done,........gettin' sick of lots of folks who think the same rules don't apply because they served.

Maybe so, but... I am tired of the faceless f-sticks being so damn heartless or seemingly so.  How's about a bit of compassion.  Regardless of whom they were, would it really kill the system to maybe let (any family) have the month's benefits before cutting them off.  Clawing back seems petty, bullying and beneath what should be.  FFS, it's not like anyone's making Bill Gates kind of wages over a portion of ANY month?  I think not.

Justice doesn't just need to be done it needs to be seen to be done and the optics in any case like this are bad.  I don't give a damn who you are, what you've done or where you've been or not.  Beancounting apparatchiks don't need to be douche bags all of the time.  As a taxpayer, I am happy for my 5 cents or portion thereof being used towards the total amount of funds distributed to the bank account of a fellow citizen who died that month.  There's more than $500+ dollars of negative press generated by DVA with moves like this, and frankly Fantino and Co (or any Party/Dept) can't afford it.  Backpeddling as they've done is shutting the barn door after the horse has vacated the premisis.  Looks like it tastes on the tongue.  Shittty...

 

[Teager]

I don't think the husband was disputing the payment I think he was more in shock at the speed of the letter. I think having someone call personally and explain the situation would have been a better method. That and maybe give a bit of time as obviously emotions are still running high. There are better ways of dealing with situations like this.

Just because there are policy's in place doesn't always make them right. The system is broken in places and those places have been identified with proper fixes. Whether or not those fixes are put in place remains to be unseen.

 

[George Wallace]

Maybe so, but... I am tired of the faceless f-sticks being so damn heartless or seemingly so.  How's about a bit of compassion.  Regardless of whom they were, would it really kill the system to maybe let (any family) have the month's benefits before cutting them off.  Clawing back seems petty, bullying and beneath what should be.  FFS, it's not like anyone's making Bill Gates kind of wages over a portion of ANY month?  I think not.

Justice doesn't just need to be done it needs to be seen to be done and the optics in any case like this are bad.  I don't give a damn who you are, what you've done or where you've been or not.  Beancounting apparatchiks don't need to be douche bags all of the time.  As a taxpayer, I am happy for my 5 cents or portion thereof being used towards the total amount of funds distributed to the bank account of a fellow citizen who died that month.  There's more than $500+ dollars of negative press generated by DVA with moves like this, and frankly Fantino and Co (or any Party/Dept) can't afford it.  Backpeddling as they've done is shutting the barn door after the horse has vacated the premisis.  Looks like it tastes on the tongue.  Shittty...

Let's get real here.  It was a poorly handled situation.  It should not have been one letter offering condolences and the stating that they were recouping the payment made after her death.  It should have been at the very least, two letters with an appropriate amount of time in between mailings.  Was it wrong to recoup the payment?  No.  It was bad taste in the way it was done. 

This whole affair, however, places the plight of Veteran's in a poor light, as it comes off as "whining" about a perceived wrong.  It detracts from the more serious legitimate complaints of Veterans.

 

[Navy_Pete]

They've also probably now burned through 10s of thousands in staff time between the paperwork, briefing notes up to the minister, PA folks etc.

Someone should have taken a sanity check and just written off the overpayment.  There is some discretion in the TBS guidlines and pretty sure if they have gone up the chain with that may have gotten signed off.  At the very least they could have gotten approval for delaying the recovery.

 

[Pusser]

Someone should have taken a sanity check and just written off the overpayment.  There is some discretion in the TBS guidlines and pretty sure if they have gone up the chain with that may have gotten signed off.  At the very least they could have gotten approval for delaying the recovery.

No.  The Financial Administration Act (FAA) is pretty clear - all attempts must be made to recover overpayments.  Only after all attempts have been made, can an overpayment be declared unrecoverable and then written-off.  And it must be truly unrecoverable.  Simply dying does not make an amount unrecoverable (the country becomes a creditor with a claim on the estate).  It is also worth noting that even if something is written-off, it can still be recovered at a later date should circumstances change.  In short, the bureaucrats were doing their job.  Could they have done it differently and, therfore, perhaps better?  Probably, but that does not negate the fact that by law, the money still had to be recovered and VAC was obligated to try and do so.  Now we have a situation where a Minister has publicly stated that the payment will now be forgiven.  He doesn't actually have the authority to do this.  Only Treasury Board does.  I don't know if the Minister of Veterans' Affairs is even a member of Treasury Board, but even if he was, he would have to recuse himself from this discussion.  What will happen now is that TB will retroactively approve the write-off, so as not to embarrass the Minister/Government.  Not exactly the best way to do things.

For the opposition parties to now lambaste VAC and the Government over this is disingenuous politicking.  As I said before, the LAW is quite clear and ALL Members of Parliament are responsible for the law of the land.  Should the rules be changed?  Probably, because as they stand, the FAA is quite inflexible and there should be a few changes.  Other amendments are probably in order to prevent a situation like this repeating itself.  There are CF regulations that state certain benefits only cease at the end of a month where a change occurs, so Parliament can probably amend the appropriate legislation to do something similar here.  Now we just need the political will and all parties to be on board.