Taliban Information warfare
- Thread starter a_majoor
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I've already debunked the "Aznar effect" in previous posts, I am also one of those liberals who blame 9/11 on Bush. If it were not for Bush's willful suspension of intelligence activity against Al Qaeda, his determination to regulate Islamic Terror to a sideline issue, the woeful state of readiness of the CIA and FBI ( which Clinton also shares some blame for), his and Rumsfield's efforts to put the limelight on their missile defence program and (later)Iraq instead of the real threat of AQ terrorists, 9/11 may very well have been stopped. There's nothing absurd about it.
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There is a very real problem in our media. In reporting on science and the military (examples chosen because my own knowledge is sufficient to judge), the reporters often haven't got a clue what they are looking at, what the are talking about, or even what they are being told. These same reporters are then interviewed by other reporters, thus become apparent "authorities" on the subject, and given more credibility than the military or govt sources who attempt to correct them.
Often, if you track down a primary source, the initial report is the closest to correct, as the embedded reporters are often smart enough to learn from the troops around them. The closer to Canada the report comes, the more it is rewritten by more senior reporters with no understanding, edited by Toronto or Montreal news editors who try to make it fit their own, media created, preconceptions and turned into alarmist garbage.
There was a nice piece on the Newsworld about a year ago, about the frustrations of a CBC reporter in Jerusalem trying to tell his editor in Toronto what was happening in the streets around his home, and being overruled because it didn't match what his editor had gleaned from CNN and the BBC. He laughed about sharing his frustrations with the CNN and BBC reporters in Jerusalem who were also being ignored.
In the media, or the intelligence community, once an impression gets formed (right or wrong) all evidence to the contrary is usually ignored. The weakness of our media, of most media in general, is due to an apathetic public who can't be bothered to take them to task for it. If anybody wants the truth, primary sources are not that hard to track down.
Often, if you track down a primary source, the initial report is the closest to correct, as the embedded reporters are often smart enough to learn from the troops around them. The closer to Canada the report comes, the more it is rewritten by more senior reporters with no understanding, edited by Toronto or Montreal news editors who try to make it fit their own, media created, preconceptions and turned into alarmist garbage.
There was a nice piece on the Newsworld about a year ago, about the frustrations of a CBC reporter in Jerusalem trying to tell his editor in Toronto what was happening in the streets around his home, and being overruled because it didn't match what his editor had gleaned from CNN and the BBC. He laughed about sharing his frustrations with the CNN and BBC reporters in Jerusalem who were also being ignored.
In the media, or the intelligence community, once an impression gets formed (right or wrong) all evidence to the contrary is usually ignored. The weakness of our media, of most media in general, is due to an apathetic public who can't be bothered to take them to task for it. If anybody wants the truth, primary sources are not that hard to track down.
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Taliban Offensive Shot to Pieces
by James Dunnigan
June 1, 2006
The last two weeks have seen an ambitious Taliban offensive shot to pieces. As many as a thousand Taliban gunmen, in half a dozen different groups, have passed over the Pakistani border, or been gathered within Afghanistan, and sent off to try and take control of remote villages and districts. The offensive was a major failure, with nearly half the Taliban getting killed, wounded or captured. Afghan and Coalition casualties were much less, although you wouldn't know that from the mass media reports (which made it all look like a Taliban victory). The Taliban faced more mobile opponents, who had better intelligence. UAVs, aircraft and helicopters were used to track down the Taliban, and catch them. Thousands of Afghan troops and police were in action, exposing some of them to ambush, as they drove to new positions through remote areas.
The Afghan and British governments are both accusing Pakistan of looking the other way as Taliban groups set up shop and openly operate in Pakistani border areas. Pakistan denies this, but anyone who is bold enough to travel to these areas, will see evidence of Taliban presence (including enforcement of conservative Islamic lifestyle practices.) In truth, the Pakistani government has never controlled many areas along the border, and is only now, for the first time in its history, trying to exert control.
May 23, 2006: In the last week, Afghan and Coalition operations in the south have killed some 300 Taliban, while losing 50 soldiers, police and civilians. In several incidents, Taliban used civilians as human shields, which led to civilian deaths. British and French troops were heavily engaged, including British AH-64 gunships.
May 21, 2006: Coalition forces found that about a hundred Taliban gunmen were staying at a religious school near Kandahar in southern Afghanistan. Smart bombs hit the school in the middle of the night, but several dozen of the Taliban fled to nearby homes. As Afghan and Coalition forces closed in, the surviving Taliban fired back from nearby homes. So smart bombs were used on the homes as well, which killed about 16 civilians and wounded another twenty. Over 80 Taliban were killed, with no Afghan army or Coalition dead. The Taliban promptly spun their use of civilian homes, as human shields, as a Coalition atrocity.
by James Dunnigan
June 1, 2006
The last two weeks have seen an ambitious Taliban offensive shot to pieces. As many as a thousand Taliban gunmen, in half a dozen different groups, have passed over the Pakistani border, or been gathered within Afghanistan, and sent off to try and take control of remote villages and districts. The offensive was a major failure, with nearly half the Taliban getting killed, wounded or captured. Afghan and Coalition casualties were much less, although you wouldn't know that from the mass media reports (which made it all look like a Taliban victory). The Taliban faced more mobile opponents, who had better intelligence. UAVs, aircraft and helicopters were used to track down the Taliban, and catch them. Thousands of Afghan troops and police were in action, exposing some of them to ambush, as they drove to new positions through remote areas.
The Afghan and British governments are both accusing Pakistan of looking the other way as Taliban groups set up shop and openly operate in Pakistani border areas. Pakistan denies this, but anyone who is bold enough to travel to these areas, will see evidence of Taliban presence (including enforcement of conservative Islamic lifestyle practices.) In truth, the Pakistani government has never controlled many areas along the border, and is only now, for the first time in its history, trying to exert control.
May 23, 2006: In the last week, Afghan and Coalition operations in the south have killed some 300 Taliban, while losing 50 soldiers, police and civilians. In several incidents, Taliban used civilians as human shields, which led to civilian deaths. British and French troops were heavily engaged, including British AH-64 gunships.
May 21, 2006: Coalition forces found that about a hundred Taliban gunmen were staying at a religious school near Kandahar in southern Afghanistan. Smart bombs hit the school in the middle of the night, but several dozen of the Taliban fled to nearby homes. As Afghan and Coalition forces closed in, the surviving Taliban fired back from nearby homes. So smart bombs were used on the homes as well, which killed about 16 civilians and wounded another twenty. Over 80 Taliban were killed, with no Afghan army or Coalition dead. The Taliban promptly spun their use of civilian homes, as human shields, as a Coalition atrocity.
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17thRecceSgt
Guest
It seems the Taliban wants Canada/Canadian Troops out of A-stan. :
Scare tactic to get the Canadian public rowled up to pressure our Government to pull out after the extension of the current mission to Feb '09?? Or a threat to be taken serious that attacks/acts of terror could be put into action in Canada?
Or the Taliban yap yap yappin'...
http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060503/taliban_warning_060601
Taliban warns Cdn. troops to leave Afghanistan
CTV.ca News
A top Taliban official says Canadian troops should get out of Afghanistan and stop acting like Americans, or face the insurgents' wrath at the same level the U.S. has experienced.
The military commander and Taliban spokesperson, known as Mullah Dadallah, appeared on the Al-Jazeera television network this week.
"Our main enemy is the United States. As for Canada and the other countries, we have no historical enmity with them," Dadallah said, according to a report in The Globe and Mail on Friday.
"But if they want to come here as fighting forces, we will view then just as we view the Americans. America is a big snake that wants to bite everybody."
Canada currently has 2,300 soldiers in Afghanistan, and recently committed to remaining in the war-torn nation until at least 2009.
Since 2002, 16 Canadian soldiers and one diplomat have been killed in Afghanistan.
Dadallah advised Canada and the other multi-national forces in Afghanistan to abandon both the nation, and any attempts to defend or side with the U.S.
"If they return to where they came from, and withdraw their forces from here, we will not view them like the Americans."
Dadallah said the U.S. is using Canada, and others, to fight its battles for it, according to a transcript of the interview prepared by the Middle East Media Research Institute.
"Our advice to Canada and Britain is to refrain from defending the American propaganda, and from standing by this historic American crime. America wants to get other countries entangled in the crimes it committed in Afghanistan.
"Our advice to these countries is to avoid the heat of battle, because we will wreak vengeance upon them one by one, like we are doing with the Americans, if they remain here when the Americans are gone."
The warning marks one of the few occasions the Taliban has specifically mentioned Canada directly. The comments seem intended to strike fear in the hearts of troops, and to provoke distrust in the Afghan population.
Meanwhile, the Canadian military has gone to great lengths to build bridges with Afghans, holding informal, sit down meetings with village elders around the country to determine the needs of locals, as well as working to help provide vital services.
The Taliban has kept a relatively low profile since the U.S. invaded Afghanistan in 2001, but the insurgents appear to be stepping up efforts recently.
This week in Ottawa, Lt.-Gen. Michel Gauthier appeared before a Senate committee. He told members it is vital that Canadian troops strive for the support of locals, and said the work in Afghanistan will be accomplished by providing security and safety to Afghans.
"If they are still being terrorized by the Taliban, that terror might force them to vote with the Taliban," Gauthier said.
Jack Hooper, the deputy director of operations with the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, told the committee that Canada's work in Afghanistan will have ramifications outside the nation's borders.
"In the here and now, terrorism and insurgency are being brought to Canadians in Afghanistan," Hooper said.
"At some future point, if we are to learn the lessons of history, their practitioners may bring violence to the streets of our cities."
Scare tactic to get the Canadian public rowled up to pressure our Government to pull out after the extension of the current mission to Feb '09?? Or a threat to be taken serious that attacks/acts of terror could be put into action in Canada?
Or the Taliban yap yap yappin'...
http://sympaticomsn.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060503/taliban_warning_060601
Taliban warns Cdn. troops to leave Afghanistan
CTV.ca News
A top Taliban official says Canadian troops should get out of Afghanistan and stop acting like Americans, or face the insurgents' wrath at the same level the U.S. has experienced.
The military commander and Taliban spokesperson, known as Mullah Dadallah, appeared on the Al-Jazeera television network this week.
"Our main enemy is the United States. As for Canada and the other countries, we have no historical enmity with them," Dadallah said, according to a report in The Globe and Mail on Friday.
"But if they want to come here as fighting forces, we will view then just as we view the Americans. America is a big snake that wants to bite everybody."
Canada currently has 2,300 soldiers in Afghanistan, and recently committed to remaining in the war-torn nation until at least 2009.
Since 2002, 16 Canadian soldiers and one diplomat have been killed in Afghanistan.
Dadallah advised Canada and the other multi-national forces in Afghanistan to abandon both the nation, and any attempts to defend or side with the U.S.
"If they return to where they came from, and withdraw their forces from here, we will not view them like the Americans."
Dadallah said the U.S. is using Canada, and others, to fight its battles for it, according to a transcript of the interview prepared by the Middle East Media Research Institute.
"Our advice to Canada and Britain is to refrain from defending the American propaganda, and from standing by this historic American crime. America wants to get other countries entangled in the crimes it committed in Afghanistan.
"Our advice to these countries is to avoid the heat of battle, because we will wreak vengeance upon them one by one, like we are doing with the Americans, if they remain here when the Americans are gone."
The warning marks one of the few occasions the Taliban has specifically mentioned Canada directly. The comments seem intended to strike fear in the hearts of troops, and to provoke distrust in the Afghan population.
Meanwhile, the Canadian military has gone to great lengths to build bridges with Afghans, holding informal, sit down meetings with village elders around the country to determine the needs of locals, as well as working to help provide vital services.
The Taliban has kept a relatively low profile since the U.S. invaded Afghanistan in 2001, but the insurgents appear to be stepping up efforts recently.
This week in Ottawa, Lt.-Gen. Michel Gauthier appeared before a Senate committee. He told members it is vital that Canadian troops strive for the support of locals, and said the work in Afghanistan will be accomplished by providing security and safety to Afghans.
"If they are still being terrorized by the Taliban, that terror might force them to vote with the Taliban," Gauthier said.
Jack Hooper, the deputy director of operations with the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, told the committee that Canada's work in Afghanistan will have ramifications outside the nation's borders.
"In the here and now, terrorism and insurgency are being brought to Canadians in Afghanistan," Hooper said.
"At some future point, if we are to learn the lessons of history, their practitioners may bring violence to the streets of our cities."
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Here is the MEMRI translation of the Al-Jiz interview, along with the video clip.
http://memri.org/bin/latestnews.cgi?ID=SD118006
(It's actually a pretty good interview - roughly 10min - in which the Taliban commander delves into organization, contacts and what-not)
http://memri.org/bin/latestnews.cgi?ID=SD118006
(It's actually a pretty good interview - roughly 10min - in which the Taliban commander delves into organization, contacts and what-not)
Colin Parkinson
Army.ca Myth
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I suspect math is not his strong point, typical propaganda for Muslims audiences. Yes everything is going wonderfully send more money and your sons.
from darkness lite
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Dear Mullah Dadullah:
:nana:
From one who's been there
(Sorry, couldn't resist)
FDL
:nana:
From one who's been there
(Sorry, couldn't resist)
FDL
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I know body counts don't mean much but 500 in 2 weeks sounds high doesn't it? Would this also include the attacks on Canadians?
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Pretty canny remarks – I think in these passages he’s speaking straight to Canadians who are either opposed to the war and/or wavering in support for it.
The Taliban have been reading our left-wing blogs and editorials, I strongly suspect, because these remarks play out like a checklist of the fears you typically find there.
If Dadullah-lips could have only thrown in the words “Stephen Harper is a puppet of George Bush” he would have hit for the cycle.
Don’t underestimate the power of this b.s. – we laugh it off, but I’m getting a mental picture of Jack Layton, arms outsretched, running around in circles yelling
“SEE! SEE! SEE! IT’S COMING TRUE!!!”
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me too, but my visual ends with him getting walloped in the kisser with a halibutprobum non poenitet said:
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Unfortunately, the recent Taliban activity and Canadian casualties are working their magic on our media--see these posts at "The Torch":
'Afstan: The Globe's agenda secret no more--it's a "quagmire"'
http://toyoufromfailinghands.blogspot.com/2006/06/afstan-globes-agenda-secret-no-more.html
'Afstan: Globe reporter declares quagmire'
http://toyoufromfailinghands.blogspot.com/2006/05/afstan-globe-reporter-declares.html
Mark
Ottawa
'Afstan: The Globe's agenda secret no more--it's a "quagmire"'
http://toyoufromfailinghands.blogspot.com/2006/06/afstan-globes-agenda-secret-no-more.html
'Afstan: Globe reporter declares quagmire'
http://toyoufromfailinghands.blogspot.com/2006/05/afstan-globe-reporter-declares.html
Mark
Ottawa
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