Temporary Duty ( TD ) merged

[Sub_Guy]

On the other hand, the CO could also ask that member the pointed question about why they do not have the Govt of Canada travel card each of us is supposed to have...

Having the Govt card is a blessing.  I never have to worry about an advance and I never have to worry about my budget at home being affected by military travel.

Last minute travel (which happens quite frequently) is never an issue for me. 

 

[dapaterson]

So, a few questions arise:

1. Why can't the groups travel together? Why is there a need for three different departure times?

2. If those timings can be flexible, are there other options? Charter a small bus for a trip each way - that way, driver, fuel etc are all taken care of.

3. Are there other units in the area?  For example, if there's a Res Svc Bn, do they have MSE and drivers that they could provide to do the task (as with #2, above)?


Having another individual to drive is particularly useful if your personnel are going to undergo training that will limit their sleep time - better to have a wide-awake driver than one asleep at the wheel.  (FMS driver rest regulations also come into play if you're using MSE - will your pers be getting their mandated 8 hours?)

 

[Eye In The Sky]

3. Are there other units in the area?  For example, if there's a Res Svc Bn, do they have MSE and drivers that they could provide to do the task (as with #2, above)?

Now you're suggesting the Nav Res and PRes unit could work together which might lead to cost savings?  That is NOT the way the GoC. DND or the CAF conducts business!    op:

 

[Lumber]

Now you're suggesting the Nav Res and PRes unit could work together which might lead to cost savings?  That is NOT the way the GoC. DND or the CAF conducts business!    op:

You beat me to it.

I'm looking to reduce the amount of time and effort it takes to get my troops to a location just an hour away without  huge cost increases. If I had it ask the Army (we do have a svc bn on our property) to lend me their personnel and/or their own unit vehicles, it would add time and complexity (it would probably need a CO to CO email) , plus they'd have to pay a Class A to act as a driver, which would have to be SA'd from our unit to their, so now cost and complexity are going up.

 

[Lumber]

My questions is why is it so darn difficult to get a vehicle from Base transport? Why the red tapes?

It wasn't. They were actually very helpful. We submitted the CF645 at 9am and got confirmation that 3 vehicles were rented just after lunch.

The issue more has to do with flexibility. If they rent the vehicles, then the drivers need 404s and we need to use ARI cards for fuel. Plus, MSE/Transport/traffic  is less flexible with late, last minute, or after house requests. Rental agencies themselves don't care; business is business. If I had requested a bus on similarly short notice, they likely would have said it wouldn't happen.

 

[Lumber]

So, a few questions arise:

1. Why can't the groups travel together? Why is there a need for three different departure times?

2. If those timings can be flexible, are there other options? Charter a small bus for a trip each way - that way, driver, fuel etc are all taken care of.

For question 2, charter bus would have been $500-$600. If I had that much money to transport 15 ppl, I WOULD just send them by taxi. That'd be sooooooo much simpler.

For question 1, it's all about availability. The exercise wanted our cooks as early as possible, so a group of cooks who didn't have to work on the Friday went early, and the rest of the group (who had civilian commitments and could leave early) left in the early evening.

 

[dapaterson]

You beat me to it.

I'm looking to reduce the amount of time and effort it takes to get my troops to a location just an hour away without  huge cost increases. If I had it ask the Army (we do have a svc bn on our property) to lend me their personnel and/or their own unit vehicles, it would add time and complexity (it would probably need a CO to CO email) , plus they'd have to pay a Class A to act as a driver, which would have to be SA'd from our unit to their, so now cost and complexity are going up.

I don't see how a CO to CO email is onerous -
NRD CO "Hey, Mary, can you provide drivers and vehicles to do AAA, BBB and CCC?"

Svc Bn CO "Sure, Frank!  Have your ops contact mine." 

Navy Ops "Per the CO emails below, please use fin code 1000AA C127 GRC0000COOKS plus G/Ls for pay & fuel".

Svc Bn Ops "What's the fin code for coffee?"


Lots of ways to do things as easily as possible.  It takes more effort to make things hard than it does to make things easy.


Frankly, if I were a Svc Bn CO, I'd only make the user unit pay for fuel - getting drivers more time behind the wheel  would be something I'd want to accomplish.

 

[SupersonicMax]

An issue to consider when accepting to rent a vehicle with your own credit card is one of liability.  In case of accident, you may be held liable per the rental contract: the military cannot and will not provide top cover.  Furthermore, generally, only 1 person can drive (the renter) unless drivers are added to the contract, at a premium (which is not reimbursed)

 

[dimsum]

Our unit routinely uses rental vehicles as the primary mode of transport.

I suppose, strictly speaking, if someone refused to use their own credit card to rent the vehicle, we could not order them to do so.  On the other hand, the CO could also ask that member the pointed question about why they do not have the Govt of Canada travel card each of us is supposed to have...

Wait, each person is supposed to have a GTC?  I was told only Crew Commanders in our sqn get those (as we get ready to rent half a dozen cars on our personal cards...)

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I think what he means is the IDTC maybe;  the BMO Government MasterCard that replaced the AMEX one.  I have one and encourage all the new folks to get one;  $5k limit and I never have to use my own card.  Never have any issue with reimbursement, etc.  I just staple my statement to the claim usually and highlight/annotated it as required.

I've never used it for a car rental...I'm not sure if the CAF stuff jives with this (many different situations...in Canada, overseas, etc.

https://www.njc-cnm.gc.ca/directive/d10/v238/en?print

2.2.2 Rental Vehicles

Collision Damage Waiver (CDW) coverage for the entire period that a vehicle is rented is required.  This coverage is provided through the use of the departmental travel expense card (DTEC) or individual designated travel card (IDTC).  When these cards are used to reserve and fully pay for the car rental, the traveller must decline the coverage for CDW on the rental agreement.  Where the DTEC or the IDTC is not used and free coverage is not provided by a personal credit card, the cost of the premiums for CDW coverage shall be reimbursed by the employer.

Public Liability and Property Damage coverage is included in the daily rental rates provided by the government approved car rental suppliers.  When travelling outside Canada, travellers should ensure additional coverage is obtained where required.  In such circumstances, premiums for additional coverage will be reimbursed.

Travellers shall not be reimbursed for personal accident insurance coverage premiums.


CAF stuff here:  http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/caf-community-benefits/temp-duty-travel-instructions.page

 

[winnipegoo7]

Furthermore, generally, only 1 person can drive (the renter) unless drivers are added to the contract, at a premium (which is not reimbursed)

if you tell the rental company that you are a government employee and ask nicely they will usually allow a second driver for free. (at least in my limited experience)

Wait, each person is supposed to have a GTC?  I was told only Crew Commanders in our sqn get those (as we get ready to rent half a dozen cars on our personal cards...)

I don't remember what kind of credit card I had, but I think the CO had to approve the application for it, so it might be the CO's choice as to who can have one. So maybe it would vary unit to unit??

One unit I was in ordered everyone to get a card (NCM's and Officers). Another unit would approve cards if we wanted them, but didn't force anyone.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Just to be clear, there are 2 types of cards and they have different limits.  Usually our Skippers have a different card then I do, probably the DTEC (guessing) - they use it for other stuff like fuel, it might pay for crew hotel rooms (I just know I only have to look after room charges usually).  I have an IDTC, which AFAIK anyone can get - that's the one I encourage new operators on Sqn to get before they start going away and 'maybe' getting advances on time, or if they launch on a weekend and end up landing away from homeplate, etc.

 

[Pusser]

Having dealt with these issues a lot:

1) No, you cannot order someone to use their personal credit card.

2) Probably too late now, but the unit should have a DTEC (essentially a unit travel card that allows you to charge any unit travel expense, including rental cars).  This is a separate card from the unit acquisition card, but the governing principles are similar.  You could easily include the cost of additional drivers on this card.

One danger that a lot of folks don't realize is that should you use a personal credit card to rent a vehicle and end up in an accident, the insurance coverage that may be included with your personal credit card may not be valid if the credit card company realizes you were using it for DND business and NOT for personal use.  I used to rent cars on my personal credit card (to get the points), but I don't do that anymore.  I use my IDTC for that now (still rent hotel rooms on my personal card though).

 

[Lumber]

Thanks everyone.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Having dealt with these issues a lot:

1) No, you cannot order someone to use their personal credit card.

2) Probably too late now, but the unit should have a DTEC (essentially a unit travel card that allows you to charge any unit travel expense, including rental cars).  This is a separate card from the unit acquisition card, but the governing principles are similar.  You could easily include the cost of additional drivers on this card.

One danger that a lot of folks don't realize is that should you use a personal credit card to rent a vehicle and end up in an accident, the insurance coverage that may be included with your personal credit card may not be valid if the credit card company realizes you were using it for DND business and NOT for personal use.  I used to rent cars on my personal credit card (to get the points), but I don't do that anymore.  I use my IDTC for that now (still rent hotel rooms on my personal card though).

We take CDW and make it clear on the invoice it is for DND business.

 

[Pusser]

We take CDW and make it clear on the invoice it is for DND business.

You can still use a personal credit card (individual choice), but I would recommend taking the CDW and claiming it.  It's a reimbursable expense.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

You can still use a personal credit card (individual choice), but I would recommend taking the CDW and claiming it.  It's a reimbursable expense.

That is what we do, if the member does not have an IDTC.

 

[dangerboy]

You can still use a personal credit card (individual choice), but I would recommend taking the CDW and claiming it.  It's a reimbursable expense.

That is in fact the direction that CANFORGEN 204/11 http://vcds.mil.ca/vcds-exec/pubs/canforgen/2011/204-11_e.asp states you are to do:

COLLISION DAMAGE WAIVER (CDW).

4.1. EMPLOYEES ARE REQUIRED TO PURCHASE COLLISION DAMAGE WAIVER (CDW) COVERAGE FROM THE CAR RENTAL AGENCY UNLESS THEY USE THE GOVERNMENT SPONSORED DTC THAT COVERS THE CDW FOR VEHICLES LISTED IN THE STANDING OFFERS, A PERSONAL CREDIT CARD THAT PROVIDES CDW OR THE SUPPLIER DOES NOT ACCEPT THE DTC.

4.2. IF EMPLOYEES DO NOT USE THE DTC THEY MUST PURCHASE CDW FROM THE CAR RENTAL COMPANY AND THIS EXPENSE IS REIMBURSABLE. EMPLOYEES ARE REMINDED THAT CDW COVERAGE UNDER THE DTC APPLIES TO DAMAGE INCURRED IN THE COURSE OF BUSINESS TRAVEL ONLY.

 

[CountDC]

EMPLOYEES ARE REMINDED THAT CDW COVERAGE UNDER THE DTC APPLIES TO DAMAGE INCURRED IN THE COURSE OF BUSINESS TRAVEL ONLY.

Important part there that many people do not think of.  Runs to Timmies may not be considered business travel.

 

[PuckChaser]

EMPLOYEES ARE REMINDED THAT CDW COVERAGE UNDER THE DTC APPLIES TO DAMAGE INCURRED IN THE COURSE OF BUSINESS TRAVEL ONLY.

Important part there that many people do not think of.  Runs to Timmies may not be considered business travel.

Unless that was your breakfast as you were on TD.