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The Defence Budget [superthread]

Journeyman said:
Anyone still believe that having any  former Canadian military members in the Liberal Party will make the slightest difference?

ok now I have to question.  In 2012 the cons did announce around a $2 bil cut to the defence budget but that amount mirrored what defence had returned to the government yearly over a 2 or 3 year period.  Made sense that if defence wasn't spending it and giving it back to cut it.  If we weren't spending it then what impact did he really feel from the cut?  I would have to suspect any impact was a defence generated one and not as a result of the cut.
 
whiskey601 said:
....or large scale terrorist attack within our borders, especially Toronto) there will be no forgiveness by the electorate.   
     

define large scale - my kids can be pretty terrorizing and we are headed there.  >:D
 
CountDC said:
ok now I have to question.  In 2012 the cons did announce around a $2 bil cut to the defence budget but that amount mirrored what defence had returned to the government yearly over a 2 or 3 year period.  Made sense that if defence wasn't spending it and giving it back to cut it.  If we weren't spending it then what impact did he really feel from the cut?  I would have to suspect any impact was a defence generated one and not as a result of the cut.
You are looking at different sums of money.  The cuts described above are reductions to money that was being spent.  As an example $40 million was terminated Class B positions.  More was from elimination of civilian positions.  The money being returned at year end is above and beyond the cuts described in the article.
 
See the pre-budget figures:

Canadian Department of National Defence: 2016-17 Main Estimates
https://cgai3ds.wordpress.com/2016/02/27/mark-collins-canadian-department-of-national-defence-2016-17-main-estimates/

Mark
Ottawa
 
So it looks like they're doing as they promised; following the Conservative funding plan for DND.
 
jmt18325 said:
So it looks like they're doing as they promised; following the Conservative funding plan for DND.

Yes, 2% for 16/17's Vote 1 reference level.

Interesting to see the 15.6% reduction in Vote 5 baseline reference level.


Regards
G2G
 
Let's not forget, though, that the upcoming Budget can blow all of this out of the water. 

If I understand correctly (and I do stand to be corrected/educated), these Estimates have to, by law, match the "last lawful command," so to speak, from the previous government, given no new Budget's been released yet.

Watch and shoot ... :pop:
 
1)  The latest, from the 2016-17 Department of National Defence and the Canadian Armed Forces 2016-17 Report on Plans and Priorities ...
The upcoming federal budget is not expected to commit to a broad increase in military spending, say several defence sources.

In fact, newly tabled fiscal planning documents suggest overall spending on the military could to shrink by almost $400 million in the coming year.

During the election campaign, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau promised to maintain the former Conservative government’s defence spending levels and increase funding in 2017, as laid out in last year’s federal budget.

His government has been under pressure from allies to hike what it spends on defence, with both the United States and Britain asking Canada to aim for the NATO spending benchmark of two per cent of GDP.

The demands have become particularly strident in the aftermath of the Paris terrorist attacks last November, which killed 130 people.

Preliminary budget estimates for the coming year show the military is expected to end the year with a budget of just over $19 billion, but planned spending for fiscal 2016-17 amounts to $18.64 billion.

National Defence routinely goes back and tops up its budget later in the year, but the amounts vary depending on what is going on in the world.

Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan has denied there are broad-based spending cuts in the works, citing a Liberal promise to stick with planned annual increases through a budgetary mechanism known as the defence escalator.

He said Tuesday that the difference between the actual spending and the forecast for next year relates to a series of one-time expenses that National Defence incurred in 2015-16 that won’t be repeated.

“This is not a reduction” in the overall budget, Sajjan insisted. “We are committed to the planned increases and the promises we made during the campaign are going to be kept.”

Documents obtained by The Canadian Press under the Access to Information Act show those annual two per cent increases don’t keep up with inflation and have been more than offset by the previous Harper government’s earlier deficit spending cuts ...
2)  The Conservative defence critic, James Bezan, has this to say ...
Conservatives support the Canada First Defence Strategy -- If properly implemented and financed, it will produce a first-class, modern military ...
If only a party had been in a majority position for to be able to make that happen ...
 
Article Link

Defence spending expected to drop $400M — despite Liberal pledge to keep up with Tories: sources


Murray Brewster, The Canadian Press

Apologies, I didn't realize this was the same article linked to above in Milnews.ca's post.

 
milnews.ca said:
Conservatives support the Canada First Defence Strategy -- If properly implemented and financed, it will produce a first-class, modern military ...
...If only a party had been in a majority position for to be able to make that happen ...
I don't believe the number of seats held was ever a factor. CFDS  was shelved before the ink was dry; even the Conservatives (well, most I assume) realized that it was a pie in the sky wish list, well beyond what Canadians would be willing to pay "if properly implemented and financed."

That they're still using it as some sort of touchstone just shows a lack of thought towards moving forward.
 
I was a non-believer pretty much right from the start ...

First, the money was never "right," it was all smoke and mirrors financing (some members may recall that I called it something like "disarmament by stealth" (I'm too lazy to go find my original post));

Second, it was never supported by a foundation "strategic survey" that would have tried to tell us, Canadians, what the world was likely to look like for the next 25+ years (for a generation or so in the future), so the equipment list made little sense; and

Third, it was, in my opinion, just a ploy to make defence go away and stop bothering the cabinet's "P&P" (plans and priorities) committee: the real "inner cabinet."
 
There are times I wished the Russians had never sold Alaska, being on the frontlines against the Soviet threat might have changed the way we see the world.
 
Colin P said:
There are times I wished the Russians had never sold Alaska, being on the frontlines against the Soviet threat might have changed the way we see the world.

It didn't help Sarah Palin to convince New York or Los Angeles.
 
Colin P said:
A line of fortifications and minefields would certainly help focus the mind.

AH!  Parks Canada and the other organizations that run our current forts would be pleased to wash their hands of these money pits and  hand them over for upkeep and modernization.  The Fort Henry Guard could be "Drafted" as skilled members into the CAF.  Same for the Citadel in Halifax and Louisbourg.  The Van Doos already occupy La Citadel. 
 
Waiting for the details to go online but just watched the budget come down, Capital budget pushed off further down the road, money for armoury renovations, nothing really to big for DND.
 
For ease of everyone.

Reallocate $3.7 Billion in capital spending to 2020

•$77.1 million on projects to support readiness for Canadian Armed Forces military operations, including investments to repair and construct live-fire ranges, airfields and hangars and naval jetties across Canada;

•$67.4 million on projects to support the Reserve Force, including investments to repair and maintain armouries in Alberta, Ontario, Quebec and Nova Scotia;

•$50.0 million on projects to support military personnel and their families, including investments to upgrade and construct military housing across Canada; and

•$6.0 million on projects to support northern operations, including investments in airfield ramp reconstruction that is critical to northern search and rescue and upgrades to fire suppression systems that directly support the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD).
 
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