The Great Gun Control Debate- 2.0

[Colin Parkinson]

That 10m is likely on the low side, probably based off the long gun registry and all imported after it went into effect. Before the long gun registry there was a estimated 15-20m firearms in Canada. A ton of firearms were never registered in that program so I believe that to be more accurate.

17 million was the certified base done by the gun organization. One study placed a possible high end of 33 million legal guns, made or imported ii Canada. Most people who spent time on this issue are confident the number is somewhere in the 20+ million.

 

[Halifax Tar]

17 million was the certified base done by the gun organization. One study placed a possible high end of 33 million legal guns, made or imported ii Canada. Most people who spent time on this issue are confident the number is somewhere in the 20+ million.

I think the issue the Gov will run into isn't the pre 2020 restricted + firearms, they should already know who has them and how many are out there roughly.

Its the 1500 (?) or so models they reclassified after the NS Mass Shooting. They really have no idea how many are out here or who has them.

Overall I would say there is north of 20 million firearms in private possession in Canada.

 

[NavyShooter]

Considering the average Canadian Gun Owner from 30+ years ago probably has the following in their collection:

.22 Cooey
12 Gauge break action Shotgun
.303 Sporter from Grandpa
.410 Gauge to teach the kids
+1 nice hunting rifle with scope

And most of those owners are the ones who never registered with the original registry, many never converted from the FAC to the PAL, they probably have felt no need to do anything since this is all they have/need and they just go hunting once a year, or shoot in the hunting camp.

One of their buddies has a PAL so he buys the ammo for them.

The guns the have are reliable so they don't need to get them fixed.

I'm sure we all know a couple of them.

A 'new' firearms owner in Canada from the past 10 years or so will typically have the following in their collection:

Ruger 10/22
12 Gauge Pump Shotgun
SKS
Cooey they got from some relative for cheap
AR-180/equivalent (non-Restricted Semi-Auto .223)
Bolt Action Ruger American in .223 or 7.62x39

I know of very few gun owners that have only a single gun. They're like Pringles - once you pop, you just can't stop.

Take 2 million, multiply by 5, and you've got 10 million guns.

We all know there's more than that.

As for the 'unknown' number of formerly non-restricted now prohibited rifles of 1500+ makes/models, there is a reasonable estimate of their being almost 2 million of them.

 

[KevinB]

Considering the average Canadian Gun Owner from 30+ years ago probably has the following in their collection:

.22 Cooey
12 Gauge break action Shotgun
.303 Sporter from Grandpa
.410 Gauge to teach the kids
+1 nice hunting rifle with scope

And most of those owners are the ones who never registered with the original registry, many never converted from the FAC to the PAL, they probably have felt no need to do anything since this is all they have/need and they just go hunting once a year, or shoot in the hunting camp.

One of their buddies has a PAL so he buys the ammo for them.

The guns the have are reliable so they don't need to get them fixed.

I'm sure we all know a couple of them.

A 'new' firearms owner in Canada from the past 10 years or so will typically have the following in their collection:

Ruger 10/22
12 Gauge Pump Shotgun
SKS
Cooey they got from some relative for cheap
AR-180/equivalent (non-Restricted Semi-Auto .223)
Bolt Action Ruger American in .223 or 7.62x39

I know of very few gun owners that have only a single gun. They're like Pringles - once you pop, you just can't stop.

Take 2 million, multiply by 5, and you've got 10 million guns.

We all know there's more than that.

As for the 'unknown' number of formerly non-restricted now prohibited rifles of 1500+ makes/models, there is a reasonable estimate of their being almost 2 million of them.

Also need to factor non compliance with earlier law changes. I knew a number of folks who registered one AR-15 when they went from non restricted to restricted in 1994, and kept 3-4 for ‘a rainy day’.

Then there were a ton of ‘deactivated’ AR receivers sold that had a pin welded through a take down pin hole.

Ironically most of the early non compilers I knew were either RCMP members or local LEO’s. Reasonable fear of the government, and a F you I bought this legally sort of attitude. Not having been in Canada for 2 decades I have no idea what the situation is like now.

 

[NavyShooter]

We had that discussion around the table in the late 90s....like...there were import records showing that 50K+ AR-15's were imported to Canada between 1978 and 1992....but with the initial stand-up of the restricted firearm registry back then, only ~20K AR's were registered by owners.

Where did the others go...? The looks around the table after a day at the range shooting AR's were...telling....

 

[Halifax Tar]

Considering the average Canadian Gun Owner from 30+ years ago probably has the following in their collection:

.22 Cooey
12 Gauge break action Shotgun
.303 Sporter from Grandpa
.410 Gauge to teach the kids
+1 nice hunting rifle with scope

And most of those owners are the ones who never registered with the original registry, many never converted from the FAC to the PAL, they probably have felt no need to do anything since this is all they have/need and they just go hunting once a year, or shoot in the hunting camp.

One of their buddies has a PAL so he buys the ammo for them.

The guns the have are reliable so they don't need to get them fixed.

I'm sure we all know a couple of them.

A 'new' firearms owner in Canada from the past 10 years or so will typically have the following in their collection:

Ruger 10/22
12 Gauge Pump Shotgun
SKS
Cooey they got from some relative for cheap
AR-180/equivalent (non-Restricted Semi-Auto .223)
Bolt Action Ruger American in .223 or 7.62x39

I know of very few gun owners that have only a single gun. They're like Pringles - once you pop, you just can't stop.

Take 2 million, multiply by 5, and you've got 10 million guns.

We all know there's more than that.

As for the 'unknown' number of formerly non-restricted now prohibited rifles of 1500+ makes/models, there is a reasonable estimate of their being almost 2 million of them.

I don't know any firearms owner who has just one firearm.

 

[Lumber]

I don't know any firearms owner who has just one firearm.

Sure you do!


For now...

 

[NavyShooter]

Yup.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Considering the average Canadian Gun Owner from 30+ years ago probably has the following in their collection:

.22 Cooey
12 Gauge break action Shotgun
.303 Sporter from Grandpa
.410 Gauge to teach the kids
+1 nice hunting rifle with scope

And most of those owners are the ones who never registered with the original registry, many never converted from the FAC to the PAL, they probably have felt no need to do anything since this is all they have/need and they just go hunting once a year, or shoot in the hunting camp.

One of their buddies has a PAL so he buys the ammo for them.

The guns the have are reliable so they don't need to get them fixed.

I'm sure we all know a couple of them.

A 'new' firearms owner in Canada from the past 10 years or so will typically have the following in their collection:

Ruger 10/22
12 Gauge Pump Shotgun
SKS
Cooey they got from some relative for cheap
AR-180/equivalent (non-Restricted Semi-Auto .223)
Bolt Action Ruger American in .223 or 7.62x39

I know of very few gun owners that have only a single gun. They're like Pringles - once you pop, you just can't stop.

Take 2 million, multiply by 5, and you've got 10 million guns.

We all know there's more than that.

As for the 'unknown' number of formerly non-restricted now prohibited rifles of 1500+ makes/models, there is a reasonable estimate of their being almost 2 million of them.

There was 4 million FAC holders, which represented maybe half the gun owners at the time. Take you first list of 5 guns and multiple that by 8 million = 40 million

 

[KevinB]

There was 4 million FAC holders, which represented maybe half the gun owners at the time. Take you first list of 5 guns and multiple that by 8 million = 40 million

In the 90’s firearm ownership per capita was higher in Canada than down here.

IIRC back when the system was changing in 1994, it was reported that there 15 million registered pistols in Canada.

I suspect the number of formerly non restricted long guns in Canada is well over 100m.

My grandparents on both sides had more than 5 shotguns/rifles, and they were definitely not outliers.
Now none of their children (8 total) ever had significant interest in guns, but there where guns in most of their households as well (except for my parents - I was the only gun nut in the immediate family).

Down here, the VA Governor has just signed some fairly draconian laws, going into effect in July. Now so many families here have run out and bought handguns and black rifles for their families— many not because they want them, but concern that they may not be able to get them later. It reminds me of the way things started in Canada, grandfathering firearms, and banning transport and sale.

 

[Halifax Tar]

In the 90’s firearm ownership per capita was higher in Canada than down here.

IIRC back when the system was changing in 1994, it was reported that there 15 million registered pistols in Canada.

I suspect the number of formerly non restricted long guns in Canada is well over 100m.

My grandparents on both sides had more than 5 shotguns/rifles, and they were definitely not outliers.
Now none of their children (8 total) ever had significant interest in guns, but there where guns in most of their households as well (except for my parents - I was the only gun nut in the immediate family).

Down here, the VA Governor has just signed some fairly draconian laws, going into effect in July. Now so many families here have run out and bought handguns and black rifles for their families— many not because they want them, but concern that they may not be able to get them later. It reminds me of the way things started in Canada, grandfathering firearms, and banning transport and sale.

I agree. I know growing up every house hold seemed to have a wooden wall mounted 5 gun rack and drawers for ammo in their rec room. Usually a .303, 30-30 Lever, .22LR, 12ga Semi and 12ga pump.