US Contractor Charged in Shooting of AFG Accused of Torching Scientist

[The Bread Guy]

Links to other media outlets below - shared in accordance with the "fair dealing" provisions, Section 29, of the Copyright Act.

Contractor who shot Afghan stands trial
American shot Afghan dead when told of colleague's horrific burns
Written by Quqnoos.com, 20 Nov 08
Article link

An American security contractor who shot an Afghan man is standing trial for murder in America. The American is understood to have shot the man after hearing that the Afghan had injured a fellow contractor, reports say.

Don M. Ayala, 46 and Paula Loyd were accompanying an American foot patrol through an Afghan village near Kandahar on November 4. Afghan Abdul Salam threw a container of flammable liquid onto Loyd during the operation and was detained. (links to Kansas City Star story on original attack)

About ten minutes later, when Ayala was told that Loyd was badly burnt, he shot Salam dead, according to American soldiers who witnessed the scene.

Since leaving the US military, Ayala had guarded top Afghan and Iraqi VIPs. He had been working for BAE Systems since September 1.

It is unclear how Ayala was brought before the US District Court in Alexandria, Virginia.

The trial continues.



More from NBC News and Wired's Danger Room blog

- edited to add extra links at bottom-

 

[Drag]

IMO, "contractors" should have no place doing warfighting in a place like Afghanistan.  They are mercenaries, pure and simple.  Let them drive trucks and do laundry, nothing more than that.

 

[tomahawk6]

We hire Afghan merc's so whats the difference ?

 

[Drag]

The difference is that they are locals and fall under local laws.  They are more like native auxiliary forces, different from foreign mercenaries.  They do not represent the coalition as much in the eyes of the locals.  When a local working for the coalition does something stupid it does not create the kind of resentment as a western mercenary.  In my opinion warfighting should be the domain of governments.  It allows you much better of your forces and image.  Also, having to hire mercenaries is a sign of weakness.

 

[tomahawk6]

If an interpreter is associated with the coalition so are your so called auxileries.We employ civilian contractors with K9's to go along on patrols for example to detect explosives. Without the contractor we might not even have that capability in country due to manpower shortages which is really what is the driving force behind the PMC/KBR ect.

 

[Drag]

They are associated with the coalition, but that interpreter will not do as much damage as a Blackwater team that shoots up a market place and is then whisked out of the country because they are immune to local laws.  Governments can exercise much better control over their armed forces than armed mercenaries.  Contractors have their roles, but warfighting is not one of them.  Rome fell after it turned over its defense to mercenary armies.  Armed forces should be funded to the level that they do not need contractors, especially in combat.  I just personally dissagree with using "contractors" in combat roles.

 

[tomahawk6]

Contractors are in support and personal security roles,which sometimes requires shooting in self defense.The bad guys are not victims.If this bad guy hadnt thrown acid he would still be alive. In this case the contractor doesnt know what other weapons this attacker might have.He has to be put down.

 

[dapaterson]

Contractors are in support and personal security roles,which sometimes requires shooting in self defense.The bad guys are not victims.If this bad guy hadnt thrown acid he would still be alive. In this case the contractor doesnt know what other weapons this attacker might have.He has to be put down.

I call bull-s***.

The suspect was detained.  Ten minutes later, Mr Ayala gunned him down.  That certainly appears pre-meditated - murder in the first degree.

 

[tomahawk6]

In this case you are right dapaterson.I was just making a general obeservation as previous posters felt contractors had no place in a war zone.

 

[Drag]

Governments may be able to outsource tasks but cannot outsource the responsibility for them.  A government will never have as much control over the actions of Blackwater, Executive Outcomes, et al, as over its own military forces, but will still be responsible for their decisions.  This case is a good case-in-point, the contractor shot an unarmed prisoner, and committed at least  murder, and maybe a war crime.  IMO, Armed defense contrators have very valuable roles to play but only when hired by the host government of a country, playing by its laws and under the jurisdiction of their courts ie: security of VIPs, protecting shipping from piracy, protecting installation like oil platforms in the Niger Delta.

edited for spelling

 

[twistedcables]

The day clients stop going for the lowest common denominator is the end of contractors/mercenaries. D# said it - the Romans lost it after relying so heavily on mercs.  A regular soldier is a noble occupation because it comes with accountability: to superiors, subordinates and self.  Mercs f*ck it up for soldiers and escape accountability: hence the lack of moral value in such professions.

In any event - he could claim extreme rage or shock.  Even IF the guy did do it - we don't summarily execute people - violates our ROE's.

 

[tomahawk6]

Justifiable homocide.

 

[Drag]

Justifiable homocide.

According to the Laws of War... NO

 

[tomahawk6]

I am just not very sympathetic to the killing of a bad guy that disfigured an unarmed civilian. The civilian security contractor is a very experienced guy. Hope he comes out of it ok.

 

[Drag]

I am not sympathetic to the SOB either.  But the contractor is an SOB too in the sense that we have the moral high ground and such actions act to erode it.  Just because the other guy does not follow the Laws of War does not mean we stoop down to their level.  I hope he gets his day in court and an appropriate punishment

 

[PAT-Platoon]

I am not sympathetic to the SOB either.  But the contractor is an SOB too in the sense that we have the moral high ground and such actions act to erode it.  Just because the other guy does not follow the Laws of War does not mean we stoop down to their level.  I hope he gets his day in court and an appropriate punishment

Very good points here especially. I too am extremely against the use of such mercenary organizations. The so-called "Private Military Contractors" used by the US in for example Iraq are nothing more than unaccountable cowboys. Military force needs to be only wielded by governments with transparency and legitimacy, not organizations fostered by profit margins and stock holders.

-C/D

 

[muskrat89]

Do you ever post a response about something you have actual knowledge of, or do you just tap away on the keyboard, astounding us with whatever random thoughts that happen to flicker through your mind at any given moment?

 

[HItorMiss]

I am not sympathetic to the SOB either.  But the contractor is an SOB too in the sense that we have the moral high ground and such actions act to erode it.  .  I hope he gets his day in court and an appropriate punishment Just because the other guy does not follow the Laws of War does not mean we stoop down to their level

Moral high ground in who's eyes? yours? mine? theirs?

And for the record wars are won by the side willing to do what the other is not...Cruel and inhumane you betcha but that is why war is such an abhorrent thing. If you are putting Canada on a pedestal crack your history books..Fire Bombings of Dresden come to mind...


As for the topic at large Contractor or not it was murder, justifiable maybe? who am I to sit in judgement. What I do know is that we are human and ruled by emotion no person can be truly a master of our base emotions and where they lead ( Anger = Violence ) and there are thousands of cases both from our side and the opposing forces side (any opposing force) of this happening and by SOLDIERS no less...

 

[KevinB]

I must say as a previous "unaccountable cowboy" I have seen much worse discresion used by armed forces personnel.  Keep in mind the vast majority of armed contractors are former mil personnel, who usually have a lot more experience and skill than the average soldier on patrol.


Bullet Magnet has some pretty good points.


  I fear we have lost the ability to wage an effective war these days.

 

[Infanteer]

The so-called "Private Military Contractors" used by the US in for example Iraq are nothing more than unaccountable cowboys. Military force needs to be only wielded by governments with transparency and legitimacy, not organizations fostered by profit margins and stock holders.

Running at the mouth again I see - and one of the "unaccountable cowboys" here stated you're off base (again...big surprise).

Keep it up; you're so far out of your lane that you're in oncoming traffic.