Political impacts of Ukraine war

[MrWhyt]

And now he is trying to end a war his way.

By rolling over for Putin.

 

[QV]

How is “surviving two assassination attempts” skill on his part?

He is, objectively, a terrible President, doing incalculable damage to the US (let alone the western alliance). That you cannot see that through the tainted lens of your “fanboy life” is equally shocking.

In no way do I under-estimate his ruthless self-interest and his willingness to say or do whatever it takes to seize and hold power.

"Seize power"? You are living in melodrama.

And if Trump finds a path to peace and ends the Ukr/Rus war - then what? Is he still a madman?

By rolling over for Putin.

I haven't seen any logical suggestion by you on how to manage the end to this war. A lot of folks here talk about wanting Russia crushed, but don't want to do the heavy lift to make it happen.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

If Trump finds a “path to peace” that dismembers Ukraine and rewards Putin and his cronies, I can about guarantee that the overall impact to international stability will not be positive.

 

[MrWhyt]

I haven't seen any logical suggestion by you on how to manage the end to this war.

good thing I'm not in a position of power and have never claimed i could end the war in 24 hours.

We've seen what trump says Ukraine needs to give up to achieve peace, but he hasn't said anything about what russia needs to give up. Will they pay reparations? return POWs and stolen children?, turnover war criminals for prosecution? He hasn't stood up to putin, he is just on his knees for him.

 

[HavokFour]

And there it is. Any security guarantee's made by the US specifically have already been rendered borderline worthless.

'You have my assurance': Trump says U.S. troops won't be involved in Ukraine peacekeeping

Asked in an interview "what kind of assurance" there is that US troops won't be involved in Ukraine after the war, Trump said "You have my assurance."

www.usatoday.com

 

[MrWhyt]

And there it is. Any security guarantee's made by the US specifically have already been rendered borderline worthless.

'You have my assurance': Trump says U.S. troops won't be involved in Ukraine peacekeeping

Asked in an interview "what kind of assurance" there is that US troops won't be involved in Ukraine after the war, Trump said "You have my assurance."

www.usatoday.com

It is TACO Tuesday

 

[KevinB]

good thing I'm not in a position of power and have never claimed i could end the war in 24 hours.

We've seen what trump says Ukraine needs to give up to achieve peace, but he hasn't said anything about what russia needs to give up. Will they pay reparations? return POWs and stolen children?, turnover war criminals for prosecution? He hasn't stood up to putin, he is just on his knees for him.

POTUS when he was #45 kept telling Europe to get off Russian oil as it made them susceptible to coercion by Russia.
He also send Stingers and Javelins to Ukraine, and other lethal aid, that had been disallowed by previous Presidents. At some point in time when Ukraine refused to turn over "evidence" against alleged illegal dealings of then VP Biden and his son Hunter's involvement in Ukrainian investments - seemingly glossing over those where under a previous Ukrainian government - and the majority of those allegations where from a disgraced corrupt official from the older Ukrainian government that had been charge under the (then new) anti-corruption laws.

Personally I find President Trump's conduct towards Ukraine since then to be shameful and a national disgrace.
80%+ of Americans support Ukraine and view Russia as the enemy currently -- the Trump Administration should accept the desires of the American people in that regard.

However, Russia is a nuclear power, and Western Governments have not been good with dealing with Russia for years (see Chechnya, Ukraine, Georgia, Syria, the Stans, and internal Russian issues themselves. While Russia isn't so much a significant threat conventionally to NATO as a whole, they are a threat individually, NATO outside of the US had been freeloading on US power for decades, and still many NATO members haven't come to Jesus with the acceptance that it will take all of the Western powers dedicating assets to combat the authoritarian regimes.

Pressuring Russia on the negotiating table isn't going to work, until Russia comes hat in hand to the table -- right now Putin needs the war to continue to keep Russia focused on problems other than Russia. As I have mentioned here and other threads regarding the Russian situation, defeating Russia militarily in the Ukraine comes with a lot of X factors.
What happens to Russia when Putin realizes he cannot win?
What happens to Russia's nuclear arsenal if the Russian state fractures?
What happens to Russians if the state fractures - and what stops the Chinese from capitalizing on that?

Unfortunately a lot of people both in the US and the rest of the "West" seem to think there is some transactional methodology that can be reached to come to some sort of arrangement with Russia -- unfortunately like many in the 1930's misunderstood Adolph Hitler, a lot of people seem to understand that Putin wants USSR2.0 and that is to be his legacy.

Ideally someone in the Russian government would kill Putin, and come to the West saying - we need a makeover, with a lot of money, and help to rebuild Russia into a country that isn't a Mob run Gas Station.
However that seems to be wishful thinking at the moment, as Putin has purged pretty much anyone that doesn't see USSR2.0 as the end goal.

And there it is. Any security guarantee's made by the US specifically have already been rendered borderline worthless.

'You have my assurance': Trump says U.S. troops won't be involved in Ukraine peacekeeping

Asked in an interview "what kind of assurance" there is that US troops won't be involved in Ukraine after the war, Trump said "You have my assurance."

www.usatoday.com

Again the key to DJT isn't what he says it is what he does.
Not apologizing for him (I didn't vote for him), but he's erratic and his mind goes from one thought to the next - so on Thursday he could just as easily commit V Corps (unlikely but).

Putin only respects (or accepts) force - so 10 Ukraine needs more weapons and materials, and 2) until someone in the West puts soldiers into Ukraine - the entire process is irrelevant as it will mean nothing to Russia.

 

[daftandbarmy]

POTUS when he was #45 kept telling Europe to get off Russian oil as it made them susceptible to coercion by Russia.
He also send Stingers and Javelins to Ukraine, and other lethal aid, that had been disallowed by previous Presidents. At some point in time when Ukraine refused to turn over "evidence" against alleged illegal dealings of then VP Biden and his son Hunter's involvement in Ukrainian investments - seemingly glossing over those where under a previous Ukrainian government - and the majority of those allegations where from a disgraced corrupt official from the older Ukrainian government that had been charge under the (then new) anti-corruption laws.

Personally I find President Trump's conduct towards Ukraine since then to be shameful and a national disgrace.
80%+ of Americans support Ukraine and view Russia as the enemy currently -- the Trump Administration should accept the desires of the American people in that regard.

However, Russia is a nuclear power, and Western Governments have not been good with dealing with Russia for years (see Chechnya, Ukraine, Georgia, Syria, the Stans, and internal Russian issues themselves. While Russia isn't so much a significant threat conventionally to NATO as a whole, they are a threat individually, NATO outside of the US had been freeloading on US power for decades, and still many NATO members haven't come to Jesus with the acceptance that it will take all of the Western powers dedicating assets to combat the authoritarian regimes.

Pressuring Russia on the negotiating table isn't going to work, until Russia comes hat in hand to the table -- right now Putin needs the war to continue to keep Russia focused on problems other than Russia. As I have mentioned here and other threads regarding the Russian situation, defeating Russia militarily in the Ukraine comes with a lot of X factors.
What happens to Russia when Putin realizes he cannot win?
What happens to Russia's nuclear arsenal if the Russian state fractures?
What happens to Russians if the state fractures - and what stops the Chinese from capitalizing on that?

Unfortunately a lot of people both in the US and the rest of the "West" seem to think there is some transactional methodology that can be reached to come to some sort of arrangement with Russia -- unfortunately like many in the 1930's misunderstood Adolph Hitler, a lot of people seem to understand that Putin wants USSR2.0 and that is to be his legacy.

Ideally someone in the Russian government would kill Putin, and come to the West saying - we need a makeover, with a lot of money, and help to rebuild Russia into a country that isn't a Mob run Gas Station.
However that seems to be wishful thinking at the moment, as Putin has purged pretty much anyone that doesn't see USSR2.0 as the end goal.


Again the key to DJT isn't what he says it is what he does.
Not apologizing for him (I didn't vote for him), but he's erratic and his mind goes from one thought to the next - so on Thursday he could just as easily commit V Corps (unlikely but).

Putin only respects (or accepts) force - so 10 Ukraine needs more weapons and materials, and 2) until someone in the West puts soldiers into Ukraine - the entire process is irrelevant as it will mean nothing to Russia.

Anything out there from the CIA these days on the future of Russia?

 

[The Bread Guy]

And there it is. Any security guarantee's made by the US specifically have already been rendered borderline worthless.

'You have my assurance': Trump says U.S. troops won't be involved in Ukraine peacekeeping

Asked in an interview "what kind of assurance" there is that US troops won't be involved in Ukraine after the war, Trump said "You have my assurance."

www.usatoday.com

Aaaaand there goes my dial back closer towards the "POTUS47 as USSR 2.0 stooge" end of the scale ....

... the key to DJT isn't what he says it is what he does.
Not apologizing for him (I didn't vote for him), but he's erratic and his mind goes from one thought to the next - so on Thursday he could just as easily commit V Corps (unlikely but) ...

... although I'll keep my fingers crossed.