Self Defence in Canada (split from Gun Control 2.0)

[Colin Parkinson]

Well in Canada, you have gone to your safe, and unlocked it, gotten the ammo, loaded your firearm so if you where able to do that, you are probably awake

While I agree with the responsibility of the firearm owner to account for any bullets they fire, I do not see disorientation to be a factor from just being startled awake - sleep deprivation causes a lot of judgment errors, but outside of the immediate time of waking where one may lash out, there is no appreciable disorientation (unless they have alcohol or drugs in their system) as the adrenaline has kicked in for fight or flight.


The post you replied to seemed to be quoting me, where I was differentiating the threats -- firstly I think most people would know the difference between an intruder being in their room - and one not. I have cameras, and electronic locks and a few other things to let me know where people are in my house.

If a neighbor shoots at you in your house from theirs - well that is a significant difference from what we had been talking about.

Just don't fire warning shots when your house is being fire-bombed.....

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Fair, but I wonder how many people have their gun locker in their bedroom (assuming the scenario)?


Cool, but considering less than 300,000 Canadians legally own handguns, how realistic is this type of set-up.

More common than you think, I know several people with similar setups.

 

[KevinB]

More common than you think, I know several people with similar setups.

I had three different ones back when I lived in Canada - and a slightly larger one for my MP-5.
Most folks I know with evil black guns and handguns have them.

I have a few here - and some more discrete firearms containers with RFID locks, mainly for when people are over that leaving a few carbines and pistols around may make them nervous, or when my kids friends are over - and I don't want any loose firearms.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I can get mine out right quick from proper storage if needed, and I expect plenty of others can too. There are ways to set up the least barriers legally possible depending on what safe/locks you use.

Agreed.

Storage requirements for an NR weapon like a shotgun aren't actually that onerous or difficult.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Agreed.

Storage requirements for an NR weapon like a shotgun aren't actually that onerous or difficult.

Under a blanket in the back seat of your truck with the doors locked works.

 

[lenaitch]

More common than you think, I know several people with similar setups.

I must run in different circles. I know of no one who has a gun locker in their bedroom.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Under a blanket in the back seat of your truck with the doors locked works.

The back seat is to far away

 

[Haggis]

Under a blanket in the back seat of your truck with the doors locked works.

Still has to be trigger/cable locked or bolt removed and stored separately, without ammuntion readily available.

I'm still convinced that our firearms laws were written by the same people who wrote home theatre assembly and operating instructions in the 1980's.

 

[KevinB]

Still has to be trigger/cable locked or bolt removed and stored separately.

He has the vanity plate SAFE, so by letter of the law they are in a safe in his vehicle

 

[Haggis]

He has the vanity plate SAFE, so by letter of the law they are in a safe in his vehicle

Not so fast, Kev.

There was a case about a guy who buried his guns in concrete in his yard and was found guilty of unsafe storage because the judge ruled the concrete block was "not lockable" and therefore not a proper storage container. I will try to find it.

 

[GR66]

Not so fast, Kev.

There was a case about a guy who buried his guns in concrete in his yard and was found guilty of unsafe storage because the judge ruled the concrete block was "not lockable" and therefore not a proper storage container. I will try to find it.

 

[Genetk44]

Not so fast, Kev.

There was a case about a guy who buried his guns in concrete in his yard and was found guilty of unsafe storage because the judge ruled the concrete block was "not lockable" and therefore not a proper storage container. I will try to find it.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Still has to be trigger/cable locked or bolt removed and stored separately, without ammuntion readily available.

I think that's just for non-restricted firearms in remote wilderness settings.

RCMP storage rules

• Lock non-restricted firearms and locked containers carrying restricted or prohibited firearms in the trunk or in a similar lockable compartment.
• If the vehicle does not have a trunk or lockable compartment, put firearms and firearm containers out of sight inside the vehicle and lock the vehicle.

No mention about trigger locks or the like.

There was a case about a guy who buried his guns in concrete in his yard and was found guilty of unsafe storage because the judge ruled the concrete block was "not lockable" and therefore not a proper storage container. I will try to find it.

Can confirm. Even buried cases that are locked are illegal since the RCMP doesn't consider the back yard as a reasonable storage area. A lot more secure than a car IMO.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Fair, but I wonder how many people have their gun locker in their bedroom (assuming the scenario)?


Cool, but considering less than 300,000 Canadians legally own handguns, how realistic is this type of set-up.

Oh, I know of at least one

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Pretty hilarous the company name is Vaultek though.

Have any of the storage requirements for handguns changed significantly within the last 20 years or so, particularly with them getting more restricted generally and banned in some municipalities?

Still really not sure where I sit on any of this; I have no problem with legal gun ownership, and requiring people to have some kind of minimal safety training but also think there are some people who aren't responsible enough to own any of them, and that having a bit of a tortured path to get access to them and the ammo isn't a bad thing as it gives someone a bit of a cooling off period if they are angry, and things like home invasions are pretty rare where it doesn't make a difference from a self defence perspective.

What's funny about Vaultek name? I must be missing the joke.

If the handgun is stored in a vault, safe or room that was built or modified specifically to store firearms safely, it doesn't need a trigger lock.

Ammo can be stored in the same container as the handgun. This includes whether it's loose, in a box or a magazine.

So storing the handgun in the Vaultek, designed to hold firearms and a loaded magazine for that handgun, stored in the same vault is all legal.

https://rcmp.ca/en/firearms/firearms-safety-training-transport-and-storage/storing-transporting-and-displaying-firearms

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I think that's just for non-restricted firearms in remote wilderness settings.

RCMP storage rules


No mention about trigger locks or the like.



Can confirm. Even buried cases that are locked are illegal since the RCMP doesn't consider the back yard as a reasonable storage area. A lot more secure than a car IMO.

If I'm with the vehicle (ie: going from one hunt spot to another) you can have your NR with you, unlocked and unloaded. No locks, no cases. When hunting and moving in a vehicle, my shotgun is beside me, action open. I only need to stop, step out, drop a shell in and shoot my game.
There is no difference between my UTV and my truck, gravel road or highway. Just make sure you follow the regs for distance when shooting near a road.

If you leave your truck, the NR needs to be locked, cased and out of sight.

 

[Navy_Pete]

What's funny about Vaultek name? I must be missing the joke.

If the handgun is stored in a vault, safe or room that was built or modified specifically to store firearms safely, it doesn't need a trigger lock.

Ammo can be stored in the same container as the handgun. This includes whether it's loose, in a box or a magazine.

So storing the handgun in the Vaultek, designed to hold firearms and a loaded magazine for that handgun, stored in the same vault is all legal.

https://rcmp.ca/en/firearms/firearms-safety-training-transport-and-storage/storing-transporting-and-displaying-firearms

Thanks, I wasn't sure how that worked.

Vault-tec is a fake company from the Fallout video game series (and now TV show), that was doing all kinds of social experiments on people living in their underground vaults following a large scale nuclear event across the globe. Timeline wise it's set in the 50s/60s, so has a great 50s diner style asthetic in all the design.

You may have seen the Vault boy; he's been meme'd around since the days of dial up internet, and has been around since 1997.

Vault-tec in the game was a bit of generic Acme co that did everything, but had a huge defence contract for the government and got up to all kinds of evil corporate shenanigans, because they could.

They've done a great job with the tv show, with Season 2 coming out soon, so it's worth checking out if you like post-apocalypse type shows.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Still has to be trigger/cable locked or bolt removed and stored separately, without ammuntion readily available.

I'm still convinced that our firearms laws were written by the same people who wrote home theatre assembly and operating instructions in the 1980's.

Only if you leave your truck.

If you are with the gun, it's considered in use and doesn't need to be locked.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

If any kind of firearm, once they retrieve said firearm from an approved locked container, along with the ammunition from a separate locked container. By that time, I suspect the intruder is already back home in bed.

Ammo can be stored in the same approved container with the firearm.

 

[Haggis]

The fact that we are arguing over storage regulations proves my point.