Liberal Minority Government 2025 - ???

[dapaterson]

Over here will take an hour to get from Orleans to Kanata.

And then you're stuck working in Kanata and living in Orleans.

 

[ytz]

I'm nowhere near it and, at my age, will never ride it and my economy will not be effected by it.

"A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in."

 

[ytz]

And then you're stuck working in Kanata and living in Orleans.

Me and a guy swapped jobs last year. He lives in Stittsville. I live near Montfort hospital. Naturally this means I commute to Carling and he commutes to Coventry now. I'm sure both of us spending 30-45 mins in traffic each way is meeting the government's climate goals....

I loved walking and biking to work. And routinely volunteered to stay later when necessary to support those who gotta run out for daycare pickup. Now I'm in the latter group.

 

[dapaterson]

Years ago I lived downtown and worked at 101. A 15 minute walk to work if I stopped for coffee en route.

 

[ytz]

Years ago I lived downtown and worked at 101. A 15 minute walk to work if I stopped for coffee en route.

Career manager when they find out you have a decent QoL and are happy:

 

[dapaterson]

Career manager when they find out you have a decent QoL and are happy:

View attachment 99456

That's why our group was moved to Coventry, before Starbucks and when the only nearby food was the chip wagon in the Canadian Tire parking lot.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Not at all. I'm nowhere near it and, at my age, will never ride it and my economy will not be effected by it. Just providing points. If my post seemed as a direct reply to you rather than the general discussion, I apologize.

Accepted. You did quote me.

Curious though; if a discussion surrounding a 'nation building project' is only to be restricted to those directly impacted, should navy matters be out of bounds to inlanders?

No doubt, landowners directly impacted by this, or any other public undertaking have a right to be pissed; I would be too.

Again, I am not against this project. Like said to @ytz I'm really happy you're excited and I hope it all works out.

I can simply empathize with rural landowners who will have their property expropriated. Sucks. People generally don't live rural to be next to HSR.

Our family hunting camp is east of Kaladar just on the south side of 7. Sort of between Kaladar and Arden. I suspect some of that may be affected. But I don't hunt there anymore, living in NS and all. I will be waiting to hear what the family says.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Cant see the economic opportunity beyond the political colours. If it uplifts GDP by even half of what has been projected its a win in less than a decade but partisanship is partisanship.

If there are other projects totaling the same cost that could uplift GDP by more (say, 1.2%), then sinking that money into HSR (given above estimated 1.1%) will be a net loss of 0.1%.

I do not contend that HSR will be a dead loss. I do contend it might be a relative loss.

It also doesn't do much to regionally diversify Canada's economy or spread risks among multiple projects. It represents a lot of eggs in one proposed basket.

Opportunity cost.

 

[Halifax Tar]

"A society grows great when old men plant trees whose shade they know they shall never sit in."

The trees actually have to get planted though.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/liberals-scrapping-2-billion-tree-goal-9.6965183

 

[ytz]

Opportunity cost.

Indeed, opportunity cost. Would suck if some of the high income seniors in this country can't get beer money anymore.

 

[QV]

Indeed, opportunity cost. Would suck if some of the high income seniors in this country can't get beer money anymore.

Thanks a ton to all those high performing seniors who contributed all those years making OAS possible.

 

[MilEME09]

The trees actually have to get planted though.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/liberals-scrapping-2-billion-tree-goal-9.6965183

best we can do is have the RCR paint some rocks for you

 

[IKnowNothing]

Thanks a ton to all those high performing seniors who contributed all those years making OAS possible.

OAS is a social safety net paid out of general revenues. When was started and for the majority of it's run it was funded with a ratio of 7 workers to 1 retiree. Demographics made OAS in its current form viable, and now they're making it non viable.

 

[foresterab]

I was in Sydney Australia recently and was amazed at how they had addressed part of the mass transit challenges.

1. Very clear and efficient toll highway system of which significant portions are tunnels. 3 lanes each direction built to shorten routes via underground access. 45 min cab ride from the airport gate to our hotel vs. 1.5 hour above ground public road
2. Multi-track rail corridor. Some stations are 5 wide tracks...passenger traffic tends to be the outer-most line allowing for stops at stations - route specific as most stop ~ every second station. Center lanes are for through traffic which includes the big freight trains coming through. But the transit system allows a person to go almost 200 km away inland for about $25 each way...not a bad gig for an hour and half train ride to city center/harbor front.

Almost all the train traffic is above ground - makes sense when looking at tunnel costs - and appears to have been built in partnership with the original railway lines. But even where old sidings and rail sheds have been decommissioned they have upgraded some sites into bus service centers and/or car parks for transit users....investments into a system rather than ad hoc changes.

While the weather is one factor I do think there are many factors that would be a solution for Canadian cities but would need to look into alot of different municipal and federal train regulations to understand better.

A map of the toll system for comparision:About Sydney toll roads - Linkt

 

[IKnowNothing]

Build an expensive rail to meet the business commuting needs of classes of people who are already WFH, telecommuting, telemeeting, etc.

Why let those pesky serfs that do things with their hands have increased freedom of choice and reduced commuting friction eh?

 

[MilEME09]

While the weather is one factor I do think there are many factors that would be a solution for Canadian cities but would need to look into alot of different municipal and federal train regulations to understand better.

there is a ridiculous amount of decommissioned rail lines in canada, make the trains electric, set up a couple SMR to power the network and you would have cheap operating, hell, lets put it all underground to take weather out of the factor. It would be expensive as hell but imagine how much would be made if you say drilled through the mountains from calgary, went to Kelowna, then to Vancouver. could probably be in Vancouver in about 6h, less if you exceed 100km/h in a closed system

 

[Navy_Pete]

If there are other projects totaling the same cost that could uplift GDP by more (say, 1.2%), then sinking that money into HSR (given above estimated 1.1%) will be a net loss of 0.1%.

I do not contend that HSR will be a dead loss. I do contend it might be a relative loss.

It also doesn't do much to regionally diversify Canada's economy or spread risks among multiple projects. It represents a lot of eggs in one proposed basket.

Opportunity cost.

I hated that opportunity cost arguement; DoF tried to apply that to the NSS and see if there would be a bigger economic investment if the same money was goign into cars or something.

Maybe, but it completely missed it was a strategic investment into a key economic activity that supported a GoC goal, so spending the money on a car plant would do absolutely FA to rebuild the RCN and CCG, and get a shipbuilding capacity in Canada. It's a strawman arguement that completely misses the point of why you are doing that.

It's like ignoring a hole in the roof and spending the money on new kitchen cabinets; sure, you get a good ROI on kitchen upgrades, but doesn't do anything for a leaking roof.

Also they were just being pricks about it, and deliberately ignoring Cabinet direction because some frustrated EX-1 thought they would be able to build an empire on something and was mad it wasn't going into their pet project, so glad several departments told them to politely F off, and if they have a problem take it up with Cabinet who endorsed the then 50 year old 'Made in Canada' shipbuilding project.

 

[captloadie]

It is interesting that no one has asked why they don't expropriate the current rail corridors from the railway companies and make them more efficient, rather than expropriating private lands.

I know, this would cause more harm than good to the economy, but you'd think someone would at least do the math to answer the question.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Why let those pesky serfs that do things with their hands have increased freedom of choice and reduced commuting friction eh?

The pesky serfs will undoubtedly occasionally use the service, particularly for leisure. But I doubt many of the people who work with their hands (and particularly the ones who have a van/trailer full of tools) will be using HSR to commute to work.

Like subsidies for expensive EVs, the proposed HSR is a gift mainly to people who don't need gifts.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

It may be that you are missing how productivity relates to the economy...