‘White nationalism’ a threat the Canadian Armed Forces aren’t equipped for: watchdog

[Kat Stevens]

I'm kind of surprised this hasn't been shouted from the rooftops.

Doesn’t fit the “monolithic organization of exclusion and hate” narrative.

 

[dimsum]

Doesn’t fit the “monolithic organization of exclusion and hate” narrative.

I meant from the CAF itself, not the GoC.

Although then there would be the "I'm a white cis-gender, hetero male and this is why I can't get in the CAF" response. I guess I just answered my own question.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I think Kat meant from the media,.......cause clickbait et al.

 

[Kat Stevens]

I think Kat meant from the media,.......cause clickbait et al.

Yup, but feel free to assume the worst of my motivation, its standard.

 

[singh1947]

I remember a Chaplain questioning whether Sikh beliefs are compatible with military service.

 

[brihard]

I remember a Chaplain questioning whether Sikh beliefs are compatible with military service.

Guessing he didn’t have a history degree, lol.

 

[Jarnhamar]

I remember a Chaplain questioning whether Sikh beliefs are compatible with military service.

Was he questioning Sikh beliefs or your interpretation of them being compatible with the CAF?

 

[singh1947]

Was he questioning Sikh beliefs or your interpretation of them being compatible with the CAF?

The Khalsa itself - there's not really a concept of 'your interpretation'.

You're either initiated & following Maryada (code) or not.

 

[Navy_Pete]

The Khalsa itself - there's not really a concept of 'your interpretation'.

You're either initiated & following Maryada (code) or not.

Pretty weird comment from the Padre. Off the top of my head I can't think of a major religion that doesn't preach peace while also having some kind of warrior culture. For a 'turn the other cheek' type Christians have a long history of aggressively attacking people.

 

[Jarnhamar]

The Khalsa itself - there's not really a concept of 'your interpretation'.

You're either initiated & following Maryada (code) or not.

That's cool. Is there a chapter in the Maryada about how a Sikh should treat other people?

 

[Colin Parkinson]

The Khalsa itself - there's not really a concept of 'your interpretation'.

You're either initiated & following Maryada (code) or not.

So how does that align with the CAF? I am more familiar with Islamic belief based on the Koran, Hadiths and jurisprudence.

 

[singh1947]

That's cool. Is there a chapter in the Maryada about how a Sikh should treat other people?

Not really since "other people" is a nebulous term.
All people are not the same, and it would be disingenuous to claim otherwise.

So how does that align with the CAF? I am more familiar with Islamic belief based on the Koran, Hadiths and jurisprudence.

Does Canadian jurisprudence allow the exclusion of any religious group?
If not then there's no point in worrying about it.

Aligning with the CAF means a willingness to listen and provide advice on integration/accommodation.

Pretty weird comment from the Padre. Off the top of my head I can't think of a major religion that doesn't preach peace while also having some kind of warrior culture. For a 'turn the other cheek' type Christians have a long history of aggressively attacking people.

"The strategy relies largely on the definition of Islamophobia created by the Ontario Human Rights Commission, namely: "stereotypes, bias or acts of hostility towards individual Muslims or followers of Islam in general. In addition to individual acts of intolerance and racial profiling, Islamophobia leads to viewing Muslims as a greater security threat on an institutional, systemic and societal level.""

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/peel-muslim-islamophobia-strategy-school-board-1.6726914

---
Just a morally righteous attitude combined with a comfortable status quo.
A Christian Chaplain won't lead Islamic prayers, and the idea that Sikhs have a similar attitude is what sparked the comments.

A Khalsa Sikh is already initiated to both defend the faith and administer spiritual affairs.
Sant-Sipahi, Saint-Soldier, Warrior-Priest.

A Chaplain is both a religious figure, and a commissioned officer.
While the latter is necessary the former has no relevance.

ਏਕਓਰਭਯੋਖਾਲਸਾਏੇਕਓਰਸੰਸਾਰ॥
The Khalsa stands on one side; the world on the other.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Not really since "other people" is a nebulous term.
All people are not the same, and it would be disingenuous to claim otherwise.


Does Canadian jurisprudence allow the exclusion of any religious group?
If not then there's no point in worrying about it.

Aligning with the CAF means a willingness to listen and provide advice on integration/accommodation.


"The strategy relies largely on the definition of Islamophobia created by the Ontario Human Rights Commission, namely: "stereotypes, bias or acts of hostility towards individual Muslims or followers of Islam in general. In addition to individual acts of intolerance and racial profiling, Islamophobia leads to viewing Muslims as a greater security threat on an institutional, systemic and societal level.""

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/peel-muslim-islamophobia-strategy-school-board-1.6726914

---
Just a morally righteous attitude combined with a comfortable status quo.
A Christian Chaplain won't lead Islamic prayers, and the idea that Sikhs have a similar attitude is what sparked the comments.

A Khalsa Sikh is already initiated to both defend the faith and administer spiritual affairs.
Sant-Sipahi, Saint-Soldier, Warrior-Priest.

A Chaplain is both a religious figure, and a commissioned officer.
While the latter is necessary the former has no relevance.

ਏਕਓਰਭਯੋਖਾਲਸਾਏੇਕਓਰਸੰਸਾਰ॥
The Khalsa stands on one side; the world on the other.

Every religion is a political, social construct, limiting and directing it's followers actions in this world. I more interested in real conflicts between teaching and current CAF polices and was hoping you could give me some samples. I am quite aware that the Sikhs have a long history of warfare and that is woven into the culture. I would like to hear from you where you have found friction points between the two.

 

[singh1947]

Every religion is a political, social construct, limiting and directing it's followers actions in this world. I more interested in real conflicts between teaching and current CAF polices and was hoping you could give me some samples. I am quite aware that the Sikhs have a long history of warfare and that is woven into the culture. I would like to hear from you where you have found friction points between the two.

Let me think on it, but haven't found much conflict on the policy side.
There's issues with implementation, but a lot of that is lack of knowledge + a mostly non-religious army.

Dietary restrictions are taken care of.
Smoking or tobacco use in close proximity is dealt with, but is a constant annoyance.
Definite policy issue as there're no clear guidelines, and the Kara or Kirpan are often only resource.

As far as, the Chaplaincy their role as a go-between and dedicated office for religion is valuable.
Many do not know how to separate their religious role from the admin one.
--

For example, I had a Chaplain claim Sikhi is about wearing 5K's + prayer & meditation.
No mention of Sangat (community/congregation) or Maryada (code) or Sewa (service).

Created a difficult situation.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

So what are the equivalents in Sihkism?

Koran = Holy book (actually about 4 versions, down from about 2,000)

Hadiths = teachings of the prophet (as decided by committee after his death)

Jurisprudence = legal precedent based off of interpretation of the Hadith

 

[singh1947]

So what are the equivalents in Sihkism?

Koran = Holy book (actually about 4 versions, down from about 2,000)

Hadiths = teachings of the prophet (as decided by committee after his death)

Jurisprudence = legal precedent based off of interpretation of the Hadith

1. Guru Granth Sahib - Aad Guru Granth, Dasam Guru Granth & Sarbloh Guru Granth Sahib.

Universal Philosophy, For Warriors, For Khalsa.

2. Various other Granths contemporary to and after Gurus

ie Prem Sumarag Granth which lays out ideals for a Sikh state/aristocrat.

3. Maryada (code) which the Gurus also followed.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Thanks, time for some reading now.

 

[singh1947]

Thanks, time for some reading now.

Most of those things aren't translated.
If reading scripture then cover head, no beef tobacco around.

Guru Nanak’s Baburvani: a Sikh theory of history

- a philosophical engagement

sialmirzagoraya.substack.com

This a good summary of many things.
If anyone gets through it and has comments please share.

ਸ਼੍ਰੀਅਕਾਲਸਹਾਇ

 

[Jarnhamar]

Not really since "other people" is a nebulous term.
All people are not the same, and it would be disingenuous to claim otherwise.

I don't think so.

I was thinking:

Let no corrupting talk come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for building up, as fits the occasion, that it may give grace to those who hear.

Do nothing from selfish ambition or conceit, but in humility count others more significant than yourselves.

Therefore encourage one another and build one another up, just as you are doing.

 

[singh1947]

I don't think so.

I was thinking:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1496537770541600770

ਖਾਲਸਾਸੋਜੋਦੰਗਾਮਚਾਵੈ

ਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਸੋਜੋਸੀਸਲਗਾਵੈ

Khalsa is the one who is turbulent (riots)

Khalsa is the one who sacrifices his head (life)

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਿਹ