2013 FY DEO Pilot Selection

[Mab163]

Thanks 26point2!

I know the timeline is pretty tight but if RectorCR is right, maybe I will gain some time with a selection after February (for BMOQ in April/May). Also, I heard that some people received a conditional offer without the air factor... Let's cross my fingers and hope for the best.

Good luck at BMOQ!!

 

[DAA]

I know the timeline is pretty tight but if RectorCR is right, maybe I will gain some time with a selection after February (for BMOQ in April/May). Also, I heard that some people received a conditional offer without the air factor... Let's cross my fingers and hope for the best.

I believe that DEO Pilot selections may very well be "ongoing".  As far as "conditional offers", once again, it all depends on your CFRC.  The average turn around time from completion of ASC to awarding of the AF (Air Factor) is right around 2 months.

I don't think this is true...as long as positions are open(Which they still are to my knowledge) and there are qualified applicants they can select people up until two days before a BMOQ start date.

Generally, applicants are selected NO less than 30 days prior to a BMOQ start date, optimum being 60 days.  So being selected "two days before a BMOQ start date", just isn't going to happen, no how, now way.

 

[Mab163]

Thank you very much DAA for your feedback! Much appreciated!

 

[DAA]

Thank you very much DAA for your feedback! Much appreciated!

My pleasure.  If Pilot is what you want, don't be overly concerned with the processing aspects of your application.  Pilot is currently OPEN and will most likely be OPEN for quite sometime.  Good luck!

 

[RectorCR]

I believe that DEO Pilot selections may very well be "ongoing".  As far as "conditional offers", once again, it all depends on your CFRC.  The average turn around time from completion of ASC to awarding of the AF (Air Factor) is right around 2 months.

Generally, applicants are selected NO less than 30 days prior to a BMOQ start date, optimum being 60 days.  So being selected "two days before a BMOQ start date", just isn't going to happen, no how, now way.

I'm just going off what my file manager told me (I probably shouldn't put to much into that) but also I know someone who got the call less then a week before his course. But in general I'm sure you're right.

 

[s2184]

Hi DAA,

Do you know anyone who has been hired with Commercial pilot Licence & the likelihood of hiring him at the age range of 40-50?

I am thinking should it be a good idea to get my commercial pilot licence & ratings first and then apply through DEO plan/accept the offer later.  :

(I visited the recruiting centre last month & they told me my medical file is still in Ottawa).

 

[Mab163]

Hi DAA,

Do you know anyone who has been hired with Commercial pilot Licence & the likelihood of hiring him at the age range of 40-50?

I am thinking should it be a good idea to get my commercial pilot licence & ratings first and then apply through DEO plan/accept the offer later.  :

(I visited the recruiting centre last month & they told me my medical file is still in Ottawa).

I can't say if a CPL will help you to get selected but if you fail any part of your pilot training, you will need to upgrade your civilian licence to try again. Therefore, you will need to obtain an ATPL if you have a CPL. However, with a CPL, I think you will bypass Phase I on the Grob and go directly to Phase IIa on the Havard II­.

 

[DAA]

I can't say if a CPL will help you to get selected but if you fail any part of your pilot training, you will need to upgrade your civilian licence to try again. Therefore, you will need to obtain an ATPL if you have a CPL. However, with a CPL, I think you will bypass Phase I on the Grob and go directly to Phase IIa on the Havard II­.

A Commercial Licence may be of help during the Aircrew Selection (ASC) testing stage but if you fail Aircrew Selection, you have to wait a year before re-attempting.  There is no longer a requirement to obtain a private pilots licence/rating inorder to attend ASC a second time.

DEO Pilot is still OPEN for this year, so they are still processing.  Age is not a barrier, go ahead and give it a try!!!  At least you can say you tried it!

 

[bradley247]

Hi DAA,

Do you know anyone who has been hired with Commercial pilot Licence & the likelihood of hiring him at the age range of 40-50?

I am thinking should it be a good idea to get my commercial pilot licence & ratings first and then apply through DEO plan/accept the offer later.  :

I know several people in their 40s who have gone through the flight training system in the last few years.

Forking out tens of thousands on a CPL just to join the RCAF is a pretty risky proposal unless it happens to be your plan B. A CPL doesn't guarantee you will get in by any means, and it could hurt you as much as it could help you in Moose Jaw, why not just apply DEO now?

 

[bradley247]

I can't say if a CPL will help you to get selected but if you fail any part of your pilot training, you will need to upgrade your civilian licence to try again. Therefore, you will need to obtain an ATPL if you have a CPL. However, with a CPL, I think you will bypass Phase I on the Grob and go directly to Phase IIa on the Havard II­.

If you have a CPL, you bypass Ph1. If you fail Ph1 for flying, the only way to try again is to transfer to another trade and become qualified, obtain a CPL and then apply for a component transfer to pilot. Failure of Ph2 or Ph3 is the end of the line, you cannot reattempt those courses.

 

[s2184]

Thank you very much DAA, Mab & Bradley for your insights.

To better understand my situation, I give you snapshots of my story in chronological order.  ;D

1- In 2005 I was interested in joining Canadian Forces, but at the time my colleagues in the work place gave me negative inputs & I was discouraged.

2-In 2009, once I was graduated I talked to a recruiter in campus & he told me I should have more than B+ overall GPA to apply for positions related to my field, mine was just B & therefore I stepped back again.

3-I started commercial pilot program in Seneca this year, & it was my Professor, who encouraged me to apply for the pilot position. At that time, I didn't know about DEO, so I applied through ROTP. But, there was a recruiter, who told me latter about DEO & she really changed my mind and encouraged me to fully focus on it at the time, when I was about to cancel my application process.

4-I am still waiting for my medical file to be cleared & for the appointment in Trenton. In the mean time I continue my studies in Seneca. According to my plan, I want to get my Seneca Diploma & Commercial pilot licence & ratings in the next 3-4/5 years. I don't know if I pass the tests & will be selected for Canadian Forces, how long it will take.

 

[DAA]

Thank you very much DAA, Mab & Bradley for your insights.
To better understand my situation, I give you snapshots of my story in chronological order.  ;D
1- In 2005 I was interested in joining Canadian Forces, but at the time my colleagues in the work place gave me negative inputs & I was discouraged.
2-In 2009, once I was graduated I talked to a recruiter in campus & he told me I should have more than B+ overall GPA to apply for positions related to my field, mine was just B & therefore I stepped back again.
3-I started commercial pilot program in Seneca this year, & it was my Professor, who encouraged me to apply for the pilot position. At that time, I didn't know about DEO, so I applied through ROTP. But, there was a recruiter, who told me latter about DEO & she really changed my mind and encouraged me to fully focus on it at the time, when I was about to cancel my application process.
4-I am still waiting for my medical file to be cleared & for the appointment in Trenton. In the mean time I continue my studies in Seneca. According to my plan, I want to get my Seneca Diploma & Commercial pilot licence & ratings in the next 3-4/5 years. I don't know if I pass the tests & will be selected for Canadian Forces, how long it will take.

Interesting.....

I think you should take a "serious" look, not at DEO but rather at CEOTP-AEAD Pilot!!!  You are already studying at Seneca, so if you pass your Aircrew Selection testing in Trenton, an offer of employment under the CEOTP-AEAD Pilot program should be a "no brainer"!

I am surprised that this option was not discussed with you!

If your going to continue your studies, why not have it paid for by he CF?

 

[bradley247]

I talked to a recruiter in campus & he told me I should have more than B+ overall GPA to apply for positions related to my field, mine was just B & therefore I stepped back again.

Not true at all.

3-I started commercial pilot program in Seneca this year, & it was my Professor, who encouraged me to apply for the pilot position. At that time, I didn't know about DEO, so I applied through ROTP. But, there was a recruiter, who told me latter about DEO & she really changed my mind and encouraged me to fully focus on it at the time, when I was about to cancel my application process.

4-I am still waiting for my medical file to be cleared & for the appointment in Trenton. In the mean time I continue my studies in Seneca. According to my plan, I want to get my Seneca Diploma & Commercial pilot licence & ratings in the next 3-4/5 years. I don't know if I pass the tests & will be selected for Canadian Forces, how long it will take.

Not to get into semantics and all, but you mentioned "diploma", and just making sure you know that a college diploma, even in aviation, is not acceptable for DEO. You must have a university degree. I couldn't tell from your posts if you already have a degree, or if you are in Seneca's degree program.

I'm not sure CEOTP pilot would work for you, it's not designed to pick up students who have already started their studies like ROTP is. It's a very structured program with tight schedules, and my understanding from talking to one of them is that first year for them generally consists of basic training, OJT and Phase 1.

 

[DAA]

Not to get into semantics and all, but you mentioned "diploma", and just making sure you know that a college diploma, even in aviation, is not acceptable for DEO. You must have a university degree. I couldn't tell from your posts if you already have a degree, or if you are in Seneca's degree program.

I'm not sure CEOTP pilot would work for you, it's not designed to pick up students who have already started their studies like ROTP is. It's a very structured program with tight schedules, and my understanding from talking to one of them is that first year for them generally consists of basic training, OJT and Phase 1.

That was my original train of thought, when the mention of DEO came up.  But believe it or not, Seneca is a "degree" granting institution, so as long as he is taking the "Bachelors in Aviation Technology", it is considered acceptable.

s2184 is already at Seneca and already in the program, so I don't see why CEOTP would not be a viable and more "preferred" option.  It is definitely something worth exploring.....

 

[bradley247]

That was my original train of thought, when the mention of DEO came up.  But believe it or not, Seneca is a "degree" granting institution, so as long as he is taking the "Bachelors in Aviation Technology", it is considered acceptable.

s2184 is already at Seneca and already in the program, so I don't see why CEOTP would not be a viable and more "preferred" option.  It is definitely something worth exploring.....

Yes, but they have both aviation diploma and degree programs, just wanted to make sure.

CEOTP pilot is totally different from Seneca's aviation program, so he would have to basically start over from scratch if he went that route. They do all their flight training with the military instead of the school, and the school credits their military flight training and other courses towards their degree. They do basic training, all their small courses (BSERE, PFT etc) and a bit of OJT first year, do a semester at the school, then go do Ph 2 and 3, followed by another semester. Like I mentioned, very structured program with tight timelines (they walk away after 4 years with wings and a degree), so what s2184 does this year in Seneca's aviation program wouldn't be even remotely equivalent.

 

[DAA]

Yes, but they have both aviation diploma and degree programs, just wanted to make sure.

CEOTP pilot is totally different from Seneca's aviation program, so he would have to basically start over from scratch if he went that route. They do all their flight training with the military instead of the school, and the school credits their military flight training and other courses towards their degree. They do basic training, all their small courses (BSERE, PFT etc) and a bit of OJT first year, do a semester at the school, then go do Ph 2 and 3, followed by another semester. Like I mentioned, very structured program with tight timelines (they walk away after 4 years with wings and a degree), so what s2184 does this year in Seneca's aviation program wouldn't be even remotely equivalent.

Still, I would encourage CEOTP-AEAD as the entry plan as his current options are "ROTP" only.....but based on his post, my thoughts are....

1.  If he is taking the "diploma" program and graduates, then he is NOT eligible for DEO, back to square one.
2.  If he is taking the "Bachelors in Aviation Technology" program, then it's the samething CEOTP-AEAD Pilots are taking.  Mind you, he would be behind the curve trg wise but it would still be of benefit to the CF.
3.  If he is taking the "diploma" program and goes CEOTP-AEAD and is accepted, then I am pretty sure that Seneca would no doubt grant him some form of credit for his past courses taken at their instituition.

 

[bradley247]

2.  If he is taking the "Bachelors in Aviation Technology" program, then it's the samething CEOTP-AEAD Pilots are taking.  Mind you, he would be behind the curve trg wise but it would still be of benefit to the CF.
3.  If he is taking the "diploma" program and goes CEOTP-AEAD and is accepted, then I am pretty sure that Seneca would no doubt grant him some form of credit for his past courses taken at their instituition.

2. No, it's not. The CEOTP program and the "Bachelors in Aviation Technology" program are completely different (as I've already explained), even the academic semesters they do are not all the same courses as the civi program. There is no provision in the program for someone to start part-way through, because the first year includes 5 career courses (BMOQ, Sea Survival, AMT, BSERE, PFT) which he would not have.

3. That's a pretty big assumption, I wouldn't count on it.

 

[DAA]

2. No, it's not. The CEOTP program and the "Bachelors in Aviation Technology" program are completely different (as I've already explained), even the academic semesters they do are not all the same courses as the civi program. There is no provision in the program for someone to start part-way through, because the first year includes 5 career courses (BMOQ, Sea Survival, AMT, BSERE, PFT) which he would not have.

3. That's a pretty big assumption, I wouldn't count on it.

So your telling me, that CEOTP-AEAD Pilots don't receive the same level of academics whilst attending the "Bachelors of Aviation Technology" program as their civilian counterparts pursing the same degree program?   

Other than the CF component, there is no difference in academics.  And I am pretty sure, consideration would be given for someone to start "part-way" through on the academic side of the house.

If you take a course at an Academic instituition, I am fairly certain that they will recognize one of their "own" courses and or grant credit for it if you transfer academic streams.

PS - CEOTP is not a "program", it's an "Entry Plan".

 

[bradley247]

So your telling me, that CEOTP-AEAD Pilots don't receive the same level of academics whilst attending the "Bachelors of Aviation Technology" program as their civilian counterparts pursing the same degree program?   

Other than the CF component, there is no difference in academics.  And I am pretty sure, consideration would be given for someone to start "part-way" through on the academic side of the house.

If you take a course at an Academic instituition, I am fairly certain that they will recognize one of their "own" courses and or grant credit for it if you transfer academic streams.

PS - CEOTP is not a "program", it's an "Entry Plan".

Correct, Seneca grants credit for CF training, so CF members do not take all the same courses as the civi program, in fact the military pilots only do 4 academic semesters, vice 8 in the civi program, they also do AFOD and CFJOD as part of their academics. They do not do any of the flying either, all their flight training is done through the military.

I think I figured out what's confusing you, this isn't a civi program that the CF is loading people onto, it is also not like a university where you just get all the required courses and get a degree. This is a very structured, scheduled training plan, mixing military and academic training. Maybe he would have a couple courses out of the way, but he would still be lacking about a year of military training, it would not be practical for him to be loaded on the program and be expected to catch up.

I'm also aware that CEOTP is an entry plan, however I'm using "CEOTP program" in reference to the CEOTP-AEAD, a structured training program that is a partnership between Seneca College and the RCAF, which is distinctly different than traditional CEOTP.

 

[RobOfstie]

Actually, the Military folks do a total of 5 semesters.  Believe it or not, we've been specifically told that regardless of the academic institution, NO PREVIOUS CREDITS will be granted.  Even if you were previously a Civilian Seneca FPR student.  It's a very structured program.  s2184 -  I'm currently the course senior for the Seneca-AEADS 1301 course and I would like to touch base.  I'm fairly confident I could answer most of your questions, just PM me. 

Cheers!