2026 US-Denmark Tensions/End of NATO

[Altair]

Well we already have tanks there (including Canadian tanks) so yes they will roll. The Baltic will be closed to them as will the Black Sea. Likely every refinery and major oil pipeline will be targeted by NATO crippling their economy. NATO navies will blockade their coastline. An economic embargo...a real one not like the sieve-like one currently underway...will stifle their trade.

Putin may not give a damn about the Russian economy but when Russians are cold and hungry in the dark he'll care about his skin.

And when we find put what happens to tanks when drones come into play?

 

[GR66]

And when we find put what happens to tanks when drones come into play?

I guess the same as what would happen to their tanks. The Russians, like the Soviets are not 12' tall giants.

 

[Altair]

I guess the same as what would happen to their tanks. The Russians, like the Soviets are not 12' tall giants.

No, but they have the second most experienced drone forces on the planet.

Seeing as that is where warfare is heading, writing them off is premature.

Russia is currently fighting the next war, we haven't even really begun the process of pivoting to it.

The Brits getting wiped out by the Ukrainians in an exercise was a warning shot to the west. If the Ukrainians can do it, the Russians can too.

 

[GR66]

No, but they have the second most experienced drone forces on the planet.

Seeing as that is where warfare is heading, writing them off is premature.

Russia is currently fighting the next war, we haven't even really begun the process of pivoting to it.

The Brits getting wiped out by the Ukrainians in an exercise was a warning shot to the west. If the Ukrainians can do it, the Russians can too.

And how much Ukrainian territory have those Russian drone forces managed to capture this year?

Yes, drones have changed the nature of war but it's a mistake to take what's happening in Ukraine as being directly transferable to what a Russia/NATO war would look like.

 

[Altair]

And how much Ukrainian territory have those Russian drone forces managed to capture this year?

Yes, drones have changed the nature of war but it's a mistake to take what's happening in Ukraine as being directly transferable to what a Russia/NATO war would look like.

I'm getting Spanish civil war vibes here...

The Brits and the French looked at it and decided that there were no lessons to be learned. The Germans took notes.

Again a NATO military, the UK, got their asses handed to them by the Ukrainians and your takeaway is its not transferable?

My takeaway is we are not ready.

As for the Russians losing to the Ukrainians, yes, they are losing to the best drone forces on the planet. They wouldn't have that disadvantage versus NATO

 

[brihard]

And how much Ukrainian territory have those Russian drone forces managed to capture this year?

Yes, drones have changed the nature of war but it's a mistake to take what's happening in Ukraine as being directly transferable to what a Russia/NATO war would look like.

Altair’s cocky, but on this one he’s right. Russia has a level of experience in new ways of killing people and breaking their shit that we appear unable to even wrap our heads around. While we do see a highly selective and curated depiction of drone warfare, nonetheless the reality is thousands or tens of thousands going out per day, and AFVs getting smoked tens of kilometers before reaching FEBA. If we continue to posture our forces against Russia as a strategic threat, we’d best be live to the tactical realities. I don’t think we’re so super special that we’ll be immune to new TTPs.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

And how much Ukrainian territory have those Russian drone forces managed to capture this year?

Yes, drones have changed the nature of war but it's a mistake to take what's happening in Ukraine as being directly transferable to what a Russia/NATO war would look like.

The Russian strategy is one of attrition, not maneuver. Territorial gains aren't Russia's objective at this time. Eroding Ukraine's capacity to resist through attrition is the objective.

Altair’s cocky, but on this one he’s right. Russia has a level of experience in new ways of killing people and breaking their shit that we appear unable to even wrap our heads around. While we do see a highly selective and curated depiction of drone warfare, nonetheless the reality is thousands or tens of thousands going out per day, and AFVs getting smoked tens of kilometers before reaching FEBA. If we continue to posture our forces against Russia as a strategic threat, we’d best be live to the tactical realities. I don’t think we’re so super special that we’ll be immune to new TTPs.

They launched over 1,000 long range strike drones in the past 48 hrs alone. The Russian strike complex and its ability to sustain the numbers they are is something that needs to be studied and understood.

 

[HavokFour]

Altair’s cocky, but on this one he’s right. Russia has a level of experience in new ways of killing people and breaking their shit that we appear unable to even wrap our heads around. While we do see a highly selective and curated depiction of drone warfare, nonetheless the reality is thousands or tens of thousands going out per day, and AFVs getting smoked tens of kilometers before reaching FEBA. If we continue to posture our forces against Russia as a strategic threat, we’d best be live to the tactical realities. I don’t think we’re so super special that we’ll be immune to new TTPs.

Israel is now getting this lesson.

Lots of footage coming out the past week of Hezbollah FPV's striking soldiers, tanks, and very nearly a Medevac.

They're even fielding fiber-optic drones.

 

[Altair]

The Russian strategy is one of attrition, not maneuver. Territorial gains aren't Russia's objective at this time. Eroding Ukraine's capacity to resist through attrition is the objective.


They launched over 1,000 long range strike drones in the past 48 hrs alone. The Russian strike complex and its ability to sustain the numbers they are is something that needs to be studied and understood.

Ukraine is using 10k FPV drone a DAY

Over 3.65m per year.

And they are only just pushing Russia back, one small village at a time.

I'm going to guess, the entirety of NATO does not make 3.65m FPV drones a year.

According to the Ukrainians, the Russians are making 19k FPV drones a day, but only able to field somewhere like 1-2k due to starlink being down and lack of trained operators.

If Russia spends the time between the Ukraine war and any war with NATO able fix front line satelite coverage and getting enough trained operators, they will absolutely demolish standard NATO forces wherever they concentrate to counterattack any Russian incursion.

But between the thousands of long range strike drones and tens of the thousands of FPV drones they are estimated to be building per day, NATO needs to play catch up or be caught flat footed if Putin decides to roll the dice again.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Ukraine is using 10k FPV drone a DAY

Over 3.65m per year.

And they are only just pushing Russia back, one small village at a time.

I'm going to guess, the entirety of NATO does not make 3.65m FPV drones a year.

According to the Ukrainians, the Russians are making 19k FPV drones a day, but only able to field somewhere like 1-2k due to starlink being down and lack of trained operators.

If Russia spends the time between the Ukraine war and any war with NATO being about fix front line satelite coverage and getting enough trained operators, they will absolutely demolish standard NATO forces wherever they concentrate to counterattack any Russian incursion.

But between the thousands of long range strike drones and tens of the thousands of FPV drones they are estimated to be building per day, NATO needs to play catch up or be caught flat footed if Putin decides to roll the dice again.

That's according to Ukrainian sources. The matter is more nuanced. I do believe the UAF has an advantage in tactical FPV drones; however, Russia has a significant advantage in long-range strike drones, artillery, electronic warfare and it's got overwhelming advantage in air power allowing it to drop hundreds of glide bombs every week.

This allows Russia to maintain pressure on the Ukrainian frontline, which is why the Russian Army is still advancing within the fortress belt, and now also able to open up other parts of the front.

 

[Altair]

That's according to Ukrainian sources. The matter is more nuanced. I do believe the UAF has an advantage in tactical FPV drones; however, Russia has a significant advantage in long-range strike drones, artillery, electronic warfare and it's got overwhelming advantage in air power allowing it to drop hundreds of glide bombs every week.

This allows Russia to maintain pressure on the Ukrainian frontline, which is why the Russian Army is still advancing within the fortress belt, and now also able to open up other parts of the front.

In a NATO context, think that long range strike drones, artillery, EW and air power wont be advantages for the Russians.

But in a tactical sense, on the frontlines, FPV drones will make any conflict with NATO forces very costly (For NATO)

 

[Brad Sallows]

And when we find put what happens to tanks when drones come into play?

We learn, and the war goes on.

Find a Churchill to put some spine into people who go around counseling fears and safety concerns, at least until the crisis is passed.

 

[Altair]

We learn, and the war goes on.

Find a Churchill to put some spine into people who go around counseling fears and safety concerns, at least until the crisis is passed.

They don't make Churchills any more, they make Starmers and Mertzs.

Johnson might have made a good Churchill...

I hope we learn, I really do, but if we were learning, where are our 4-6 million FPVs a year? Why are we still thinking about driving tanks up to the frontline like they will survive waves of drones going after them?

Ukraine and Russia are giving the entire world a crash course in how war is going to be fought and we are sitting around twiddling our thumbs.

Ukraine beat up a NATO force in a exercise and it wasn't even close and all we get is a collective shrug.

I don't get it.