Allowances - Post Living Differential (PLD) [MERGED]

[Halifax Tar]

You mean the current policy limiting RHU charges to no more than 25% of income?

Lol oh snap! Man you're playing 4D chess and here I am playing checkers.

 

[Quirky]

Soooo if you’re a Cpl Spec 1, which is the majority of the RCAF, you’ll not only lose PLD in the places you had PLD before because 1. You make too much base pay and 2. You live in a PMQ. You’ll never qualify for a mortgage anyway in high COL areas, and if you do, you’ll lose what little offset this gives you because you make too much.

This is a complete swing and a miss.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

You mean the current policy limiting RHU charges to no more than 25% of income?

yes/no/maybe

jazz hands

 

[Furniture]

I will just throw this out there - for anyone upset with something about CAF pay and benefits, please ensure to include "relative to X" in your point, as it will be helpful in understanding the merits of the argument, especially if you frame it with other Canadian wage earners.

You mean the current policy limiting RHU charges to no more than 25% of income?

And senior CAF leaders wonder why the troops feel like their senior leaders are out of touch...

 

[markppcli]

A lot of folks in Edmonton had that high rate of PLD factored into their income, especially when trying to qualify for a mortgage. There were also quite a few folks that have been in place for 15 years and collecting the allowance continually. If folks are going to make a stink because DPPD clued into the slush fund, that's on them.

Also, the Patch isn't at all what it once was. Especially as the Just Transition is starting to take effect. There will be quite a few folks that are going to have to face up to the consequences of their own assumptions.

The CAF giveth, and the CAF can taketh away.

The point of PLD was to pay for cost of living, or your monthly needs. Full stop. So if some one was paying for their house with it, that’s the bloody point.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

And senior CAF leaders wonder why the troops feel like their senior leaders are out of touch...

I don't know about snr leaders, but I'm going to guess conversations in some homes tonight will be CAF mbr trying to explain to spouse how they will manage to pay the bills, put some money away for Sally's university and eat at the same time.

With the CAF spouse not caring "about some fuckin' X".

 

[markppcli]

I haven’t done the math as I’m happily unaffected but I’m being told a PO1 in Esquimalt will see their income reduced by 210 a month. Relative to last year that is.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

A lot of folks in Edmonton had that high rate of PLD factored into their income, especially when trying to qualify for a mortgage. There were also quite a few folks that have been in place for 15 years and collecting the allowance continually. If folks are going to make a stink because DPPD clued into the slush fund, that's on them.

Also, the Patch isn't at all what it once was. Especially as the Just Transition is starting to take effect. There will be quite a few folks that are going to have to face up to the consequences of their own assumptions.

The CAF giveth, and the CAF can taketh away.

That seems like a rare "wide brush with the wrong paint" post for you. You're usually one of the more balanced posters - this one seems oddly myopic re: 'slush fund'.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I haven’t done the math as I’m happily unaffected but I’m being told a PO1 in Esquimalt will see their income reduced by 210 a month. Relative to last year that is.

It gets worse if they are in a PMQ.

I'm a CPO2 in Hal, and I will see about an extra 100$ for a year after losing PLD and then enter the 0 zone.

For most P1 and above folks out here the "pay raise" is about equal to the loss of PLD.

 

[KTown Cowboy]

Military pay - Canada.ca

This page displays information about pay for Canadian Armed Forces members.

www.canada.ca

Military pay - Canada.ca

This page displays information about pay for Canadian Armed Forces members.

www.canada.ca

This also just appeared.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

With the middle finger Spec 1 trades we given compared to Standard and Spec 2, and the PLD change, my monthly total will go down.

Accordingly, so will my GAFF and willingness to do...oh, pretty much anything I don't really want to.

I'll correct myself and admit, my numbers were off. I'll be slightly up with the difference in COL increase - PLD decrease. I was using 2022 rates vice 2023.

But...that's still just a "less worse" situation IMO.

 

[Furniture]

I haven’t done the math as I’m happily unaffected but I’m being told a PO1 in Esquimalt will see their income reduced by 210 a month. Relative to last year that is.

I just did some quick mathing, a non-spec PO 1 S04 will go from $7883/m to $8241/m come 1 Jul. A Spec 1 PO 1 will go from $8492/m to $8591/m.

Edit: The above numers are for those not living in RHUs, in RHUs; non-Spec $7691, Spec 1 $8306. I suspect it's the guys in RHUs that make up the loss of $200 a month numbers.

For contrast, a non-spec SO4 PO 1 in Ottawa goes from 7067/m to 7941/m.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

On this page, when you click the link "2023 (Effective 1 April 2023) it takes you to a page that says "

2023 Pay rates for NCMs (Effective 1 July 2023)​

 

[Infanteer]

And senior CAF leaders wonder why the troops feel like their senior leaders are out of touch...

Doesn't answer my question though. Who is losing out here? All Corporals? POs in Valcartier? Master Corporals in Halifax?

As well, what is the expectation? What is fair in the eyes of Furniture?

 

[Furniture]

Doesn't answer my question though. Who is losing out here? All Corporals? POs in Valcartier? Master Corporals in Halifax?

As well, what is the expectation? What is fair in the eyes of Furniture?

My suspicion is that the people about to lose money with the new "Economic Increase" don't particularly care about what is fair to PO 1s in Valcartier.

There are CAF members who were hoping for some relief, and are instead finding out that they are about to lose money. Maybe it doesn't matter to those already in the upper end of the Canadian economic spectrum, but for the NCMs living somewhere near the middle, it matters a lot.

I personally stand to gain the better part of $1K a month before taxes, but even I can understand that this is going to go over like a lead balloon in some places, so making comments to the effect of "Get over it, other Canadians have it worse" isn't going to help things.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

That seems like a rare "wide brush with the wrong paint" post for you. You're usually one of the more balanced posters - this one seems oddly myopic re: 'slush fund'.

You're right and thank you for calling me out on this.

I think I may have come off a bit jaded in my previous post. I have been in a 0 PLD location for a while now and seen a fair amount of my former colleagues in Edmo making PLD they don't necessarily need in a lower CoL location.

The posting message roulette for PLD now is somewhat over and things are looking equitable for the first little while. I know this will burn a few folks, but it's going also help quite a few more.

When you only have $1.75, and you need $3 to cover all your bases, it's impossible to make everyone happy.

I will revisit the lesson my father taught me in these kinds of matters:

"the only time it's OK to look into someone else's bowl is to make sure they have enough; not bitch about them getting more."

 

[Stoker]

You're right and thank you for calling me out on this.

I think I may have come off a bit jaded in my previous post. I have been in a 0 PLD location for a while now and seen a fair amount of my former colleagues in Edmo making PLD they don't necessarily need in a lower CoL location.

The posting message roulette for PLD now is somewhat over and things are looking equitable for the first little while. I know this will burn a few folks, but it's going also help quite a few more.

When you only have $1.75, and you need $3 to cover all your bases, it's impossible to make everyone happy.

I will revisit the lesson my father taught me in theae kinds of matters:

"the only time it's OK to look into someone else's bowl is to make sure they have e enough; not bitch about them getting more."

Except for the fact they're giving back 30M of unspent funds and seem proud of that fact........

 

[Infanteer]

My suspicion is that the people about to lose money with the new "Economic Increase" don't particularly care about what is fair to PO 1s in Valcartier.

There are CAF members who were hoping for some relief, and are instead finding out that they are about to lose money. Maybe it doesn't matter to those already in the upper end of the Canadian economic spectrum, but for the NCMs living somewhere near the middle, it matters a lot.

I personally stand to gain the better part of $1K a month before taxes, but even I can understand that this is going to go over like a lead balloon in some places, so making comments to the effect of "Get over it, other Canadians have it worse" isn't going to help things.

Who is losing out?

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Doesn't answer my question though. Who is losing out here?

I'll take a stab at it; how about "every jnr NCM posted to Esq and Pat Bay" for starters. It's not like the COL was forgiving there before the current rates of inflation. I've heard inflation is 15-19% - this COL increase is less than that. Now add in, they're living in RHUs, because the housing costs out there are crazy.

Are you okay with those people now worrying and struggling?

 

[Halifax Tar]

You're right and thank you for calling me out on this.

I think I may have come off a bit jaded in my previous post. I have been in a 0 PLD location for a while now and seen a fair amount of my former colleagues in Edmo making PLD they don't necessarily need in a lower CoL location.

The posting message roulette for PLD now is somewhat over and things are looking equitable for the first little while. I know this will burn a few folks, but it's going also help quite a few more.

When you only have $1.75, and you need $3 to cover all your bases, it's impossible to make everyone happy.

I will revisit the lesson my father taught me in thede kinds of matters:

"the only time it's OK to look into someone else's bowl is to make sure they have enough; not bitch about them getting more."

No one is mad at people who this is working for.

It's possible to help everyone you know.