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My unit is supposed to get 12.
ATV RECCE TRIALS
- Thread starter ackland
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My unit is supposed to get 12.
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Greetings All..
In ref to the remarks that a unit was getting 6 G-Wagens and another was getting 12..where is this info coming from? I have the spreadsheet in front of me right now with national distribution for all units, reg and res. It says 16 for each and every reserve unit.
Later..
In ref to the remarks that a unit was getting 6 G-Wagens and another was getting 12..where is this info coming from? I have the spreadsheet in front of me right now with national distribution for all units, reg and res. It says 16 for each and every reserve unit.
Later..
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Our transport NCO mentioned us getting a dozen or so, and one of the officers gave us a speech about the G-Wagons, when we're getting them, how many we're getting and when the courses for them are supposed to start, and he also mentioned getting 12.
But this is the army. What is said one day is not necessairly the rule for the next. Things might have changed.
But this is the army. What is said one day is not necessairly the rule for the next. Things might have changed.
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I wouldn't be surprised if Lost Warrior is correct about his unit only getting 12 of the 16 they are allocated .
34CBG is quite the place for pooling equipment . My unit has no radio's and only 1 MILCOT , the rest are pooled .
Some unit that has no need of the LUVW SMP will be tooling around with them , using it as a canteen vehicle no doubt .
Craig
34CBG is quite the place for pooling equipment . My unit has no radio's and only 1 MILCOT , the rest are pooled .
Some unit that has no need of the LUVW SMP will be tooling around with them , using it as a canteen vehicle no doubt .
Craig
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:skull: 
Hey there, if you buy a kawi 750 brute force you can haul a trailer and mount a c9 mg in the front of the bike. The other bikes can take the same amount of kit and you can hide them in the woods at your OP base, alot better than a stupid truck! You leave on foot Set up your OP and do your job. They are very fast and have lots of power to haul whatever you want to take. You can add a track to them in the winter for the snow or the spring for the mud. They are harder to see than a truck or a coyote! I'snt RECCE see but not be seen!!!!
:threat:
Hey there, if you buy a kawi 750 brute force you can haul a trailer and mount a c9 mg in the front of the bike. The other bikes can take the same amount of kit and you can hide them in the woods at your OP base, alot better than a stupid truck! You leave on foot Set up your OP and do your job. They are very fast and have lots of power to haul whatever you want to take. You can add a track to them in the winter for the snow or the spring for the mud. They are harder to see than a truck or a coyote! I'snt RECCE see but not be seen!!!! :threat:
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Don't know which Unit you are with? or where were you, when we in Oshawa, were on them? :
.
(thinking of more negative than positive for ATVs right now) I, for one, am glad that I can put that trial behind me and at least get back to some semblance of organized recce training.
.(thinking of more negative than positive for ATVs right now) I, for one, am glad that I can put that trial behind me and at least get back to some semblance of organized recce training.
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17thRecceSgt
Guest
This is only my 2 cents worth...I wouldn't want them. What do I do with the kit I might need...get the matching trailor? Who is "observing" when I am driving and commanding...I am imaging being in a hurry but having to stop to navigate, cause I have 2 hands right? and can't imagine trying to read a map and drive a ATV cross country or at high speeds (say...40 km/h), while navigating and then there is the question of your weapons, of whatever kind. IF you came under contact and are tryin' to get out of dodge...who is engaging while you are driving? or vice versa.
Even for limited ops in terms of time or distance...I can remember times on ex where having a 3 man crew in the Iltis was busy, giving your dvr instr, emplying the JAFO, watching the map, plotting contacts, sending SITREPs, dismounting for drills, etc etc...and even in them you could never seem to get all the kit you needed in the sucker...
If you want me to use something that I am the only person going to be on...please, give me a mountain bike. I can carry about the same amount of kit... have the same abilities as a "crew"...BUT...Atleast then, the noise won't give away my position, which will save me the delima of trying to decide if I want to break contact, or engage the contact, neither of which I can do at the same time...no matter how many times I watch the James Bond movies.
Just my opinion folks...
Cheers
Even for limited ops in terms of time or distance...I can remember times on ex where having a 3 man crew in the Iltis was busy, giving your dvr instr, emplying the JAFO, watching the map, plotting contacts, sending SITREPs, dismounting for drills, etc etc...and even in them you could never seem to get all the kit you needed in the sucker...
If you want me to use something that I am the only person going to be on...please, give me a mountain bike. I can carry about the same amount of kit... have the same abilities as a "crew"...BUT...Atleast then, the noise won't give away my position, which will save me the delima of trying to decide if I want to break contact, or engage the contact, neither of which I can do at the same time...no matter how many times I watch the James Bond movies.
Just my opinion folks...
Cheers
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17th Recce Sgt said:
Really?..........welcome to the world of crew commanding. No one ever said it was simple :
If you do it for a while it will become second nature to you"If you can't run with the big dawgs, stay under the porch"
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17thRecceSgt
Guest
Maybe you didn't get my point.
If a jeep with a crew of 3 is busy and can't hold everything you want, how would an ATV be better at the task. Thats the point. Use your imagination and you will see what I was getting at. I would love to see an ATV with the vehicle, troop kit, crew servered weapons, ammo, water, comm's gear lashed on it somehow.
Try crew commanding for awhile? LOL. Whatever. 12 years with Recce Sqn, I think I past that one a while ago but thanks for the concern.
I was trained to crew command at the Center of Excellence, including 6B...so you are slamming the cadre at the School not me.
Just my thoughts. If ya got nothing nice to say, maybe you should say nothing?
If a jeep with a crew of 3 is busy and can't hold everything you want, how would an ATV be better at the task. Thats the point. Use your imagination and you will see what I was getting at. I would love to see an ATV with the vehicle, troop kit, crew servered weapons, ammo, water, comm's gear lashed on it somehow.
Try crew commanding for awhile? LOL. Whatever. 12 years with Recce Sqn, I think I past that one a while ago but thanks for the concern.
I was trained to crew command at the Center of Excellence, including 6B...so you are slamming the cadre at the School not me.
Just my thoughts. If ya got nothing nice to say, maybe you should say nothing?
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17thRecceSgt
Guest
Yes, I did that. Lets just hope I don't have to work for him some day? Can you say "extra's"? 
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17th Recce Sgt said:
Well.. the short answer to all your questions is "this is how you occupy a Reserve unit's time for 2 years while you try and figure out what to do with them"...
Hey my question is how do you bribe a Mod to turn the pushpin feature off this thread?? so it can disappear into the archives
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17th Recce Sgt said:
I am not being dragged into this one.
I get your point just fine.
IF you show up on an Army site, post on an armoured board, and tell us what you have to do while crew commanding you are preaching to the choir.
And on top of that, you think that if someone set you loose on an ATV they would expect you to carry Iltis Kit? Why???
I'm confident that the kit would reflect the veh's capabilities, limitations and mission.
When you refer to "The Centre of Excellence" do you mean the Armoured School?
If so, There has been a lot of people through there. They give you a good foundation and ensure you meet the minimum standard, That is their job. The Regiment and experience makes you a Crew Commander.
And finally I would have looked forward to having you work for me. There would have been no "extra's. As you know that is not a legal method of correction. QR&O's cover everything a supervisor needs to make a soldier better.
George Wallace
Army.ca Dinosaur
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17
I was 17th way before you were a gleam in your father's eye, and I could do all that and run a 7 car troop with only two pers per veh. I just don't know how you 'young' guys have lost touch with your basic skills so easily.
Many of us in this forum have worked in Lynx with only two pers as crew many times. Your points to the contrary are invalid.
As Unknown C/S stated, you do what you must with what you got. Just because you thought you needed three people in an Iltis, doesn't mean that is the requirement for every vehicle. We have worked with three in a Coyote, even thought it should have a crew of four. In Battle you may loose a crewmember. Does that mean that your veh is now out of the fight? No. You carry on until such time as you can get a replacement. The time to practice is when we are not at war.
I was 17th way before you were a gleam in your father's eye, and I could do all that and run a 7 car troop with only two pers per veh. I just don't know how you 'young' guys have lost touch with your basic skills so easily.
Many of us in this forum have worked in Lynx with only two pers as crew many times. Your points to the contrary are invalid.
As Unknown C/S stated, you do what you must with what you got. Just because you thought you needed three people in an Iltis, doesn't mean that is the requirement for every vehicle. We have worked with three in a Coyote, even thought it should have a crew of four. In Battle you may loose a crewmember. Does that mean that your veh is now out of the fight? No. You carry on until such time as you can get a replacement. The time to practice is when we are not at war.
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Technically you could have a crew of 4.....technically. There are 4 seats, driver, CC and 2 jump seats on either side of the CC.
All Ferret crews that I have talked to say they never rolled with anymore than 2 pers per...and these guys were rolling in Cyprus, Sinai etc.
I can't see them training here in Canada with a crew of 4
Regards
All Ferret crews that I have talked to say they never rolled with anymore than 2 pers per...and these guys were rolling in Cyprus, Sinai etc.
I can't see them training here in Canada with a crew of 4
Regards
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Thanks Franko
They must have been putting some awfully skinny kids in Recce units back then. I have seen a couple of Ferrets (Crown Surplus in Calgary used to have one years ago IIRC) so I have a recollection of their size. Don't remember actually looking inside one though.
Cheers.
They must have been putting some awfully skinny kids in Recce units back then. I have seen a couple of Ferrets (Crown Surplus in Calgary used to have one years ago IIRC) so I have a recollection of their size. Don't remember actually looking inside one though.
Cheers.
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17thRecceSgt
Guest
The orginal question was about what are people's thoughts on ATV for conducting mud recce. Right? So I offered my thoughts in a "thinking out loud" format with what I consider some well-deserved sarcasism on the issue. It wasn't intended as a "preaching to the choir" on what to do or how to CC. The sarcasism, I thought, would have been evident with the mountain bike comment...or did people think I was serious on that. Man...you DO think all res guys are dumb if thats the case. The point I was "trying" (but apparantely failed) to make was...if you change, change for the better. Not for the worse.
Unknown, not trying to disrepect you, your experience or anything like that, but I am not into being shot down for giving an opinion, especially when comments or opinions were asked for. If you didn't see where I was going or the sarcastic "thinking out loud" approach, then you just didn't see it. I, if you read back, never said anything about putting Iltis kit on a AFV. I said "vehicle kit, troop kit, etc etc. No mention of Iltis. Even us Res guys would scale the kit to the veh, mission, etc etc. Not all of us need someone to tie our boots, or have to wear helmets in the shower in case we fall down. It seems like you were quick to jump on my comments about how the heck you would effectively fight your c/s if it was a ATV, but wayyy back in the thread YardApe made similiar comments about "who drives and who engages" if you ever come in contact...no one slammed him. Actually, GW said "good points there".
George, you have perhaps forgotten more about Recce than I ever knew, but I never said anything about "having" to have a 3 man crew. It appears that was assumed somewheres, or that I had lost touch with the basics? The only C/S's in PEIR that ever had full crews were the Jnr c/s's for the most part. We always had to make do with what we had, with veh's, kit, you name it. So it seems like it hasn't changed that much from way back when when you were PEIR before. As happens in most Res units, and maybe Reg Frce ones to, we always got on with it with what we had, and for a Res Sqn, we were pretty good at working short handed all the time. Was a fact of life when you were PEIR. Talk to the guys there today and it is even worse now. Nature of the beast.
Folks, all I was doing was thinkin' out loud, stating the obvious and being sarcastic. Alot of assumptions were made about me, what I have/have not done, or know, or whatever. I would think that anyone who thinks they are getting dumped on would have the gonads to come back at that. Those who don't, well, its a tough world out there eh? Better stay home.
So...if someone feels like I am being disrespectful, or preaching to the choir who know more than me...that really was never was the case, or wasn't intentional. Where I come from, if someone shoves you, you shove them back.
SM
Unknown, not trying to disrepect you, your experience or anything like that, but I am not into being shot down for giving an opinion, especially when comments or opinions were asked for. If you didn't see where I was going or the sarcastic "thinking out loud" approach, then you just didn't see it. I, if you read back, never said anything about putting Iltis kit on a AFV. I said "vehicle kit, troop kit, etc etc. No mention of Iltis. Even us Res guys would scale the kit to the veh, mission, etc etc. Not all of us need someone to tie our boots, or have to wear helmets in the shower in case we fall down. It seems like you were quick to jump on my comments about how the heck you would effectively fight your c/s if it was a ATV, but wayyy back in the thread YardApe made similiar comments about "who drives and who engages" if you ever come in contact...no one slammed him. Actually, GW said "good points there".
George, you have perhaps forgotten more about Recce than I ever knew, but I never said anything about "having" to have a 3 man crew. It appears that was assumed somewheres, or that I had lost touch with the basics? The only C/S's in PEIR that ever had full crews were the Jnr c/s's for the most part. We always had to make do with what we had, with veh's, kit, you name it. So it seems like it hasn't changed that much from way back when when you were PEIR before. As happens in most Res units, and maybe Reg Frce ones to, we always got on with it with what we had, and for a Res Sqn, we were pretty good at working short handed all the time. Was a fact of life when you were PEIR. Talk to the guys there today and it is even worse now. Nature of the beast.
Folks, all I was doing was thinkin' out loud, stating the obvious and being sarcastic. Alot of assumptions were made about me, what I have/have not done, or know, or whatever. I would think that anyone who thinks they are getting dumped on would have the gonads to come back at that. Those who don't, well, its a tough world out there eh? Better stay home.
So...if someone feels like I am being disrespectful, or preaching to the choir who know more than me...that really was never was the case, or wasn't intentional. Where I come from, if someone shoves you, you shove them back.
SM
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