DEO Program Questions

[teh_pinoy_boy]

I have a Computer Science Degree from the University of Alberta with 16 months worth of industry experience and I am interested in joining the Regular Forces as a Direct Entry Officer (DEO).  I have been talking to recruiters about the DEO program, browsing these forums, and talking to friends in the Reserves.  I haven't been able to find much information related to the DEO program that can clarify some concerns I have.  Can anyone help clarify these for me?

The wages posted on the DND recruiting website (http://www.recruiting.forces.ca/media/pdf/other/RegularForcePay.pdf) seem much lower than the normal wages a person with my degree would receive (2LT DEO Base IPC = 3255 * 12 = 39060 annual), Alberta Salary surveys from the past 3 years have an average starting salary between $40000-50000 for people with my qualifications; which, even considering the $40000 over 2 years signing bonus, is still higher within 5 years (factoring salary increases both in the Military and in industry)

I'm interested in going into a trade that will have a lot of time spent in the field (I'm trying to decide between engineer, armour, signals, or electrical and mechanical engineering officer), and some of the discussions I've read here have led me to believe that field pay is substantial for long field operations.  I've also got the impression that cost of living in the regular force, especially while on overseas deployments is almost non-existent compared to the normal civilian cost of living.  My belief, then, is that the actual income from joining as an officer is actually about equivalent to what a normal civilian working in industry would receive.  Does anyone have any incite regarding this?

I've read up about the training provided for officers, and I'm curious, how are posting preferences handled?  For example, I would like to be posted with a unit here in Edmonton as my family lives here and I know there's a big military presence in this city.  If I joined up, upon completion of my training, could I request being posted here (if I joined in a trade that has a unit here)?  If so, how good of a chance would I have at actually being posted here?

I've spent my entire childhood in the Cadets and in fiercely regimented private schools.  I am a Canadian citizen with no criminal record.  My interests include martial arts, competitive shooting, orienteering and marathon running.  From my industry experience, I have Top Secret security clearance with CSIS (I did web-development for the Government of Canada on an 8 month coop).  Almost all of my family members are former (or present) serving members of the Filipino Army, and they all encourage me to join the Army here in Canada, so I feel up to the challenge.  That said does anyone have any "unofficial" information about anything I can expect upon joining the regular force as an Officer?

Thank you!

 

[kincanucks]

Money, money its all about the money.   Tell you what find a civilian job in your field that will employ you for 25 years straight.   The CF will pay you a fairly competitive wage and will include 20 paid days (to start) of leave, all medical and dental benefits and will compensate you for overseas deployments.   Please tell me about that job you are going to get on civilian street again.

You basically have no input into where your first posting will be but later on in your career you may have more say.   Yes your odds of being posted to an area thatyou want are better if you pick an occupation that is employable in that area.

Unofficially, stop worrying about how much you are going to be paid and concentrate on what you think you can contribute to the CF and this country.   Good Luck.

 

[George Wallace]

teh_pinoy_boy

I don't want to burst your bubble and ego, but as kincanucks stated, your not looking at it with a full grasp on the financial situation.  First off you can make more money elsewhere.  My Wife is a computer programmer.  She was offered a Consultant Job at $250 an hour.  Sounds great initially, but then she would have to pay her own Pension Plan, her own EI, her own Medical and Dental Plan, her own Insurance, etc., and after al that she may only get an hours work a month.  What kind of guarantees are those?  She to a Civil Service job for much less and has a Federal Service Health and Dental Plan, a Federal Pension Plan, Federal Insurance plan, the Government pays her EI, etc.  Actually, I think she has come out ahead.

Now, on the question of your joining as an officer; well most computer related jobs in the Forces are not officer jobs, and will probably never be.  There will probably be more and more hi-tech jobs coming online in the CF, but most, if not all, will be for NCMs.

Field time, is found mostly in the Cbt Arms and you don't need a degree there, even if many soldiers (not officers) do hold them.  If you want to be in the Field and Deployed, you are not going to be near Family. 

On a whole, you have come to the right place, and with some surfing of this site, use the Search Function if you have questions, you should find out what the CF is all about....Warning: Stay out of the Cadet pages, as they will only add to your confussion.  ;D

 

[GO!!!]

Also, Officers manage those who work with computers. For the most part, they are an administrative rank.

Your comparisons to what you could make in the civilian world are right out to lunch. Junior CF officers make very little (I make significantly more than the officer in charge of me, and I'm a Corporal) at first.

Once they make Captain, then the money gets a little better (55-85k).

Just to further elaborate on what benefits George is talking about in terms of benefits;

each month, I recieve a pension contribution, paid life insurance, 100% disability, spousal benefits (health, dental) EI etc. For me, this amounts to approximately 825$ per month. Add that to the 55K I already make, I have already handsomely eclipsed your entry level IT job - at the second lowest rank in the army!

Additionally, can you imagine any IT company hiring you for the next 25 years - regardless of whether you upgrade your skills, at a continuingly rising rate of pay (officers get a mandatory raise every year for the first 14 years), and then send you out the door with a 50% pension?

Your skills in CS and IT are valuable, but you are far from alone, there are an estimated 49,000 web developers in Canada right now. If you believe you can do better on civvie street, go get it. None of us here joined the army to get rich, hence the statement "serving" your country.

 

[boots]

Speaking as another DEO hopeful with a CS degree... I just want to ask, what is most important to you? Only you can answer that question.

I don't care how much more money I can make in the civilian world, I'm not here for that. I want to serve and do the best job I can for my country. I want to give back and do something useful which helps people and makes Canada and the world a safer, better place. I'm not going to get that developing some enterprise payroll system, making a website for the local bridge club, or writing some pointless game that wastes the time and money of college kids. The CF pays enough. Will your IT job give you adventure, comradeship, a fit and healthy lifestyle, the chance to travel all over the world (for free), the ability to do some good in this world, and so much personal satisfaction?

 

[teh_pinoy_boy]

Thanks for the replies everyone and I apologize for the length of my reply.  I appreciate your incite as it does help clarify a lot for me.  I agree that my industry has really poor job security, and the benefits some of you have described are very attractive.

I also find the prospect of being a code-monkey in a cubicle somewhere quite terrifying.  I've heard from a lot of people before that the skills and responsibilities of officers is more management oriented, and that is what appeals to me.  Also, friends in the Reserves have talked about training they do and it seems very exciting and attractive (getting paid to do a lot of stuff I pay big bucks to do!).

Also, to clarify, I'm actually a very patriotic person.  I do believe and support the military very much.  I'm just trying to make an educated decision about my career and future.

Thanks again!