Do you ever get treated like a human?

[Moosy]

I have been in training almost 2 years now. And I'm curious of some experienced members of the CF could tell me when I can expect to be treated like a human. It seems as though no matter how hard you try and good you do you still get in trouble, while the real trouble makers weasle their way out of things.

I never expected training to take this long but that is another story I just want to stop getting screwed around, do my job, train and go over seas.

 

[dangerboy]

Not knowing your trade or specifics I can only generalize; but once you finish all your training and report to your unit you will find it to be different.  Unfortunately there will always be scammers  but they eventuality get caught.  the only thing you can do is continue to do your best and think of your goal to be a qualified soldier (or sailor or airman). 

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Moosy.

PM inbound.

 

[Moosy]

Thank you, I'm a vehicle tech by the way.

I keeping hoping that posted life will be different, it is a long way a way (hopefully December)

It is just times like right now that it can be hard to stay motivated, just when i am doing all my best (great PT scores, college honour roll, 3.96gpa, and great inspections) that things seem to go wrong. Oh and it's always the weekends I want to go home.

But thank you for lifting my spirits a little.

 

[Run away gun]

Yes posted life is alot different than any school. And your peers who are screwing around at the school will be sorted out sooner or later.

Trouble making might be tolerated at the school you are at now, but I know a few veh techs and have worked with a few as well, and they expect you to be checked out from day one.

Don't worry, once you get to your posting and show you are checked out alot more opportunities will open for you than those who just show up.

 

[Greymatters]

In a lot of ways, basic is like an extension of high school, or at least quite a few candidates act like they are still in high school.  Like previously posted, they get sorted out quickly when the BGDT ('big man during training') gets to the unit and finds out he will get his ass handed to him by older more experienced members who wont put up with their BS.... 

 

[Eye In The Sky]

In a lot of ways, basic is like an extension of high school, or at least quite a few candidates act like they are still in high school.  Like previously posted, they get sorted out quickly when the BGDT ('big man during training') gets to the unit and finds out he will get his *** handed to him by older more experienced members who wont put up with their BS.... 

From the PM I have received from the OP, this is not the case.  But yes it is the case sometimes.

This is not one of them though.  8)

 

[Moosy]

Yes posted life is alot different than any school. And your peers who are screwing around at the school will be sorted out sooner or later.

Trouble making might be tolerated at the school you are at now, but I know a few veh techs and have worked with a few as well, and they expect you to be checked out from day one.

Don't worry, once you get to your posting and show you are checked out alot more opportunities will open for you than those who just show up.

Thank you, I think this is what I needed to hear, I'm sure everyone has had the feelings I am having and wonder what they are doing here.

I really love the army, so I hate feeling negativity towards it, I'm glad I found a place to talk to people that will treat me like a human.

 

[RCDtpr]

Training sucks, simple as that.  Don't know how your course is, but when I was in armoured school, I was the scum underneath the boots of any qualified person in the CF.  We got c.o.c.k.e.d HARD on that course by brutal brutal instructors.  But I think grad day summed up what it's like when you finish.  One of the Mcpls came upto me and said congratulations on passing your course.  I said thank you Mcpl and he repsonded that I have a springbok on my head now, and therefore I was to call him Chris.  I'll never forget that.

So to sum it up, life gets much better when you're done you're course.  The mechs in our bays all joke around with each other, call each other by first names, and all seem to get along..........be it a no hook or a Warrant.  So keep your head up and stay positive.  In the long run you'll look back and think it wasn't THAT bad and was all worth it.

 

[Delta]

It seems as though no matter how hard you try and good you do you still get in trouble, while the real trouble makers weasle their way out of things. 

Personally speaking, it gets frustrating after a while when the entire course is punished because one or two individuals refused to put out. I know that comradeship is important, but while bother bonding the screw-ups to those who try their best? The argument might be that hopefully the screw-ups will raise to the top.

 

[Franko]

Personally speaking, it gets frustrating after a while when the entire course is punished because one or two individuals refused to put out. I know that comradeship is important, but while bother bonding the screw-ups to those who try their best? The argument might be that hopefully the screw-ups will raise to the top.

They usually get the boot if they don't smarten up. We had a few in the same boat on an SQ course I taught on in the summer of 06 and we failed one.

Mind you it took an act of Jeebus to do it.

Regards

 

[armyvern]

I have been in training almost 2 years now. And I'm curious of some experienced members of the CF could tell me when I can expect to be treated like a human. It seems as though no matter how hard you try and good you do you still get in trouble, while the real trouble makers weasle their way out of things.

I never expected training to take this long but that is another story I just want to stop getting screwed around, do my job, train and go over seas.

Oh boy.

I don't know how to explain it. "Look after your buddies - your buddies look after you?" The CF needs you to learn to work like a team, because our success overseas and on missions depends upon that teamwork being second nature. It's quite frustrating while in the training system I know.

Really, are the "real" trouble makers really weaseling out of anything, or is it that you are all getting in trouble for their screw ups?

I know when I went through -- one of the guys in my section got shit on royally for having crappy boots. Three mornings in a row with zero improvement to them. On day three --- the instructor took a glance at his boots again then walked over to my bedspace and tore a strip off me. "You &%$#@# idiot!! You have the best *((^%*) boots in this **^^$P) section -- yet his STILL suck. When the ()*(&^$%# are you going to learn some teamwork and get them ^**$$ done!!??" With that, the instructor walked out with nary a word to the boot's owner.

That night ... guess who was doing the boots? I was. Guess what he was doing? Ironing my damn uniform.

Find something that your "trouble-makers" are good at. Make them do that. Your instructors aren't about to make them do it. They are trying to instill leadership and discipline into you and your fellow trainees. You guys find something that they're good at, and while they do that --- you do the stuff you are good at. At the end of the day, everything is done ... and done well. All because you acted like a team. When you start doing that, and it has become habit --- you'll find that your instructors will begin treating you more like the adults and team that you've become.

If buddy still doesn't want to play the game despite your best attempts at "teamwork" ... then the instructors will kick his ass into gear -- or he'll be gone. They DO notice these things ... it's part of their job.

 

[brihard]

They usually get the boot if they don't smarten up. We had a few in the same boat on an SQ course I taught on in the summer of 06 and we failed one.

Mind you it took an act of Jeebus to do it.

Regards

There's half the problem right there... It's getting bloody hard to fail candidates. I've only taught on one course (reserve BMQ), but most of those I worked with echoed my belief that you had to go through far too many hoops to get someone off course who simply should not be there. I'm not talking dumb mistakes, but serious issues of performance and integrity. They need to ease up on the mechanisms to recourse candidates who just aren't there yet, and maybe need a swift kick as a reality check.

 

[Kat Stevens]

Personally speaking, it gets frustrating after a while when the entire course is punished because one or two individuals refused to put out. I know that comradeship is important, but while bother bonding the screw-ups to those who try their best? The argument might be that hopefully the screw-ups will raise to the top.

The theory behind this is rock solid, if a little antiquated.  If the rest of the course gets tired of paying for the few screwups, they'll take matters into their own hands and sort out the offenders.  As far as I know, collective punishment was done away with years ago.

 

[blacktriangle]

They usually get the boot if they don't smarten up. We had a few in the same boat on an SQ course I taught on in the summer of 06 and we failed one.

Mind you it took an act of Jeebus to do it.

Regards

Having helped out a few BMQ/SQ courses (though not in an official instructor position) I know exactly what you mean, it is extremely hard to fail a candidate at the BMQ/SQ level. I think that should be where the decision is made, do we keep this pers and they smarten up, or do we give them the punt.

On my SQ course two years ago we started with 43 and graduated about 27, most that left VRed or were injured, and only one was actually failed. The number should of been higher as several people slipped through the cracks to go on to such glorius feets as falling asleep at the wheel of a vehicle (yes the co-driver too, from the same course) and having mental breakdowns on a 2 day field ex. To make things even better I was told they COULDN'T fail anyone on the BMQ/SQ this year, and apparently the whole course including several shitpumps passed with like 5 chances at passing a wep handling test etc... and to top it all off some of these individuals think they are going to go overseas and drive a tank with the RCD. Have fun.  :

 

[Franko]

... and to top it all off some of these individuals think they are going to go overseas and drive a tank with the RCD. Have fun.  :

They won't....there are checks and balances in place to stop and get rid of them.

We're rather picky as to who we let crew a 70 ton killing machine.

Regards

 

[aesop081]

There's half the problem right there... It's getting bloody hard to fail candidates.

Sounds like a problem specific to certain training establishments only. CFANS doesnt seem to have that problem. My trade only gradutes 50% of those who arrive for course. Process is simple. You fail a PC, you get a retest. Fail another one and you get to chat with the staff. If you are deemed worthy you get to do a retest. fail one more and you are gone. Thats it. Fail the same sim session twice = gone, fail the same flight twice = gone

 

[brihard]

To be fair, that school is a very different context from a BMQ or an SQ.

Hell, even the leadership courses out of Pet this summer could not fail anyone off the mod 6. There were isntances of troops getting their fourth shot at a recce patrol- recce from the Warrior Support Center to the 1RCR lines. I wish I were making that up.

One or two may have failed the course, of the instructors, staff, and candidates at Leadership Coy this summer, all that I have spoken to have said the same. It is apparently the same on this summer's basic and trades courses. Granted, several of these are reserve courses. that may be part of the equation.

 

[blacktriangle]

They won't....there are checks and balances in place to stop and get rid of them.

We're rather picky as to who we let crew a 70 ton killing machine.

Regards

Good to hear. On the upside you guys got the best troop off our course last I heard, so stuff works out in the end.

Good luck out there.

 

[Franko]

On the upside you guys got the best troop off our course last I heard, so stuff works out in the end.

Time will tell. Some guys do well on courses and fall apart on tour or a long exercise.

Good luck out there.

TANKS!