front hand gard on C-6

[HItorMiss]

There was a guy in 1 RCR Dukes Coy who about 5 yrs ago did indeed fire the C6 from the shoulder in the kneeling, just to prove he could.

he would do on ex with blanks and get jacked for inaccuracy and improper use (rightly so I add) but on a Live MG shoot his WO to prove to him how useless it was allowed him to do in a controlled manner... With balloons as targets (we have all done balloon shoots I am sure) so he did, and he hit...not as much as when used properly mind you but his inital three round burst would have been enough IMO to put the heads down of any enemy he would have had contact with, thus buying him time to get to a good shooting position.

could he have had a sustained fire fight..nope radiant heat as has been pointed out, but that inital burst would work... and I submit to your IA on contact... Double tap, Dash ,Down, Sights, Observe, Communicate, crawl

I think that first burst follows all the above procedures if used correctly, so why don't we look at it that way? And ask why can't we have a handguard for the front of the C6 for just that eventuality.

*Edited for Spelling*

 

[Scott]

Where oh where is KevinB?

 

[geo]

sure.... you can do it BUT
why would you want to?

The C6, unlike the C9, is a belt fed weapon that has no provision for mags. That should tell you something about the designer's intent. Given the weight of the beastie, the C6, trying to control the movement of the barrel from the shoulder (unsupported) makes it entirely unsuitable for that kind of use.

 

[Forgotten_Hero]

not as much as when used properly mind you but his inital three round burst would have been enough IMO to put the heads down of any enemy he would have had contact with, thus buying him time to get to a good shooting position.

Wouldnt the same be accomplished firing from the hip?

 

[bigdog031]

affectivee taking what i have said and turning it! I never said firing burst after burst with a c-6 from the shoulder is aftective at all???it would be stupid!!!! i said it can be fired from the shoulder yes if you are a good sized man,i never once said burst after burst yes the heat would burn you and if you look i said that point that is why a front grip would works the U.S army has prov-in it! so if you are in a built up area witch is the way the three block war is heading,then having a front hand grip to fire off a fast burst well standing or going for cover to get the enemy's head down will you get a good firing postion,is not a thing that is impossible at all to me.Also when a c-6 gunner is on a patrol they do not have a full belt hanging off the gun,they should only have a good teaser belt of maybe 30 or 40 rounds and a full belt ready to go.So people can take it anyway they want but all i was stating is why not have a front hand grip?????

 

[Michael OLeary]

bigdog031, here is the text of your first post:

what is the reason for not putting them on a c-6 in the first place they can be fired from the shoulder if needed and there is no place to hold the thing without burning you hand

You spoke just of "firing from the shoulder" and wanting to avoid "burning your hand" which inferred a general application and to the extent of it having that hazard from the hot barrel.

Perhaps if you took a little time to frame your posts more clearly they wouldn't turn into threads like this.  A little patience and you will also have time to explore sentence structure, grammar and spelling.

The hole you're standing in is one you dug through lack of clarity, a vital characterictic of machine gunning on the internet.

 

[reccecrewman]

Where was you RSO? Smoking crack in the back of the safety vehicle?

;D Franko, that made my day............. It must be a wild west thing because I went looking for a few specific experts on the MG topic who wear the RCR capbadge when I got to work. After the initial chuckle, the response was they would never allow a soldier to attempt firing a C6 from the shoulder - live, for several safety reasons.  On that same note, the 2 Sergeants I spoke to also were adamant that none of their PPCLI counterparts would allow a Private/Corporal give it a go either.......... even on a "fun range".

*sniff sniff sniff............ I smell B.S*  ;D

 

[George Wallace]

*sniff sniff sniff............ I smell B.S*  ;D

Why do I get this feeling that this is going to turn into a "Ya! Ya! Foootball....You Bet!  Me Love Foootball." thing soon?

 

[HItorMiss]

Only answer I can muster to that is, I was there saw it with my own eyes, IN fact there is Mcpl then Cpl who was this individuals #2 who can attest to what I said, but it's now an argument of no you can't...yes you can and thats not what I wanted when I posted...

what I wanted when I posted was to look at the fact that the drills state.. Double Tap (quick burst from the C6 as that is other then your pistol the only weapon you have) Dash (run like stink to your best identifiable firing position) Down ( get into cover of said firing position if it offers one of the 2 possible types of cover) Sights ( relocate target with C6) Observer (self evident make sure target is still there) Communicate ( GRIT for Weapons Det command if he is there) Crawl (ok everyone here knows this is a nice to have but rarely happens)

So going with that, if a handguard were indeed added to the C6 to facilitate the engagement of a target to get it's head down so you can move to your more advantageous firing position to fire the gun, why would that be such a horrid idea?

 

[Michael OLeary]

Anyone that is interested can review the weapon publication, they will find that there is a firing position for close quarter combat that can be employed from a slung carrying position without the awkwardness and inefficiency of trying to raise a belt-fed machine gun to the shoulder.

http://www.army.forces.gc.ca/ael/pubs/300-008/b-gl-385/004/PT-001/B-GL-385-004-PT-001_E.pdf

See Lesson 10, page 98 of 278 (of the pdf file).

 

[geo]

If anyone tried to pull the "look ma no hands" thing .... I'd tear em a 2nd A!@$$
but that's just me...... and I got my trg from the R22R.... so we've covered the 3 Regiments  - and no one has owned up to reckless endangerment.
Good!

 

[HItorMiss]

I believe from looking at the pictures in that pdf it was indeed the position from which the example I mentioned was firing...my mistake and as it stands that also means that firing the C6 from the standing is indeed a viable option and as such a hand guard would facilitate that no? and of course the chances of firing the C6 in the CQB role have increased dramatically in recent years, it sounds to me like something that should be investigated by DLR

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

The question wasn't really whether you good fire it standing but could you fire it in the shoulder standing, or kneeling for that matter.  Safely and accurately.

 

[Gunnerlove]

The way I see it you should be able to fire the Carl G from the hip so they should put some extra handles and triggers on it as well.

Sarcasm level is high, very high

 

[Scoobie Newbie]

Gunnerlove you need to add some of these as well : :

 

[fourninerzero]

The way I see it you should be able to fire the Carl G from the hip so they should put some extra handles and triggers on it as well.

Sarcasm level is high, very high

I'm sure that is just as safe and effective as firing the C6 from the shoulder. Lets give it a try. Hey, and while we are at it, lets fire the 60mm mortar while balanced on the thigh in the standing position too. Its got that curved base plate... it should fit nicely on the meaty part of a troops thigh. :

 

[Thompson_JM]

what next... Slingshoting a Grenade?  :

 

[a_majoor]

what I wanted when I posted was to look at the fact that the drills state.. Double Tap (quick burst from the C6 as that is other then your pistol the only weapon you have) Dash (run like stink to your best identifiable firing position) Down ( get into cover of said firing position if it offers one of the 2 possible types of cover) Sights ( relocate target with C6) Observer (self evident make sure target is still there) Communicate ( GRIT for Weapons Det command if he is there) Crawl (ok everyone here knows this is a nice to have but rarely happens)

So going with that, if a handguard were indeed added to the C6 to facilitate the engagement of a target to get it's head down so you can move to your more advantageous firing position to fire the gun, why would that be such a horrid idea?

The GPMG should never be in such a position that the gun team has to do these things, they are with the 2I/C one or two tactical bounds behind the lead section (the only guys who will be doing double tap and running for cover under contact). Since this is the platoon commander's "big stick" it always needs to be protected on the move, then moved by a covered approach to a firing position. The slung "underhand" firing position may be an option, but not really a viable one for the reasons posted above.

If you want a viable option, plant the gun (securely on the tripod, if you please) in a position you can cover the advancing platoon. On the Pl Comdr or 2I/C's order, one of the sections will take fire positions and cover while your team doubles up and resets the gun. Repeat as necessary.

 

[Gayson]

I'd like to point out the C6 is like 1.4 m long.

It would be a little akward holding it with the bipod at the shoulder even if it only weighed 10lb!

 

[Haggis]

what next... Slingshoting a Grenade?  :

What???  They don't teach that any more???