Frustration and venting.

[Nite]

Bah, I couldn't make the deadline for basic this summer, seems my medical report was never processed (my recruiter was dealing with my medical info, apparently it's illegal for him to do that...?) noone knows where it is, and I may have to get a report for the 4th time from my doctor, then mail it through again. I've been asking my recruiter and file manager if there are other dates to get down to basic (since it goes year-round I hear), but they know nothing, no dates. In fact the more inquisitive I am about getting into Basic (in the reserves or regular), the more flak I recieve!
Forgive me for appearing disrespectful, but the amount of bureaucracy and bullshit that goes on really makes you think how inept the recruiting process is.

I can't get over how flattened I am about the attitudes people show as well. Everyone involved in the process is overly enthusiastic to get you signed in (what, do they get referall bonuses or something?), yet when shit hits the fan it's either anger and contempt or they're extremely impartial and don't care. I've excellent academic marks, I've passed the CFAT with flying colors, I can bench 190lbs, run loops around those silly training requirements, I'm a polite man (most of the time =P), all I've shown is respect and patience, and I'm willing to serve under discipline and fucking die for my country. Aren't I an ideal candidate for the army, perhaps an infantry at least? What's with all the nonsense? Is the Canadian army full of assholes and bureaucratic, nail-filing-nancy's or am I just special? Man, I'm just so angry...

 

[NTFH]

if you got into a tech trade you might end up like me and some of my pals. some waiting up to 14 months or more for course(s) to get there QL3 after basic. I may be lucky enough to get the 7 to 8 months training i need bfore my initial contract is up. why is that? people lost and or ignored my paperwork. seems no one wanted to look out for my best interest when i was recruited.

i was told "i fell through the cracks" and when the people resbonsible for realised my situation they convicned me they were doing everything the could to get me a better course date so i could be trade qualified. well nothing happened. they then tried to distract me with the option of "EWAT" (employment while awaiting training) since i am semi skilled (qualified for 8 months of my 15 or 16 month training time after basic. this was a sham. i'm about ready to get official. i should have went army combat arms or navy......... they get trained.......  
the attittude you see some units is a mark of the "logistics army" or "new army." where people handling important information do what they feel like and are all to often not accountable for their errors. i see examples of it all the time.


my advice is look up who to write to in Ottawa. i'm almost ready to do that. if you can get into the army and QL3 trained you can get to a good unit that still believes in getting the job done. i'm not giving up yet

Check out http://army.ca/forums/threads/16834.0  and you'll see my situation... it's 21 weeks not 20 weeks. that's what training i've had. with no date for CET (which is a 4 week course that must be done before my QL3. because CET is the entry course for the EME Regiment).
April 28th 2003 was my first day at basic. it's June 11th 2004..........

 

[GrahamD]

Bah, I couldn't make the deadline for basic this summer, seems my medical report was never processed (my recruiter was dealing with my medical info, apparently it's illegal for him to do that...?) noone knows where it is, and I may have to get a report for the 4th time from my doctor, then mail it through again. I've been asking my recruiter and file manager if there are other dates to get down to basic (since it goes year-round I hear), but they know nothing, no dates. In fact the more inquisitive I am about getting into Basic (in the reserves or regular), the more flak I recieve!
Forgive me for appearing disrespectful, but the amount of bureaucracy and bullshit that goes on really makes you think how inept the recruiting process is.

I can't get over how flattened I am about the attitudes people show as well. Everyone involved in the process is overly enthusiastic to get you signed in (what, do they get referall bonuses or something?), yet when crap hits the fan it's either anger and contempt or they're extremely impartial and don't care. I've excellent academic marks, I've passed the CFAT with flying colors, I can bench 190lbs, run loops around those silly training requirements, I'm a polite man (most of the time =P), all I've shown is respect and patience, and I'm willing to serve under discipline and ******* die for my country. Aren't I an ideal candidate for the army, perhaps an infantry at least? What's with all the nonsense? Is the Canadian army full of assholes and bureaucratic, nail-filing-nancy's or am I just special? Man, I'm just so angry...

I dont know that it will help you feel any better, but I can tell you that youre not alone in your frusteration with the recruiting process.   It seems there is a few of us lurking around this message board looking for answers to the recruiting question ( How can this possibly take so long...)
For me the latest snag was waiting 3 months for my med file to be reviewed, only to find out they never sent it. All because someone forgot to tell the medical department that I had completed my interview.
Its more than a little frusterating that I encountered the same attitude as you

it's either anger and contempt or they're extremely impartial and don't care

, when really its my life thats getting put on hold for 3 months and I could use a little courtesy and 3 minutes of a recruiters time to find out what the problem is. Especially because the problem is someone at the CFRC not doing their job.

Im not angry about the induvidual not remembering to inform the medical department, people make mistakes, people forget, etc, the problem is that the system they have in place allows for these oversights to happen.   How is it that my recruiting file can just go to sleep for 3 months and no one even notices.   If it wasnèt for this website, I might have let it go on for 6 months, would anyone have noticed that moldy old file sitting in the cabinet by then...   Not likely I guess since everyone outside the medical department was telling me my file WAS sent to Borden (Im still having a little trouble getting my head around that one).

The thing is, you pretty much just have to cope with whatever problems and delays come up.   Thereès really no sense in getting upset about it, its not personal and its probably not going to change any time soon.

PS. Does anyone know how to change the keyboard settings so that the punctuation doesnt show up like this: èèèèèèèèèèèèèè

 

[Tracker]

If you are not happy with the way things are going, complain.  There are several options available for you to redress your problems.  If you believe that someone at the CFRC has made a mistake, tell someone, ask to speak with their supervisor, whatever it takes.  If you don't want to confront the person you think made the mistake, call the CFRC and ask to speak with the Unit Sgt Major, or the head of the processing department.  Be willing to use names, there is nothing worse than having someone complain but not want do get anyone in trouble.  That would make me question the legitimacy of your complaint, by using names, they can go to the person and investigate the complaint officially.  If this doesn't work, call your Member of Parliament and ask them to look into the issue. 

For those of you serving, you can launch a redress of grievance or try the Ombudsman.  Ask your chain of command how to go about it.

 

[Tpr.Orange]

i waited 13 months to have my application processed fully before i was finally sent on basic...believe me once you finally go throught the entire process, its well worth it

 

[Bobby147]

I applied for Canadian Forces DEO in January, 2004. I have passed the tests, but recently I called there and came to know that they do not have my Security Clearance form. I filled that form and submitted it in January, 2004. Now those six month, in which I was waiting patiently is lost. Security Clearance takes most of the time in this process. Loosing those six months without any of my fault is making me sick. I do not know what to do.

To whom I should contact and write ??? 

 

[BDTyre]

The problem I think lies in the structure and is likely a direct result of Canadian Law.  Recruiters can't handle medical information because they're not allowed; legally only your med officer and family doctor can be privy to that information.  Likewise, the med section can't answer any question not relating to medical stuff; its not their jurisdiction.  This is only compounded by the fact that both the recruiter and the med officer are responsible for making sure their part of the file gets entered correctly, yet it is up to the processing clerks to ensure everything gets sent off on time.

You know what they say, too many cooks....

This explains why I got 4 different answers from 4 different people as to how to re-open my file (2 were completely wrong, 2 partially right).  It also explains how it took 2 1/2 weeks to be told I actually had  to do something to re-open my file and two weeks after dropping off a new application to be informed I needed to book an interview and PT.

But, my update interview and fitness test are booked, so I'm headed in the right direction.

BTW Nite, my application was dropped off on 5 June 2003.

 

[belkin81]

Tracker is correct, complain and use names, don't be intimidated by anyone/rank. Your a Civiy and its their job is to recruit and do it right. Its funny in the military more then anywhere else there is less accountability for mistakes.

Its your life and time which they seem not to understand nor care about. When people make the decision to join the military they want to do it then or at least be given a timeline. How many recruits are told that its going to take a year to hear back? Very little if any.
IF you have any questions at all, ask them to the recruiters cause they will not volunteer the information.

 

[BDTyre]

When I applied at the Seaforths, I was told it regularily takes 6 - 8 months, and it could be even longer.  They didn't BS anyone there that it could take a long time, sometimes very long.

 

[Tracker]

There are a lot of things to consider when you put in an application.  The perfect Regular applicant will take l 6-8 weeks to fully process, thats from application to job offer.  Perfect applicants are few and far between.  What if you don't make the minimum standard on the CFAT?  That adds 3 month untill you can write it again.  What if you don't pass the physical fitness test?  Wait a month and try it again.  Once you are successful this far, your CRNC is sent, usually takes a week unless there is a hit, then maybe 3 weeks untill we get a result.  The CRNC is done by another Federal agency so it is out of the CFRC's hands.  If there is a hit on the CRNC, you have to printed and the prints have to be sent back and a further check is done on you.  If the clerck doesn't take your prints right they come back and you do it all over again.  If you have had legal problems you may have to wait years before you are eligable to join the CF.  If the CRNC comes back clean, you go for Medical exam and interview.  There are a whole host of common medical problems that can slow you down.  You may also find from the interview that you are not suitable or competitive and youmight be given a time frame that you must wait untill you can reapply.  The important thing for you to do before you apply is to anticipate any problems that you might encounter and prepare for them.  Once you apply, get the recruiters card so you can occasionally call him/her to check on the status of your file, don't call everyday or youo will likely be ignored, once every couple of weeks is good.  Be patient, people make mistakes.

 

[jutes85]

I only hope that if the Conservatives get elected, more applicants will get accepted rather then rejected or put in a waiting pool.

I know how you feel Nite, I've been waiting for the call since July 2003, and I don't know how much longer I'm going to wait. Other then bombing the recruiting center out of frustration, I'm all out of options. If my country doesn't care about me, why should I care about my country.

 

[Nite]

Thanks for your replies. My sympathies to all of you who are going through the same frustration as I am. I'll continue calling and try to sort this thing out, I suppose it's pretty much all I can do right now.

Does anyone here have the dates for summer BMQ (regular forces), and the dates for BMQ after that?

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

jutes said:
If my country doesn't care about me, why should I care about my country.
I think thats one of most petulant statements I have seen for awhile! If you want to be in the CF you will learn rather quickly its not me me me its not an individual effort and its a team effort.

 

[Noyon]

Sounds to me like you'll be doing your basic in the winter. Be prepared for lots of fun, I mean whats not to love about being damp and cold 24/7?   :

 

[jutes85]

jutes said:
If my country doesn't care about me, why should I care about my country.
I think thats one of most petulant statements I have seen for awhile! If you want to be in the CF you will learn rather quickly its not me me me its not an individual effort and its a team effort.

I know and realize that the Military is about team work, thats given. But I'm not in the military yet, so it is about me, me, me, me. Until I get sworn in, I'm an individual who has the right to get pissed-off at anyone in the Military rank that is neglecting my application.

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

You are in for a rough time dude if you don't lose the atitude. I wish you and your future platoon mates luck, you will need it.

 

[jutes85]

What attitude? I'm pissed off that I've been waiting for over a year for the Military to decide my fate.

 

[drebk]

Passive patience doesn't move paper, I'm not saying that's what some people here have done, but I took the position (my first time round in the recruiting process) that They would handle everything and they would appreciate my not getting involved, well, my second time around i knew better, I called someone, about once every week, demanding information on my file, show interest, but be polite, eventually (i think it happened to me) they will get tired of hearing your voice asking the same question over and over again (Hi, I'm <First name> <Last Name> I was wondering if i could get the status on my file please."
WIth my second time around, the hold up (1.5mos) was that there was a problem with "the program" caused by my alreading having an application that was closed. My recruiter showed shock and amazement that I had re-applied, stating that its pretty rare they see people come back and re-apply... the process is definetly lengthy, full of burearcratic red tape, heh, every time i went into the recruiting office it seemed as if he was telling the mother of some unfortunate teenaged boy/girl that their son/daughter would probably not make it on basic.

it really is too bad... its almost as if Canada wants to weed out and discourage those hopefuls and patriotic citizens willing to defend Canada's interests by making the recruiting process so annoying.
Perhaps we should look to the South for a few pointers on how to recruit hopefuls into the DND, they don't seem to have a shortage... but... we also don't have the funds to pump out brainwashing pro-military propaganda that our friends to the south have... *hears the sound of drills screwing into the walls* *nervously looks over his shoulders* *I think i've said to much about the Yankee war machine* *flee's the country*

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Try waiting 2 1/2 years sunshine then get back to me.

 

[drebk]

good greif. who did you marry? the child of some foreign diplomat of a country that canada has deemed unfriendly or something? gooood golly.