daftandbarmy
Army.ca Dinosaur
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Interestingly, our (MH) weak point is not really pilots, as much as it is TACCOs and SENSOs. Those occupations are really stressed and it entirely limits what we can do operationally. But, that issue does not get any heat and light upstairs- because, Pilots.We were able to cut that list down in our community, leaving only a handful of staff jobs, directly related to fighter operations, to be filled. We are beyond the critical level however (somewhere around 50-60% PML. It may have gotten better since last year because of COVID).
Do you think this could be helped if the MH community was formally brought back into the RCN to be the RCN Air Arm again ?Interestingly, our (MH) weak point is not really pilots, as much as it is TACCOs and SENSOs. Those occupations are really stressed and it entirely limits what we can do operationally. But, that issue does not get any heat and light upstairs- because, Pilots.
...so they go from the red-headed stepchildren of the RCAF (although Tac Hel probably has a good argument there too) to being the red-headed stepchildren of the RCN?Do you think this could be helped if the MH community was formally brought back into the RCN to be the RCN Air Arm again ?
I like the simplicity of having the Army/Navy own their own tactical aviation resources, so they can also own solutions/problems.Do you think this could be helped if the MH community was formally brought back into the RCN to be the RCN Air Arm again ?
The ships revolve around helos when they are embarked and I know your capability is huge and respected in my world. Perhaps you guys would be better represented truly as the RCN Air Arm.
So...pre-1968 for "history and heritage" then?clean sheet redesign of the CAF.
Fair enough. I can see the advantages of having you guys back in the family but I defer your SMEnessI like the simplicity of having the Army/Navy own their own tactical aviation resources, so they can also own solutions/problems.
Unfortunately, I have watched in horror at how the RCN has mis-managed MARTECHs (to be fair, the Air Force did the samething with the 500 series amalgamation, until they quietly unwound it 5 years later) and NWOs, so I can only imagine how much of a mess they would make of Aviation trades that also have airworthiness implications.
We are probably past the point of returning to the RCN fold (for better or worse), baring some clean sheet redesign of the CAF.
There’s the romantic image of the Navy or Army caring about their own aviation branch...then there’s the reality (at least based in past behaviour. Navy may have been a bit better from the sounds of it, but the Army (actually FMC - Force Mobile Command in the day) was terribly tribal and threw heavy lift aviation to the wolves back in the late-80s/early-90s and scout/recce aviation shortly thereafter, all while FMC(and later LFC) had funding responsibility for TH.Fair enough. I can see the advantages of having you guys back in the family but I defer your SMEness
My understanding of the Loach and Chinook issue was that the Army was seeking to replace its roughly forty aircraft UH fleet and the government pushed the buy upwards to 100 thereby replacing all the tac helicopters with one all singing all dancing airframe that became the Griffon. That was more an imposed cost saving then a desired one.There’s the romantic image of the Navy or Army caring about their own aviation branch...then there’s the reality (at least based in past behaviour. Navy may have been a bit better from the sounds of it, but the Army (actually FMC - Force Mobile Command in the day) was terribly tribal and threw heavy lift aviation to the wolves back in the late-80s/early-90s and scout/recce aviation shortly thereafter, all while FMC(and later LFC) had funding responsibility for TH.
I simply wouldn’t trust the Army not to do it again...
You saw his latest, too, then.fly with the Cobra Chickens!
If 408 Sqn doesn't capitalize on that, then all hope is lost.You saw his latest, too, then.
Interestingly, our (MH) weak point is not really pilots, as much as it is TACCOs and SENSOs. Those occupations are really stressed and it entirely limits what we can do operationally. But, that issue does not get any heat and light upstairs- because, Pilots.
I don't think I'm remotely alone in asking why techs wouldn't want to be a FE?? It seems like a pretty sweet gig, from an outsiders perspective?FEs are traditionally a problem in Tac Hel. They get broken a lot, and fewer Techs want the job as it's no longer a stepping-stone to the transport world as neither CC130Js nor C17s have FEs.
True. Fixed-wing FE spots are really only the Aurora, Twin Otter, Buff, and Kingfisher now.FEs are traditionally a problem in Tac Hel. They get broken a lot, and fewer Techs want the job as it's no longer a stepping-stone to the transport world as neither CC130Js nor C17s have FEs.
I don't think I'm remotely alone in asking why techs wouldn't want to be a FE?? It seems like a pretty sweet gig, from an outsiders perspective?
Also, how/why do they break a lot? Is it burnout, no longer a stepping stone, high deployment rate, etc etc?
Ooooffff....An applicant has to be a qualified Tech with a certain minimum level of experience. Starting rank for an FE is Cpl, which generally involves a reversion in rank. Pay is vested, however, and supplemented by Spec Pay plus Aircrew Allowance but it could involve a change in Mess plus a loss of prestige. Warrant Officer and Sergeant positions in Tac Hel Squadrons are very limited. The transport community would only accept Sergeant FEs, so they always bled ours away, but now the ability to return to a previously-held rank or move to a more hotel-oriented world is severely reduced.
From the Griffon perspective (I cannot discuss the Chinook sit as I have no experience therein, nor was I even remotely interested) FEs do the bulk of walkarounds while the front-seaters plan missions, so they're outside more often regardless of weather. They only have the same crappy rag-and-tube seats that grunts get. Those are not designed for long-term occupancy, and are literally a pain to sit in, nor do they give the same level of crash protection as the two front seats give. FEs tend to sit hunched forward as a result of the perfectly-vertical seat backs but have to keep their heads up while wearing a helmet and vibrating. The FEs move around the cabin fairly frequently, but have to remain hunched over or crawl about on their knees while the aircraft vibrates and occasionally lurches. They have to open the cabin doors during take-offs and landings and certain other manoeuvres and lean out regardless of weather to clear the aircraft, and occasionally have to lay flat on the floor with their heads out to clear underneath the machine. For hooking up slung loads (absent a TAMS team for real vice training loads), they have to slither underneath the machine on their backs regardless of rain, snow, mud, stones etcetera. This is all aggravated while wearing NVG with the extra weight well out in front while vibrating, and they have to be extra-careful to ensure that they don't bang the goggles on something and damage them or knock them off.
They also have to maintain their Tech quals.
The CFLH (Canadian Forces Light Helicopter) programme to replace the Kiowa was cancelled by the Mulroney government, quoting "Peace Dividend" as an excuse, in 1988 along with all of the White Paper kit promises even though it was not actually one of them. Strangely enough, it lasted a day longer than all of the others and we where hoping that they forgot about it and wouldn't notice.My understanding of the Loach and Chinook issue was that the Army was seeking to replace its roughly forty aircraft UH fleet and the government pushed the buy upwards to 100 thereby replacing all the tac helicopters with one all singing all dancing airframe that became the Griffon. That was more an imposed cost saving then a desired one.
That said, considering what the Army has done to the artillery over the last two decades I can't help but agree with you.