Islamic Terrorism in the West ( Mega thread)

[Kirkhill]

Why not just get rid of religious schooling across the board ? Private and public.

Also I was in the Ont Catholic school system my whole academic life.

You would have to ask the Catholic church about that.

A Historical Overview of Education in Canada – Sociology of Education in Canada

<p>Sociology of Education in Canada utilizes a contemporary theoretical focus to analyze how education in Canada is affected by pre-existing and persistent inequalities among members of society. It presents the historical and cultural factors that have shaped our current education system...

ecampusontario.pressbooks.pub

Public schooling has been a feature of the British system in various forms since 1560 when universal literacy was required in Knox's Scotland so every man, woman and child could read the Bible for themselves and draw their own conclusions.

The Roman church was adamant that priests would tell you everything you needed to know.

By the 1840s, in Canada the debate, led by Egerton Ryerson was over how much education should be paid for out of the common purse. Concurrently Britain was allowing Catholics to hold public office, worship in their own churches and operate their own schools. The Roman church was allowed to re-establish its own bishopric in zBritain and many Brits converted. In the same spirit of liberalism the Government extended the same privileges to dissenting protestants like Presbyterians, Methodists, Quakers and even Unitarians (people that accepted Christ but rejected the three in one formulation).

The Catholic Church has had a consistent history of not just providing their own schools but of denying public schooling to its flock.

In Quebec the Church became the principal provider of education to the majority French population. The minority English speaking population held on to their local "public" schools, libraries and universities. All of which were open to all faiths.

It took until Vatican 2 and the Quiet Revolution before the dynamic changed. But by that time things had become further muddied by the settlement of the Prairies where people were recruited in groups from point sources and established in their own colonies where they lived with their own churches and schools and languages. The modern Hutterite colonies are a relic of that era. Add in a few hundred communities of indigenous people with their own languages, "churches" and education systems and you have the current stramash.

 

[Halifax Tar]

You would have to ask the Catholic church about that.

A Historical Overview of Education in Canada – Sociology of Education in Canada

<p>Sociology of Education in Canada utilizes a contemporary theoretical focus to analyze how education in Canada is affected by pre-existing and persistent inequalities among members of society. It presents the historical and cultural factors that have shaped our current education system...

ecampusontario.pressbooks.pub

Public schooling has been a feature of the British system in various forms since 1560 when universal literacy was required in Knox's Scotland so every man, woman and child could read the Bible for themselves and draw their own conclusions.

The Roman church was adamant that priests would tell you everything you needed to know.

By the 1840s, in Canada the debate, led by Egerton Ryerson was over how much education should be paid for out of the common purse. Concurrently Britain was allowing Catholics to hold public office, worship in their own churches and operate their own schools. The Roman church was allowed to re-establish its own bishopric in zBritain and many Brits converted. In the same spirit of liberalism the Government extended the same privileges to dissenting protestants like Presbyterians, Methodists, Quakers and even Unitarians (people that accepted Christ but rejected the three in one formulation).

The Catholic Church has had a consistent history of not just providing their own schools but of denying public schooling to its flock.

In Quebec the Church became the principal provider of education to the majority French population. The minority English speaking population held on to their local "public" schools, libraries and universities. All of which were open to all faiths.

It took until Vatican 2 and the Quiet Revolution before the dynamic changed. But by that time things had become further muddied by the settlement of the Prairies where people were recruited in groups from point sources and established in their own colonies where they lived with their own churches and schools and languages. The modern Hutterite colonies are a relic of that era. Add in a few hundred communities of indigenous people with their own languages, "churches" and education systems and you have the current stramash.

NS managed to remove religion from is public school system. Expand it to private schooling as well.

 

[Kirkhill]

NS managed to remove religion from is public school system. Expand it to private schooling as well.

Toleration of religious belief is the very foundation of liberalism.
That is why we punish deeds and not thoughts.
Words are problematic.
Uttering words is a deed.
But words express thoughts.

And so we hire judges.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Toleration of religious belief is the very foundation of liberalism.
That is why we punish deeds and not thoughts.
Words are problematic.
Uttering words is a deed.
But words express thoughts.

And so we hire judges.

 

[Kirkhill]

Yup.

Churchill, as usual, was right. The worst system except for the all the others.

....

Our current problem, I think, is that we do not have a shared sense of what the end state is supposed to look like. We used to. We have lost it.....

No. That is wrong. It has been actively stripped from us.

 

[Halifax Tar]

We can tolerate religion without teaching it in schools.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Religion is radicalizing, but so is public welfare. Threaten someone's "free" goodies and see what happens politically. The biggest divide is between people quietly getting on with their lives and paying (reluctantly) their taxes for broadly shared benefits like policing and health care, and people demanding entitlements at the same time as they tear down the means of providing those entitlements. What is happening (exhibited pretty much nightly on broadcast news) suggests too much of the pie is being redirected away from the former to the latter. The radicalization is less individually intense, but across the population much greater.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Religion is radicalizing, but so is public welfare. Threaten someone's "free" goodies and see what happens politically. The biggest divide is between people quietly getting on with their lives and paying (reluctantly) their taxes for broadly shared benefits like policing and health care, and people demanding entitlements at the same time as they tear down the means of providing those entitlements. What is happening (exhibited pretty much nightly on broadcast news) suggests too much of the pie is being redirected away from the former to the latter. The radicalization is less individually intense, but across the population much greater.

Astute.

 

[Kirkhill]

We can tolerate religion without teaching it in schools.

But religion is about values. Standing or kneeling. Mecca or Rome. One or three. Those are artifacts.

And secularism, atheism, agnosticism, as value systems, like socialism, communism and fascism as well, are all religions. Articles of faith for believers.

 

[Kirkhill]

If schools could teach one thing I would ask that they teach that it is alright to be wrong.

There are truths. There are absolutes. But the challenge is finding them.

 

[RangerRay]

Also have to come back to the bigger (harder to easily solve) question of "how do you let people who may feel fucked over by society feel less fucked over so they don't look for unhealthy/illegal ways to 'feel heard/seen' like this?" And that goes for ANY radicalization

Yep. Young men with no economic and/or romantic prospects are highly susceptible to radicalization by any extremist ideology. It depends on who they decide to believe is responsible for their plight.

There are a lot of reasons to be concerned about the plight of young men in our society. Radicalization is just one of them.

 

[Halifax Tar]

But religion is about values. Standing or kneeling. Mecca or Rome. One or three. Those are artifacts.

And secularism, atheism, agnosticism, as value systems, like socialism, communism and fascism as well, are all religions. Articles of faith for believers.

You don't require religion to educate people on keeping their hands to themselves and how not to be a dick.

 

[OldSolduer]

You don't require religion to educate people on keeping their hands to themselves and how not to be a dick.

You’re absolutely right.

But since time immemorial man has always worshiped a deity or deities of some sort. And that will continue

 

[Halifax Tar]

You’re absolutely right.

But since time immemorial man has always worshiped a deity or deities of some sort. And that will continue

You're correct and I am not debating that at all.

My point is we don't need religious based education. But I also think we should get rid of private schools completely.

 

[Kirkhill]

Yep. Young men with no economic and/or romantic prospects are highly susceptible to radicalization by any extremist ideology. It depends on who they decide to believe is responsible for their plight.

There are a lot of reasons to be concerned about the plight of young men in our society. Radicalization is just one of them.

Young men will take any opportunity to act aggressively. A cause just soothes the conscience.

Obviously our cause is just. The other isn't.

 

[Kirkhill]

You don't require religion to educate people on keeping their hands to themselves and how not to be a dick.

That's a value. One I happen to agree with but still, it's a value.

 

[The Bread Guy]

NS managed to remove religion from is public school system. Expand it to private schooling as well.

Curious - how much push back was there from Big Catholic on that? I can only imagine the full court press if they tried doing that in Ontario - and if neither Blue nor Red governments did it, there's a reason.

 

[Halifax Tar]

That's a value. One I happen to agree with but still, it's a value.

I am not sure what you point is with all of this.

Curious - how much push back was there from Big Catholic on that? I can only imagine the full court press if they tried doing that in Ontario - and if neither Blue nor Red governments did it, there's a reason.

NS got rid of their public Catholic system in '70s.

 

[Kirkhill]

Curious - how much push back was there from Big Catholic on that? I can only imagine the full court press if they tried doing that in Ontario - and if neither Blue nor Red governments did it, there's a reason.

As in moost provinces it seems that religion has been removed from public schools. There are at least a couple of Catholic high schools in Nova Scotia and Francis Xavier University is Catholic.

In Alberta here the public schools are secular but we have publicly funded schools associated with various churches, including the Catholic chuech, that all teach the provincial curriculum.

 

[Halifax Tar]

As in moost provinces it seems that religion has been removed from public schools. There are at least a couple of Catholic high schools in Nova Scotia and Francis Xavier University is Catholic.

Any Catholic (any religion for that matter) schools in NS are private schools. And STFX is Catholic in name only. There is no compulsory Catholic education portion of their provided services.