Justin Trudeau hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[Grimey]

The RCN (Ships anyways) do the SME thing very well.

As a CPO2 I am I/C of Section Base 2, a tactical damage control organization responsible for keeping the ship floating, moving and fighting. I'm also a Logistician so my specialty is not DC. So the RCN gave me 2 MARTECH PO2s.

I have no qualms about gathering them for advice when dealing with a scenario and 99% of the time I am going to listen to them and push that out.

I am not attack team leader qualified. So if I had to go into an attack team there is a near certainty a S1 or MS would be in charge of me. Again, I have no qualms with that. He knows what he's doing and I want to get the fire out and get out alive.

I recently sent a LCdr out as nozzleman for a fire ex and he was directed by a MS as the Attack Team Leader.

There’s long MSE Division precedence for this and similar situations.

During my time on 280s (1996-2011) we usually had one LT(N) AHOD and two SLT Phase 6 MSEO trainees. For the most part, the subbies were fresh out of HMS Sultan’s applications phase and were new to ships. Rank aside, they went through the same qualification process as a brand new S3. That is, starting out as outside roundsman until deemed qualified, then progressing to the AMR then MMR before finally getting time on the console. At all times, they were taking advice and direction from their subordinates and were the better for it. Side ( and most important) benefit….they developed an appreciation for the tasks and working conditions that they expected their departments to face and overcome as HODs.

I assume (and hope) that this is still the case.

 

[dimsum]

There’s long MSE Division precedence for this and similar situations.

During my time on 280s (1996-2011) we usually had one LT(N) AHOD and two SLT Phase 6 MSEO trainees. For the most part, the subbies were fresh out of HMS Sultan’s applications phase and were new to ships. Rank aside, they went through the same qualification process as a brand new S3. That is, starting out as outside roundsman until deemed qualified, then progressing to the AMR then MMR before finally getting time on the console. At all times, they were taking advice and direction from their subordinates and were the better for it. Side ( and most important) benefit….they developed an appreciation for the tasks and working conditions that they expected their departments to face and overcome as HODs.

I assume (and hope) that this is still the case.

HMS Sultan?

 

[Grimey]

HMS Sultan?

HMS Sultan (shore establishment) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Basically, the RN equivalent to engineering training establishments for the marine engineering branch in Halifax and Esquimalt but much more lavishly equipped. RCN engineers have (or were) attended for decades.

 

[markppcli]

One might think that language should be part of the University curriculum to ensure that they aren’t pulled after graduation.

I’m honestly a bit perplexed by this - French training usually takes place much later in careers.

 

[dapaterson]

I’m honestly a bit perplexed by this - French training usually takes place much later in careers.

Second language is one of the pillars of the military college education.

Civilian university, not so much.

 

[KevinB]

I’m honestly a bit perplexed by this - French training usually takes place much later in careers.

Much easier to pay a 2LT for SLT than a Captain.

 

[markppcli]

Much easier to pay a 2LT for SLT than a Captain.

True story. Usually though we only throw people on it when they’ve displayed potential to move forward in their careers mich later on - ie LT Col to Col or WO to MWO. Higher wages but fewer students.

Re the Captain vs LT pay - if we really wanted to address our wage bill I think changing the promotion system to start the Captain countdown from OFP vs date of commission would be the biggest bang for our buck.

 

[dimsum]

Much easier to pay a 2LT for SLT than a Captain.

True, but if they don’t use it afterwards aside from the 5-yearly exams, then it’s all for show.

 

[Good2Golf]

I am not attack team leader qualified. So if I had to go into an attack team there is a near certainty a S1 or MS would be in charge of me. Again, I have no qualms with that. He knows what he's doing and I want to get the fire out and get out alive.

I recently sent a LCdr out as nozzleman for a fire ex and he was directed by a MS as the Attack Team Leader.

Which is something that many of us don’t have an issue with. Heck, at one point in my past, as a senior officer I took and followed operational direction from a dude that I think (although couldn’t/didn’t feel the need to confirm) was a Cpl. Didn’t matter what his rank was, he was the designated MFWIC.

 

[FJAG]

The career path and jobs are the same. I don’t know that I blame four years of university, since less that fifty percent seem to come from RMC.

The others come from civvy universities. I prefer to think that young impressionable officers from the age of 17-21 should be learning their craft in regiments. Send the bright ones destined for higher things to university or some such later.

I do think they get moved out of the regiment and thrown on IG to quickly, but it’s really outside of my lane.

I agree. IGs need a solid foundation of having experienced quality leadership time on the gun line and several years as a FOO to get in touch with their supported arms - I think both the Combat Team Commanders course and the Army Command and Staff course have been reduced considerably since my day, but both those were, if not prerequisites, then highly useful in preparing for the IG course and the various jobs that follow that.

 

[childs56]

I remember the day I had some American soldiers on my gun platform. When their Colonel came up and stood to attention and asked me for permission to enter my gun platform. They were blown away.
After their CO left they asked me what rank I was. I responded Master Bombarider and was not an Officer. As their CO never asked for permission.
I explained it was my gun platform and my responsibility, any one entering has to ask for permission before doing so. They were blown away. Then all apologized they did not ask to enter. I laughed and said it's because we invited you. Then they all laughed.
One time I had to ask, then tell a LT Col to leave my gun platform as he was distracting to my Gunners during a Fire Mission. I got my ass chewed over that one. But said he wouldn't shut up and was distracting my Gunners setting fuzes. I had an apology later by the Lt Col and Gun line TSM.
There are times in the Army where a Lower rank has command over higher ranks. A gun platform is one of them.

 

[PrairieFella]

I remember the day I had some American soldiers on my gun platform. When their Colonel came up and stood to attention and asked me for permission to enter my gun platform. They were blown away.
After their CO left they asked me what rank I was. I responded Master Bombarider and was not an Officer. As their CO never asked for permission.
I explained it was my gun platform and my responsibility, any one entering has to ask for permission before doing so. They were blown away. Then all apologized they did not ask to enter. I laughed and said it's because we invited you. Then they all laughed.
One time I had to ask, then tell a LT Col to leave my gun platform as he was distracting to my Gunners during a Fire Mission. I got my ass chewed over that one. But said he wouldn't shut up and was distracting my Gunners setting fuzes. I had an apology later by the Lt Col and Gun line TSM.
There are times in the Army where a Lower rank has command over higher ranks. A gun platform is one of them.

Convoy escorts being another. Convoy commander is God, even if escorting VIPs.