Liberal Minority Government 2025 - ???

[Altair]

1. Trade deals don't equal guaranteed economic benefit.

Signing agreements with Indonesia or pursuing one with the Philippines is just the first step. Implementation is slow, and many of the promised tariff reductions or investment flows won’t materialize immediately. Simply having a deal on paper doesn’t automatically boost jobs or GDP.

With Indonesia, Canada’s exports are still relatively small, and non tariff barriers remain significant. So the “deal” may create symbolic value more than real economic impact in the short term.

Well, I don't expect Carney to grab shipping containers, man a cargo ship and physically deliver exports himself, so setting the conditions for success is kinda what I expect from a PM. PP? I would expect him to be going after universities for wrong think instead of globetrotting to reduce our dependency on the USA.

2. European defense procurement program participation.

Being part of a program doesn’t necessarily mean Canada’s defense industry will win major contracts. Often, smaller participants gain minimal access compared to larger players. Participation is a starting point, not an economic windfall. It's a nothing burger with no name ketchup.

We already have a trade deal with Europe, so we cannot trade deal harder with Europe. The big juicy burger was already done between Harper and Trudeau, so if you want to say Justin Trudeau is a rockstar for signing CETA, who am I to stop you?

I just thought Carney getting us access to the EU defense procurement market, something even the UK is frozen out of would be a good thing, but sure, lets heep praise on Trudeau.

3. UK exports surge.

Yes, Canadian exports to the UK have grown, but the UK still runs a trade surplus with Canada. Tariff reductions under agreements like the UK TCA help, but they don’t automatically translate into a balanced or hugely positive trade outcome. Market competition and regulatory hurdles still limit gains.
Nothing burger with mayonnaise.

Trade deficits? Okay, fun question. Canada has no bauxite mines. Key component in aluminium production, of which we are a large producer. We import bauxite from Brazil. So let's say we run a trade deficits with Brazil because of all the bauxite we import. Is this bad? Should we cut back on bauxite imports to shrink the trade deficit with Brazil?

In practice, we import bauxite and turn it to more valuable aluminium, which is a net benifit to Canada. This is why I frankly....don't give a damn about trade surpluses and trade deficits. We have a trade surplus with the USA, are you going to stand here and say oh my god, look how much better and wealthy Canada is compared to the USA? Get real.

4. Avoiding a recession doesn't mean economic management.

Canada has dodged a recession largely because of global commodity demand and interest rate cycles, not solely because of trade deals or policy brilliance. External factors often have a bigger impact than government interventions.

Yet if we were in a recession you and those who don't like the LPC or Carney would never shut up about it.

Not in recession- global factors, interest rates, yada yada yada

In recession- ahhhhhhhh, Carney is destroying the Canadian economy!!!!

BLAB.
Carney’s trade diplomacy is notable on paper, but the real economic payoff is uncertain, slow to materialize, and highly dependent on Canadian companies ability to capitalize on opportunities. It’s not as clear cut “all good”.

Could be much worse.

 

[YZT580]

First it'd be necessary to deny that there are some services that may not be withdrawn. Absent that, it's just a negotiation over how much "work to rule" can be stretched to apply pressure.

I have no problem with occupations that fit this description: "If you start this work, you will never be allowed to suspend it, unless you quit entirely."

Definitely time to re-define the term essential service. Ontario has been blackmailed by their teachers' unions for decades now and the end result has not been pretty. Not only Alberta but BC and others are suffering from the same illness. I believe it was Carnegie that advocated for control of teachers and curriculum 100 years or more ago. Whilst the not-withstanding clause seems a little drastic, I don't think it is unjustified. Certainly the entire education problem deserves closer attention and is far more important than having a bunch of trucks parked in front of Parliament Hill.
What is the solution without using it?

 

[YZT580]

Sure.

Carney has a trade deal with Indonesia, working on another trade deal with the Philippines, got Canada into the European defense procurement program, while Canada has seen its exports to countries like the UK surge.

All while avoiding a recession.

Also isn't signing some assine deal like Japan, the UK or EU, all of which have record high tariffs and 2 of them having collapsed already.

All in all, pretty damn good.

Standard political action: jump in your pretty airplane and fly to lots of different places, glad-handing all the leaders and signing a number of potential but not necessarily beneficial agreements. Meanwhile, the export of our principal resources (oil and minerals) languishes on the backburner whilst countries are signing agreements to actually harvest the stuff.

 

[Altair]

Standard political action: jump in your pretty airplane and fly to lots of different places, glad-handing all the leaders and signing a number of potential but not necessarily beneficial agreements. Meanwhile, the export of our principal resources (oil and minerals) languishes on the backburner whilst countries are signing agreements to actually harvest the stuff.

So Trudeau who signed TPP, CETA and CUSMA is the gold standard of getting things done. Good to know

 

[YZT580]

So Trudeau who signed TPP, CETA and CUSMA is the gold standard in giving the appearance of getting things done. Good to know

there, I fixed that for you

 

[Altair]

there, I fixed that for you

Oh, I'm sorry. Did he not sign the TPP, CETA and CUSMA trade deals?

 

[Brad Sallows]

Oh, I'm sorry. Did he not sign the TPP, CETA and CUSMA trade deals?

"These go to 11."

 

[YZT580]

Oh, I'm sorry. Did he not sign the TPP, CETA and CUSMA trade deals?

The TPP fell apart, its successor harmed a lot of small businesses that mfg auto parts. CETA, if my memory serves, was initiated and approved by Stephen Harper long before Justin came on the scene. But I will give you CUSMA so 1 out of 3 isn't bad. But the comment made wasn't about deal making it was all about jetting around the globe and having your picture taken and Justin was really good at that. He often skipped town when the pressure was on over one or more of his nefarious escapades and for that he wins the gold crown. Now I am not saying at all that Carney is dodging bad publicity. Quite the contrary. He is using the aircraft as a backdrop to demonstrate how hard he is working for Canada. Most of the issues so far would have been initiated months ago, probably under Justin and are just now coming to fruition. Carney signs the paper and takes the bow just as Justin did for CETA. Not saying it is wrong or bad but you have a habit of focusing on only part of the comments and ignoring the ones that maybe irritate a little bit which is too bad because you do have a lot to say

 

[Altair]

The TPP fell apart, its successor harmed a lot of small businesses that mfg auto parts.

What? TPP is still in effect, in fact the UK joined in 2023 allowing us a free trade deal with the UK where we couldn't agree on one before.

As for auto part manufacturers, way country is harming Canadian auto workers?

Only two big auto makers out of the list, Australia, Brunei, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore, Vietnam, and the United Kingdom, are Japan and Mexico. Mexico already has CUSMA, so Japan? I'm so confused. But yeah, a Trudeau deal, too bad.

CETA, if my memory serves, was initiated and approved by Stephen Harper long before Justin came on the scene.

Trade deals can take up to a decade to come to fruition but Freeland did some heavy lifting in Europe on CETA so no, Justin Trudeau gets credit for this one too.

But I will give you CUSMA so 3 out of 3 isn't bad.

Fixed that for you.

But the comment made wasn't about deal making it was all about jetting around the globe and having your picture taken and Justin was really good at that. He often skipped town when the pressure was on over one or more of his nefarious escapades and for that he wins the gold crown.

Be that as it may, he did get or finish 3 trade deals.

Now I am not saying at all that Carney is dodging bad publicity. Quite the contrary. He is using the aircraft as a backdrop to demonstrate how hard he is working for Canada. Most of the issues so far would have been initiated months ago, probably under Justin and are just now coming to fruition. Carney signs the paper and takes the bow just as Justin did for CETA.

Some things certainly, others are new. But what do we expect PMs to do? They continue on with what their predecessors got started, I stated as much in my earlier comment, Trudeau and Harper both worked on CETA.

On the flip side, when Carney or Trudeau get on a plan and lay the groundwork for a future deal, it gets called a nothing burger. Which, if those are nothing burgers, and only the big trade deals count, well, Trudeau was the one serving up all the big juicy burgers. Which sounds stupid, but that's the logic thats being presented.

Not saying it is wrong or bad but you have a habit of focusing on only part of the comments and ignoring the ones that maybe irritate a little bit which is too bad because you do have a lot to say

I learn from the best.

Many a time I put out a wall of text only for it to be snipped into one line or paragraph of response. When in Rome.

 

[YZT580]

CETA was finalized in 2014. Trudeau signed the documents for Canada in Nov. 2016, right so no heavy lifting unless a BIC is considered heavy. TPP fell apart when the U.S. under Trump withdrew from the agreement. Its successor, CPTPP followed much of the same format but eliminated a lot of the US clauses. The jury is still out on whether it is a good thing for Canada or a bad thing. So you are back to 1 out of 3 with the second as a sort of achievement and the third as a loser

 

[Altair]

CETA was finalized in 2014. Trudeau signed the documents for Canada in Nov. 2016, right so no heavy lifting unless a BIC is considered heavy. TPP fell apart when the U.S. under Trump withdrew from the agreement. Its successor, CPTPP followed much of the same format but eliminated a lot of the US clauses. The jury is still out on whether it is a good thing for Canada or a bad thing. So you are back to 1 out of 3 with the second as a sort of achievement and the third as a loser

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/wherry-freeland-ceta-1.3824374&ved=2ahUKEwik767qh8iQAxXfBTQIHeYCF2IQxfQBKAB6BAgJEAE&usg=AOvVaw1xgV7TujyTnMkWeswoeYfz

EU-Canada trade deal in crisis as Canadian minister walks out

President of European parliament makes last-ditch bid to save talks as Chrystia Freeland announces ‘failure’ of Ceta over Wallonia objections

www.theguardian.com

Redirect Notice

As for CPTPP, only you would call free trade with Japan, Australia, Singapore and the UK a bad thing.

3 for 3.

 

[MilEME09]

Definitely time to re-define the term essential service. Ontario has been blackmailed by their teachers' unions for decades now and the end result has not been pretty. Not only Alberta but BC and others are suffering from the same illness. I believe it was Carnegie that advocated for control of teachers and curriculum 100 years or more ago. Whilst the not-withstanding clause seems a little drastic, I don't think it is unjustified. Certainly the entire education problem deserves closer attention and is far more important than having a bunch of trucks parked in front of Parliament Hill.
What is the solution without using it?

Solution? Actually negotiate in good faith, it was known 2 weeks ago the gov was going to potentially use the NWC. Why was it used? To prevent court challenges against the back to work order. Which last time that happened in 2002 the gov lost. This has set up a major battle at the supreme court, as well between the AB gov and the AFL.

 

[HavokFour]

Not looking too hot before, I wonder what it looks like now.

New Leger poll gives UCP government failing grade in wake of strike

Demo at Elections Alberta, Gordon McClure will show how citizen initiatives are processed. With Lucaszuk's Forever Canada petition in the wings and another going to court (the first test of citizen initiative legislation) and last week's municipal ballot debacle, people are going to be curious.

edmontonjournal.com

Archive

 

[YZT580]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/wherry-freeland-ceta-1.3824374&ved=2ahUKEwik767qh8iQAxXfBTQIHeYCF2IQxfQBKAB6BAgJEAE&usg=AOvVaw1xgV7TujyTnMkWeswoeYfz

EU-Canada trade deal in crisis as Canadian minister walks out

President of European parliament makes last-ditch bid to save talks as Chrystia Freeland announces ‘failure’ of Ceta over Wallonia objections

www.theguardian.com

Redirect Notice

As for CPTPP, only you would call free trade with Japan, Australia, Singapore and the UK a bad thing.

3 for 3.

you are grasping at straws. Belgium backed down on the ratification vote. The deal was actually signed by the harper clan. All she did was have a hissy fit and walk out of the meeting, As for free trade, Free trade with Japan is very similar to free trade with China in that it puts our enterprises out of business. 1 for 3 plus you were taking bows for a failed agreement, that lack of attention to detail isn't like you at all. (sarcasm)

 

[Altair]

you are grasping at straws. Belgium backed down on the ratification vote. The deal was actually signed by the harper clan. All she did was have a hissy fit and walk out of the meeting,

Which, if she didn't do, the deal would have been dead. If it was signed by Harper and nothing else needed to be done, then it wouldn't have mattered what the belgians did. Score one for Freeland.

As for free trade, Free trade with Japan is very similar to free trade with China in that it puts our enterprises out of business.

Only you would deem free trade with Australia, Japan, , Singapore, and the United Kingdom as a bad thing. Tell you what, you point to a credible source showing CPTPP is a bad thing and I'll give it a read. Till then...

3 for 3 plus you were taking bows for a failed agreement, that lack of attention to detail isn't like you at all. (sarcasm)

Fixed.

Now that this exhausting conversation that is going nowhere fast is concluded I bid you adieu

 

[brihard]

Solution? Actually negotiate in good faith, it was known 2 weeks ago the gov was going to potentially use the NWC. Why was it used? To prevent court challenges against the back to work order. Which last time that happened in 2002 the gov lost. This has set up a major battle at the supreme court, as well between the AB gov and the AFL.

Why do you think this has set up a battle at SCC? Collective bargaining rights are all from section 2 of the Charter, which can be completely subject to the Notwithstanding Clause. The teachers would need a different grounds on which to challenge the law if they want it to go to court. And it wouldn’t be at SCC any time soon; it would start at Alberta Court of King’s Bench, then Alberta Court of Appeal. But that assumes there’s something live to actually go through court.

 

[Jarnhamar]

A little Roar from the past?

Transparency questions raised after Trudeau’s NYC hotel bill filed under holding company​

During a period when former prime minister Justin Trudeau faced criticism from opposition leaders about his travel expenses, federal employees posted a 2023 contract for his stay at a New York hotel under the name of its holding company, effectively obscuring it from the public record.

That's weird. The Global Citizen NOW conference was held in New York on April 27, 2023. Why try and obscure it from the public record?


Completely unrelated, 2.7km's away Katy Perry appears to have performed at the grand reopening of the Tiffany & Co. flagship store, "The Landmark," in New York City on April 27, 2023. She was a headlining performer, singing hits like "I Kissed a Girl,".

 

[dapaterson]

Holding companies are not unusual. Contracts with companies are not unusual. Contracts with holding companies are not unusual.

A bigger scandal would be changing the name on a contract released to the public.

 

[Altair]

A little Roar from the past?

Transparency questions raised after Trudeau’s NYC hotel bill filed under holding company​

That's weird. The Global Citizen NOW conference was held in New York on April 27, 2023. Why try and obscure it from the public record?


Completely unrelated, 2.7km's away Katy Perry appears to have performed at the grand reopening of the Tiffany & Co. flagship store, "The Landmark," in New York City on April 27, 2023. She was a headlining performer, singing hits like "I Kissed a Girl,".

If you're insinuating what I think you are, then all I can say is, on a personal level, it worked out really well for the former PM.

 

[Czech_pivo]

If you're insinuating what I think you are, then all I can say is, on a personal level, it worked out really well for the former PM.

There are 2 reasons why he should be happy.