Liberal Minority Government 2025 - ???

[CBH99]

Then they would simply resign from caucus, sit as “independents” but vote with and be invited to discussions by the other party.

I understand why some of you want what you want, but there’s just a number of legal reasons it’s a non-starter, not the least of which is the inherent breaches of sections 2 and 3 of the Charter.

Our accountability mechanism for the things you’re objecting here is the next election.

All fair points Brihard, and I think you may be technically right.

(I'm rolling around a potential legal interpretation in my head, which I may or may not circle back to further down...hmmmmmmm...)

But with all due respect to you personally (and I sincerely mean that) - f**k that.

...

If someone runs for public office under the banner of a certain political party, then says "Actually, I've changed my mind and wanna be with the other party instead..."

They should resign. And run in the next election or byelection under the banner of the party they actually want to be a member of.

You know, win an election honestly. (Believe me when I say I feel pretty stupid suggesting a politician, of all people, will win something honestly...)

...

Running under Banner A, but then crossing the floor to Banner B, is a huge slap in the face to everybody who voted for them, donated money to their campaign, and supported them.

If the people in his riding wanted a Liberal MP, they would have voted for the Liberal candidate.

But they didn't.

...

Isn't the whole idea behind democracy is that the people elect the individuals that will represent them politically?

What's the point of democracy if voter's votes don't count?

What's the point of me going and voting CPC if a few months later he can just snap his fingers & is now suddenly a member of the party that I didn't vote for?

It completely bypasses then dismisses the very spirit of our system itself.



*Both Sections 1 and 2 are subject to reasonable limits. I believe it's reasonable to have to run in an election for the party you intend to be a member of. If those intentions change for whatever reason before the next election, I believe it's reasonable to have to sit the remainder out until a byelection can happen or the next general election happens.
(Nobody is saying they can't exercise their charter rights, but I don't think it's unreasonable to ask someone who ran for public office to at least be somewhat loyal to that very public)



My 2 cents anyway

 

[CBH99]

This is not true. Under 47.a of the Liberal Party of Canada constitution, following any election in which the LPC do not form government, they will hold a leadership endorsement vote to determine if the current leader will continue on.

Under 3.a.v of the New Democratic Party of Canada constitution, at every convention they hold a secret ballot to determine if they’ll hold a leadership vote.

Your snarkiness on this one is not supported by the facts.

I have to stand firm with @ArmyRick

 

[brihard]

I have to stand firm with @ArmyRick

I was only addressing his factually false claim that the other parties don’t hold leadership rules. I’m not taking part in any of the rest of it.

All fair points Brihard, and I think you may be technically right.

(I'm rolling around a potential legal interpretation in my head, which I may or may not circle back to further down...hmmmmmmm...)

But with all due respect to you personally (and I sincerely mean that) - f**k that.

...

If someone runs for public office under the banner of a certain political party, then says "Actually, I've changed my mind and wanna be with the other party instead..."

They should resign. And run in the next election or byelection under the banner of the party they actually want to be a member of.

You know, win an election honestly. (Believe me when I say I feel pretty stupid suggesting a politician, of all people, will win something honestly...)

...

Running under Banner A, but then crossing the floor to Banner B, is a huge slap in the face to everybody who voted for them, donated money to their campaign, and supported them.

If the people in his riding wanted a Liberal MP, they would have voted for the Liberal candidate.

But they didn't.

...

Isn't the whole idea behind democracy is that the people elect the individuals that will represent them politically?

What's the point of democracy if voter's votes don't count?

What's the point of me going and voting CPC if a few months later he can just snap his fingers & is now suddenly a member of the party that I didn't vote for?

It completely bypasses then dismisses the very spirit of our system itself.



*Both Sections 1 and 2 are subject to reasonable limits. I believe it's reasonable to have to run in an election for the party you intend to be a member of. If those intentions change for whatever reason before the next election, I believe it's reasonable to have to sit the remainder out until a byelection can happen or the next general election happens.
(Nobody is saying they can't exercise their charter rights, but I don't think it's unreasonable to ask someone who ran for public office to at least be somewhat loyal to that very public)



My 2 cents anyway

Let me post a challenge to you: come up with a very specific rule that you’d argue to put in place and I’ll see if I can find where it would go off the rails or break something that matters. I may need to ask clarifying questions to do so.

Could be fun and we all may learn things.

 

[CBH99]

I was only addressing his factually false claim that the other parties don’t hold leadership rules. I’m not taking part in any of the rest of it.

My apologies for posting that actually - it was part of a longer post but this site kinda glitches my phone whenever I try to tag someone specific


And challenge accepted!! This may take me a few mins here... (Currently experiencing what winter in Winnipeg is like, and let me just say winter is winning!)

 

[brihard]

My apologies for posting that actually - it was part of a longer post but this site kinda glitches my phone whenever I try to tag someone specific


And challenge accepted!! This may take me a few mins here... (Currently experiencing what winter in Winnipeg is like, and let me just say winter is winning!)

All good! I’m assembling a cabinet - which seems hilariously fitting to the discussion - and taking care of general stuff around the house. I’ll be in and out.

 

[Brad Sallows]

All good! I’m assembling a cabinet - which seems hilariously fitting to the discussion - and taking care of general stuff around the house. I’ll be in and out.

How did taking care of a house reach the point that you had to assemble a cabinet? How often do you meet with them?

 

[Good2Golf]

It would also leave open the question of what happens when a substantial portion of a party splits off, or alternatively if two parties merge.

One of the parties gets ignored and issues marginalized and the leader of the other, dominant party renegs on the merger agreement to transfer leadership after a number of consecutive election cycles.

"In reality, Poilievre has two leadership reviews underway. There is the one in January, where party members vote and in that one, he’s expected to do well. But thanks to the Conservatives adopting the Reform Act, he is under constant review with his MPs."

…whilst essentially ignoring the de facto review by his constituents in Ottawa-Carleton riding last general election, and then reaching a secret undisclosed agreement with another party MP Damien Kurek to retire early, prior to pension eligibility and the next general election, so that Poilievre could pantomime a review of sorts in a by-election that wouldn’t have occurred had that undisclosed agreement not happened between him and Kurek shortly after the April general election.

Totally legit legal…as are, you know, the floor crossings.

You know, win an election honestly.

Like in Battle River - Crowfoot.

 

[ArmyRick]

…whilst essentially ignoring the de facto review by his constituents in Ottawa-Carleton riding last general election, and then reaching a secret undisclosed agreement with another party MP Damien Kurek to retire early, prior to pension eligibility and the next general election, so that Poilievre could pantomime a review of sorts in a by-election that wouldn’t have occurred had that undisclosed agreement not happened between him and Kurek shortly after the April general election.

Totally legit legal…as are, you know, the floor crossings.

How much of the CPC really had an issue with it? Like next to zilch.

Dude, lets speak straight and cut the wish washy fluffy bullshit.

1 bitter floor crosser, 1 floor crosser who nobody knew (and some of staff quit the next day), BOTH in a position where they slammed the Liberals and then within a matter of days/weeks, cross the floor. Leona Alleslev had the decency to wait a few years before she crossed, ad personally i wasn't cool with it, go see my comments here on army.ca in 2018 about that.

The media continues to trash Pierre Poilievre, and yet, he is neck in neck with Mark Carney's Liberals. Why is that? Carney should be like 50-55% at least in a majority of the polls.

Canadians are still hungry.
Canadians are still fighting for affordable homes.
Canadians are still struggling with making bills.
Canadians are still fed up with our justice system.
Canadian are still not ok with our immigration free for all.
Canadians want REAL results in energy development especially when the PM has the POWER and hides behind a weak ass premier and a protest group, funded by American organizations like Rockefeller and Tides (with only 20% actual first nations involvement)

Prattle on. Keep carry the Liberals water, maybe some of you can submit your resumes to CBC.ca or Global. Actually, I gotta be careful, Rose Mary Barton pushed kind of hard on PM MC (way to go RM, or was it payback for his condescending tone he addressed her).

Pierre goes, or he stays. Then we pick a new leader.

It still doesn't change the reality that the PM MC are all talk and next to no action.

 

[MrWhyt]

Prattle on. Keep carry the Liberals water, maybe some of you can submit your resumes to CBC.ca or Global.

it's not an either or situation, people who criticize PP and/or the CPC aren't liberal/NDP supporters by default. The CPC is is not an infallible entity immune from criticism.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

I know that you have professed to be a world class asshole, and I see no reason to dispute that.

But seriously dude. Have you ever posted anything that does not include unnecessary slams and name calling? Have you ever resisted the temptation to make it personal? The need to replace wishy-washy fluffy bullshit with vitriolic screed and ranting?

 

[Good2Golf]

How much of the CPC really had an issue with it? Like next to zilch.

Really? Zilch? BS!

Dude, lets speak straight and cut the wish washy fluffy bullshit.

Wish washy fluffy BS?

What part didn’t you understand?

The CPC isn’t a homogenous, Liberal-hating at-all-costs organization.

I’ll add names to my earlier words, since you believe that I was being a speaker of wishy washy fluffy BS…Harper made a deal with MacKay in 2003 to share sequentially leadership in governing Canada if the PCs joined the Canadian Alliance. Harper to get the first two governments and if the CPC win subsequent elections, MacKay gets the leadership thereafter.

Briefed well. Just like the Budapest Agreement did for the Ukrainians back in 1993.

We all know the MacKay never became CPC party leader and PM in 2011 because Alliance Harper went back in his deal with PC MacKay.

1 bitter floor crosser, 1 floor crosser who nobody knew (and some of staff quit the next day), BOTH in a position where they slammed the Liberals and then within a matter of days/weeks, cross the floor. Leona Alleslev had the decency to wait a few years before she crossed, ad personally i wasn't cool with it, go see my comments here on army.ca in 2018 about that.

So start a petition to make it illegal. Or something other than yelling at clouds.

The media continues to trash Pierre Poilievre, and yet, he is neck in neck with Mark Carney's Liberals. Why is that? Carney should be like 50-55% at least in a majority of the polls.

A guy who was so out of touch with his constituents that he completely crapped the bed in his own riding? His loss in Ottawa - Carlton showed just how arrogant and absolutely out of touch he was…I see nothing that has changed. Let’s hear Poilievre truthfully tell us what was offered to Kurek to get his to step down so the Poilievre could lick his wounds and win in one of the easiest Reform/Alliance Conservative seats in the country? That shady crap is any better than what you describe as traitorous behavior by floor-crossing MPs?

Canadians are still hungry.
Canadians are still fighting for affordable homes.
Canadians are still struggling with making bills.
Canadians are still fed up with our justice system.
Canadian are still not ok with our immigration free for all.
Canadians want REAL results in energy development especially when the PM has the POWER and hides behind a weak ass premier and a protest group, funded by American organizations like Rockefeller and Tides (with only 20% actual first nations involvement)

Canadians spoke with their ballots and we have what we have.

So who’s ballots should not have counted then, according to you?

Prattle on. Keep carry the Liberals water, maybe some of you can submit your resumes to CBC.ca or Global. Actually, I gotta be careful, Rose Mary Barton pushed kind of hard on PM MC (way to go RM, or was it payback for his condescending tone he addressed her).

Sure, go all ad hominem. The sign of mind that has difficulty making a point, resorting to insults. Great way to get more Reform/Alliance Conservative votes next election, I’m sure.

Pierre goes, or he stays. Then we pick a new leader.

Will be interesting to see if any muscle memory of the PCs comes into play in that review. All Hail the new Reform/Alliance CPC!

It still doesn't change the reality that the PM MC are all talk and next to no action.

Demonstrably untrue. That said, why not humour us and tell us what the economy numbers would have been if Poilievre hadn’t been robbed of the PM-ship earlier this year?

 

[ArmyRick]

So start a petition to make it illegal. Or something other than yelling at clouds.

Or type it out on army.ca Gee, may I have an opinion if that is ok with you?

Let’s hear Poilievre truthfully tell us what was offered to Kurek to get his to step down so the Poilievre

A conversation between them for now, anything is else if rumours, and you know it

Canadians spoke with their ballots and we have what we have.

So who’s ballots should not have counted then, according to you?

Measuring PM MC by his own standards, he has done very little to nothing to live up to his own ballot promises.

All Hail the new Reform/Alliance CPC!

And a point here?

Demonstrably untrue.

We have a deal with Trump? The one he said he knew how to handle?
Crime has reduced? New bail laws?
That MOU with Alberta is a what? Words not deeds.
We continue to hemorrhage jobs to the USA but its not Carney's fault.
Te economy is in shit state. Food and housing is still high cost. But its "other factors" right? Bullshit.
And lets not even touch the $78 billion deficit.
Ohhh but operating cost and capital cost (ALL taxpayers money)

Sure, go all ad hominem

Do you know what that is? Obviously not.

tell us what the economy numbers would have been if Poilievre

Could of, would of, maybe yes, maybe no. Lets pull out a crystal ball. I ASSUME the economy would have been on a better track by repealing a bunch of shit laws to start with. Fact is PM MC is not doing well in any of these measures.

I don't say much on here these days, I have spoken with some other members who no longer post on here (there is a reason why), some of you try to make this an echo chamber. I have watched some of the comments that get made to others.

Criticize Carney (Who has done a shit job as PM, folks, gt real), how dare thee speak of such tyranny!

Pierre drops his phone, and damn can't this guy get anything correct? Thats why he is losing so badly (when his polling is tied with Carney)

Keep the rose coloured glasses on. Live in your fantasies.

 

[Good2Golf]

Pierre drops his phone, and damn can't this guy get anything correct? Thats why he is losing so badly (when his polling is tied with Carney)

I guess we’ll all be listening to PM Poilievre in early-2026 then?

 

[ArmyRick]

I guess we’ll all be listening to PM Poilievre in early-2026 then?

Perfect segue, this is an excellent interview by Jamin Laine of Pierre. This is what leadership looks like.

While CBC, CTV, Global, Toronto Star obsess over Pierre's leadership, Pierre is hyper focused on making everyday Canadian's lives more affordable, less crime and more jobs, gasps, what a concept.

Enjoy

 

[ArmyRick]

I guess we’ll all be listening to PM Poilievre in early-2026 then?

I knew some very pro Liberals in 2005 with a similar attitude about the Martin vs Harper period, look how that ended.

I am humble enough to say Pierre may stay on, or he may not. If he stays on, he may or may not become PM. I don't have a crystal ball to tell me otherwise. You?

 

[Good2Golf]

Perfect segue, this is an excellent interview by Jamin Laine of Pierre. This is what leadership looks like.

While CBC, CTV, Global, Toronto Star obsess over Pierre's leadership, Pierre is hyper focused on making everyday Canadian's lives more affordable, less crime and more jobs, gasps, what a concept.

Enjoy

Hopefully he, as future Prime Minister, would listen to Canadians more than he listened (or didn’t) to me and other Ottawa - Carleton constituents.

I remained entirely unimpressed by him.

 

[Halifax Tar]

I guess we’ll all be listening to PM Poilievre in early-2026 then?

I know this wasn't for me....and I have no idea what the future holds.

But I continue to confounded by the polls. PP is personally unpopular, but something seems afoot. With the LPC and CPC in a dead heat or the CPC starting to take the lead in some...

It remains to be see if this will really manifest into something tangible....

Listening to Scott Reid this week and he seems concerned about Liberal arrogance. I dunno time will tell...

 

[dapaterson]

I know this wasn't for me....and I have no idea what the future holds.

But I continue to confounded by the polls. PP is personally unpopular, but something seems afoot. With the LPC and CPC in a dead heat or the CPC starting to take the lead in some...

It remains to be see if this will really manifest into something tangible....

Listening to Scott Reid this week and he seems concerned about Liberal arrogance. I dunno time will tell...

"Liberal arrogance" is like "sunrise in the east". It's a known fact.

Somehow, the Conservative Party has managed to continually seize defeat from the jaws of victory despite knowing that fact.

 

[Pelorus]

I don't say much on here these days, I have spoken with some other members who no longer post on here (there is a reason why), some of you try to make this an echo chamber. I have watched some of the comments that get made to others.

If you browse this website with any sort of regularity, it's clearly apparent that the political leanings of the 20-30 regulars here is overwhelmingly somewhere on the spectrum of centre-right to right. There's more or less a single left-leaning regular poster here, and he gets dogpiled on in almost every thread. If you can't find a sympathetic audience here of all places, surely it's time to take a look inward and make better posts?

That said, in my experience in the CAF and in life, the number of guys who proudly proclaim themselves to "tell it like it is" or who are "proud assholes", and those with the ability to self-reflect is zero. So maybe it's too tall of an ask.

But sure, keep the posting cycle of weird right-wing Youtube channels talking about how Carney got SLAMMED, 0 to 100 ad hominem attacks whenever someone points out the most basic of holes in your assertions, and this woe is me victimhood. Maybe the hundredth time is the charm?

 

[Good2Golf]

But I continue to confounded by the polls. PP is personally unpopular, but something seems afoot. With the LPC and CPC in a dead heat or the CPC starting to take the lead in some...

I don’t see a Conservative Liberal crossover anytime soon.

Two reasonable polling thoughts:

1) things have for the most spot settled with a slight separation, protestations that the Cons are climbing and will soon eat the Libs notwithstanding…


…and…

2) Canadians generally don’t like the idea of Poilievre as PM compared to Carney, again notwithstanding assertions that Poilieve is on a strongly ascending trend…that’s just not the case.