Liberals Want Injured to Keep Getting Danger Pay Back in Canada

[Good2Golf]

Lord knows, given computers, databases, etc... these days, VAC should automatically start a file on any CF member who has any type of medical disability affect them, not make it an "oh, by the way...you have to apply for a disability pension" type of crap.  If a CF medical determines that there is some medical condition (from ops, training, service in the CF) it should start automatically.

G2G

 

[RogerD]

Politicans have a way of getting the public "in a tizzy" when they make broad statements. It is very unfortunate that our guys/girls get killed or injured, but that is one of the hazards of what we do. Stating that they are placed in "financial hardship" is totally unfounded. This isn't like winning the lottery and having it taken away, although a 6 month tour looks good in the bank. Allowances start once you land and cease on wheels up, you even keep your allowances while on leave (not sure about H & R). Plans for what you can do with your well earned money is fine but spending before it is earned is ones own decision, albiet not advised.


RD

 

[RHFC_piper]

Lord knows, given computers, databases, etc... these days, VAC should automatically start a file on any CF member who has any type of medical disability affect them, not make it an "oh, by the way...you have to apply for a disability pension" type of crap.  If a CF medical determines that there is some medical condition (from ops, training, service in the CF) it should start automatically.

G2G

Unfortunately, there is quite a bit of paperwork to be done for VAC (DVA), SISIP and CF.  I am still in the process of filling out paperwork and I was wounded over a month ago.

Part of the problem is the lack of streamlining.  I currently have 4 doctors, 3 nurse practitioners, and 2 case workers (DVA and CF) whom all want to see me on a regular basis and all report to different departments (DVA / VAC, CF, etc). and they don't really talk to eachother.

Example; I have follow up appointments at the MIR in London (for the 31 CBG docs), The MIR at Downsview (for the LFCA Docs), Sunnybrook hospital (for the care I recieved there), the Hospital in Kitchener ('cause I don't have a family doctor), and the home care nurses do their own follow ups regularly...(this doesn't include the case worker from London or Physio, or psychiatric care, etc) each of them have to submit something to DVA / VAC, CF, etc... none are in much contact with eachother.

So.. in summation: Yes, it would be great if they just plugged your name into a computer and sorted you out once you got hurt, but it just isn't so. 

Oh well... at least it gives me something to do during the day.

 

[tlg]

Just like Unemployment Insurance. Who will ever collect?

Can you collect CPP Disability Benefits as a result of being WIA?

Lots of people collect UI. My dad did when Viskase Canada shut down the plant in Lindsay. He went on UI and went back to school. Receieved his MCSE Cert. and now he's on disability resulting from the company.

//EDIT: Sorry for hijacking the thread, just thought it might be relevant to know that people DO use UI.

//EDIT2: Isn't danger pay just that, DANGER PAY? In my mind if your not on a combat tour you're not entitled to danger pay.

 

[Gunner]

There is no danger pay, there is simply Risk and Hardship (and Hardship Bonus's) Allowances for serving in a special duty area and there is foreign service premiums.  No Danger Pay, No UN allowance, No Separation Pay.  If we (soldiers) can't use the proper terms, how can we ask or rebuke journalists that weave their web of "sensationalish news".

 

[George Wallace]

tlg

You just stepped outside your lanes.  It is an unfortunate fact, but a member of the CF upon Release, is not immediately eligible to collect UI like any other member of Canada's Workforce.  The amount of time that they must wait will vary on how much of a Severance Package they got, amount or Pension and other factors that the Government holds against them.  So, although members of the CF are required by Law to pay into UI, or EI, they are not eligible to apply for it when they are laid off.

In the same category, is the new "Health Premiums" that various Provinces like Ontario have now levied on members of the CF.  They are required to pay "Health Premiums" to the Province, but are not really entitled to the services, as they are covered by the Military (Federal).  In some Provinces, like Alberta, it is charged under another name and is fully refundable, but not in Ontario.  Again the members of the CF are being 'charged' for 'services' that they will not be able to use.

.....and then there are all those Canadians who still feel that members of the CF don't have to pay Taxes, Rent, etc........just makes your head spin at what the members of the CF to put up with.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

tlg

You just stepped outside your lanes.  It is an unfortunate fact, but a member of the CF upon Release, is not immediately eligible to collect UI like any other member of Canada's Workforce.  The amount of time that they must wait will vary on how much of a Severance Package they got, amount or Pension and other factors that the Government holds against them.  So, although members of the CF are required by Law to pay into UI, or EI, they are not eligible to apply for it when they are laid off.

George,
Check your facts, this is the same for EVERYBODY,  no one is discriminating against the military here.

In the same category, is the new "Health Premiums" that various Provinces like Ontario have now levied on members of the CF.  They are required to pay "Health Premiums" to the Province, but are not really entitled to the services, as they are covered by the Military (Federal).  In some Provinces, like Alberta, it is charged under another name and is fully refundable, but not in Ontario.  Again the members of the CF are being 'charged' for 'services' that they will not be able to use.

When someone is driving home on a leave pass and gets in an accident, where do you think he/she goes for treatment?

 

[George Wallace]

George,
Check your facts, this is the same for EVERYBODY,  no one is discriminating against the military here.

It depends on whether or not they have the same in the way of Severance Packages, Pensions, etc.  In some cases that is true.  In most it isn't as severe.  In other cases, it isn't true at all.

When someone is driving home on a leave pass and gets in an accident, where do you think he/she goes for treatment?

They will be treated as anyone from anyother Province/State/Country would.  They would use their Leave Pass info and their Green Cross Cards.  They would be expected to use the closest DND Medical facility if possible.  If in a Medical facility other than a CF facility, the Bill would be sent to DND.  Still no Bill to the Province.

 

[HItorMiss]

It's Blue Cross now George, and your right bill goes to DND, initial monies come out of Provincial pockets to be repaid by Blue Cross (vis a vis DND) and as such the premiums the CF members pay to the Province is essentially our money thrown away.


hmmm thread Hijack much LOL

 

[George Wallace]

It's Blue Cross now George, and your right bill goes to DND, initial monies come out of Provincialpockets to be repaid by Blue Cross (vis a vis DND) and as such the premiums the CF members pay to the Province is essentially our money thrown away.


hmmm thread Hijack much LOL

Opps.....Green Cross is for pesticides and such........sorry wrong colour....  ;D

 

[tlg]

I believe my dad had to wait until his severance was up, but in any case I was just stating that people DO in fact use UI. Personally if you don't use UI you should get some money back or something. Just like I don't agree on how insurance works. But that's just my uninformed thoughts and another story altogether.

 

[geo]

tlg...
EI (not UI) is like any insurance............... it's there if you need it but, in the end, you'd prefer not being in a situation where you want to claim.

And no, you don't get money back or a discount.

 

[warrickdll]

...
b.  Should a soldier receive financial compensation for being wounded in action?  I was originally against this but I am now sitting on the fence.  Someone mentioned that if a soldier is injured on the first day in theatre, they should receive the full 6 months of benefits (above) but if they are wounded on their last day in theatre, they only get an additional day.  This doesn't make sense at all.  You either get a lump sum for being wounded or you don't.  No middle ground that would provide for a graduated scale of financial compensation (you either get it or you don't).  The graduated scales are the purview of SISIP and VAC (loss of limbs provide x dollars, etc).  Hence, if anything is given, it must be a lump sum.  1K, 5K or 10K, it doesn't matter to me as the amount is minor in the grand scheme.
...

It's been a couple of weeks and I find that my mind has changed to now completely agree with the above quote.

A lump sum (probably between $10,000 - $20,000). No questions asked. No calculations. And separate from any later SISIP/DVA dealings.

In the grand scheme of things it is a small price to pay in comparison. And would give the wounded soldier one less thing to worry about.

A bit of a bump - any word from the "big-brained people" yet?

 

[battleaxe]

The point is; the military is now my only coverage.  There aren't many employers in the civilian sector that would want to deal with a freshly wounded, PTSD ladened, potential health insurance leech... even though it sounds like discrimination, its hard to prove when they can easily say they hired someone more qualified. and no matter how qualified you think you are, there's always someone more so... damnit, I'm ranting again.

There is a fight on now, where a soldier is holding DND responsible for his continuing employment under the employment equity law of an employer's "Duty to Accommodate".  Just want you to peek in on another forum (if you haven't already done so)- The Human Rights Commission Challenge under Current events.

Interesting reading for somebody concerned with employability issues after medical release.

Hope it helps..

 

[RHFC_piper]

There is a fight on now, where a soldier is holding DND responsible for his continuing employment under the employment equity law of an employer's "Duty to Accommodate".  Just want you to peek in on another forum (if you haven't already done so)- The Human Rights Commission Challenge under Current events.

Interesting reading for somebody concerned with employability issues after medical release.

Hope it helps..

Yeah, I've been poking my head in there every once in a while to see how its panning out.  I've pretty much decided to stay out of the general debate about danger pay and such... it's pretty much up to "the smarter people" now.  Besides, it just seems all to political now, and not so much about the troops.  I'll just go with whatever decision the government makes for me.

As for the work issue, I actually left my job a few months before I started work up, so I'm not really eligible for govenment assistance with that... and its my own fault.. oh well.  I just hope it works out for the guys who really need it.

Thanks for the heads up though,

Cheers,

- Piper

 

[RHFC_piper]

Sorry to revive such an old topic, but I though I'd post an update;

Since the last post here (which, sadly, was mine) the DND and Canadian Government have approved compensation for lost overseas allowance.

The official name is Allowance for Loss of Overseas Allowance (ALOA - not very inventive, but effective), and it has been distributed for most of the wounded who have returned from TF3-06 (and maybe more).

My understanding on how this allowance works is;  The soldier is reimbursed what he or she should have recieved monthly while overseas, but the sum is taxed here in Canada.  To compensate for the tax, the allowance is increased to offset.
eg. (as it was explained to me) If a solder was to recieve $2000 per month while overseas, where it would be 'Tax Free', then their reimbursement would be increased to cover the amount of tax they'll have to pay here in Canada, so that after taxes, the soldier recieves $2000.

I recieved my ALOA with my pay at the end of February, as did most of the wounded from my tour (those I've talked to or have heard from anyway... and that's quite a few), and this was all explained to me by the CF Ombudsman during a meeting on the 26th of Feb. 

Here is the 'Official' News release:
Link
[quote author=DND/CF NEWS RELEACE: December 15, 2006]
Canada's New Government Announces New Allowance for Canadian Forces Members
NR–06.094 - December 15, 2006

OTTAWA– The Honourable Gordon O’Connor, Minister of National Defence, and General Rick Hillier, the Chief of Defence Staff, are pleased to announce a new universal allowance for Canadian Forces (CF) members who are wounded as a result of hostile action or become injured or ill as a result of the conditions in theatres of operation.

The Allowance for Loss of Operational Allowance (ALOA) will compensate members who are medically repatriated from operations after becoming wounded or very seriously injured or ill as a result of the conditions in theatres of operation. In such situations, the CF member will receive this new allowance until the last date of their planned deployment. For example, if a member is initially deployed for a six-month tour of duty and is wounded after one month, this member would receive the ALOA for the five remaining months.

The new allowance structure will:

  -  Compensate members for the loss of allowances upon repatriation from an operational theatre after becoming wounded, very seriously injured or ill;

  -  Mitigate the burden faced by members and their families when other operational allowances cease; and

  -  Ensure that the loss of operational allowance(s) is recognized in a satisfactory manner.

“Canada’s New Government is pleased to announce that the new operational allowance structure will better meet the needs of all Canadian Forces members and their families,” said Minister O’Connor. “The new structure means that the brave men and women serving in a theatre of operations will receive financial compensation if their involvement ceases before the end of their rotation period.”

All CF members who are deployed on foreign military operations are paid what are called operational allowances. For example, a CF member deployed for a first tour in Kandahar, Afghanistan would receive more than $1900 per month, tax-free, above their regular pay as an operational allowance. In addition, their regular pay is also income-tax exempt up to $6647 per month.  These benefits apply equally to all CF members on the mission, regardless of rank or position. 

“The new allowance will enable us to take better care of our soldiers who get sick or injured and must come back to Canada before the end of their tour,” explained Hillier. “These valued members of our family have put themselves at risk on behalf of Canadians, and the new allowance stands as testament that we will take care of them upon their return,” he added.
[/quote]

I know this is an old press release and this my be old news in general, I just wanted to confirm that soldiers are being compensated, and if there are any out there who haven't yet, and meet the criteria it would be prudent to contact your chain of command and start asking questions.

- Piper

 

[MikeM]

Piper,

Just got off the phone with a buddy from 1 VP who was on the 1-06 Roto.. I can confirm as well he received his ALOA, he was repatted 2 months into tour. It's good to see guys are getting their money.

 

[Kiwi99]

Strongly disagree with this policy, as do people I know who were wounded.  It is a reaction to public opinion, a public who does not ahve all the facts all the time.  It is simple, if you are no longer in a dangerous area, you no longer warrant danger pay.  If not in theater, then no more theater pay.  How retroactive is this policy?  Can a guy wounded in Cyprus and sent home clain for all his lost earnings?

 

[the 48th regulator]

Strongly disagree with this policy, as do people I know who were wounded. 

So it is safe to assume that based on your statement, the people you know who were wounded will be refusing the Allowance for Loss of Overseas Allowance (ALOA) or sending the payment back, based on their principles?

That way the government will see what the troops really feel.

Keep us posted.

dileas

tess

 

[Kiwi99]

Exactly.