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Oldgateboatdriver said:... Lets keep the law for real terrorists like the Toronto 18.
Strong closing point and very true.
Oldgateboatdriver said:... Lets keep the law for real terrorists like the Toronto 18.
Oldgateboatdriver said:I am putting just a subsection here and underlining two parts
(b) an act or omission, in or outside Canada,
(i) that is committed
(A) in whole or in part for a political, religious or ideological purpose, objective or cause, and
(B) in whole or in part with the intention of intimidating the public, or a segment of the public, with regard to its security, including its economic security, or compelling a person, a government or a domestic or an international organization to do or to refrain from doing any act, whether the public or the person, government or organization is inside or outside Canada, and [...]
This very specific intent is the heart of the "terrorism" definition and seems to have been generally ignored in this thread. Yes, you blow a bank: it is a crime; you kill someone while doing it: it is a crime; you endangered lives: it is a crime. But is it terrorism?
Can someone here honestly say that, having heard of this firebombing, of the Anarchist group's claim of responsibility and its vague message concerning the olympics-G8-and-G20 meetings, they are afraid of going banking, or to go out at night and walk past a bank? I think not. There was no message here that would amount to "this is just the beginning/do not dare go out at night or we'll get you/the streets of Ottawa will run with blood". Similarly, can any one identify from the known facts here any specific and identifiable act of a person, government or organization that this group is trying to prevent from happening or cause to happen?
No, This is just a group of misguided Anarchist trying to garner publicity for their pet cause through the commission of crimes. It makes them dangerous criminals (re: their disregard of life and property rights) but on the basis of this sole event and its surrounding facts, not terrorists. Lets keep the law for real terrorists like the Toronto 18.
(B) in whole or in part with the intention of intimidating the public, or a segment of the public, with regard to its security, including its economic security, or compelling a person, a government or a domestic or an international organization to do or to refrain from doing any act, whether the public or the person, government or organization is inside or outside Canada, and
OTTAWA — Three men — including two in their 50s — have been arrested in the investigation into the firebombing of an uptown Ottawa bank last month.
In the Friday morning raids, Ottawa Police arrested one man downtown, and a second at his home in nearby Stittsville, Ont. A third man in his early 30s has also been picked up. His name is Matthew Morgan-Brown, of Ottawa. He is a well known activist. He was arrested before the 2007 Montebello summit and charged with assaulting police. He was also arrested in 2004 for vandalizing downtown buildings during an antiwar protest.
Claude Haridge, 50, of Stittsville is in police custody, charged with arson and mischief. Days after the firebombing, which was filmed and posted online in a “catch-me-if-you-can” video, the 50-year-old accused was arrested in an unrelated investigation. In that probe, the accused firebomber was charged with careless storage of ammunition.
The 58-year-old accused is Roger Clement a retired federal public servant, is also in police custody and charged with arson. Detectives believe he rented a 2010 SUV, which was used as the getaway car.
The licence plate of the truck was caught on security video, which led detectives to check rental car records.
The Citizen has learned that Clement used his own credit card and driver’s licence to rent the truck.
The firebombing by anarchist group FFFC-Ottawa, which was filmed and posted online, was considered an unsophisticated attack.
Clement told the Citizen in an interview that he was “absolutely not” linked to the attack.
The retired public servant also said at that time that he knew nothing about the incident. He said he did not loan the vehicle to anyone and, he added that, if it had been stolen, he would have reported it to police.
He also said that he, alone, put 1,500 kilometres on the SUV’s odometer in just two days, driving from Ottawa to Peterborough, Ont., and back, not once but twice, to help his brother with “something.”
The “homegrown terrorists” have said they firebombed the bank because it sponsored the Vancouver Olympics, which they say was staged on stolen Indian land.
Prime Minister Stephen Harper was briefed about the case because the firebombers posted an online statement saying they will be at the upcoming G8-G20 summits in Huntsville, Ont., and Toronto.
Since 2007, RBC branches across Canada had been targeted in dozens of attacks by Canadian anarchists and other extremists who view the bank as a symbol of corporate greed.
Claude Haridge, 50, of Stittsville is in police custody, charged with arson and mischief. Days after the firebombing, which was filmed and posted online in a “catch-me-if-you-can” video, the 50-year-old accused was arrested in an unrelated investigation. In that probe, the accused firebomber was charged with careless storage of ammunition.
The 58-year-old accused is Roger Clement a retired federal public servant, is also in police custody and charged with arson. Detectives believe he rented a 2010 SUV, which was used as the getaway car.
The licence plate of the truck was caught on security video, which led detectives to check rental car records.
The Citizen has learned that Clement used his own credit card and driver’s licence to rent the truck.
The firebombing by anarchist group FFFC-Ottawa, which was filmed and posted online, was considered an unsophisticated attack.
old medic said:Unlocked, for discussion of the arrests.
Arrests in Ottawa bank firebombing
Gary Dimmock, Canwest News Service
18 June 2010
http://www.nationalpost.com/news/Arrests+Ottawa+bank+firebombing/3172706/story.html
mellian said:Oh for frak sake... *facepalms*
Michael O'Leary said:Why *facepalm*?
We shouldn't discuss this?
Why not discuss CRIMINAL activities in the name of activisim?
George Wallace said:As you know two of these people arrested, does it in any way change your views as to "preemptive" measures in protecting an otherwise peaceful form of protest from infiltration from outside or otherwise known unstable persons who intend on committing violent acts?
Something that seems to have cropped up time and again in this thread, and the above quote is a good example, is how some have minimized the danger to the public safety based on the location being "just" a bank late at night.mellian said:Considering they did it during a part of the night where is there no other people around inside or out, it is safe to say their intention is not to harm anyone. The glebe around 3am is pretty deserted with only the occasional car going by.
On June 18, 2010, the Ottawa Police Service arrested three Ottawa men regarding the May 18th arson fire at the RBC branch located at 745 Bank Street.
An extensive 30-day investigation led by that Ottawa Police Arson and Major Crime Units and supported by Ontario Provincial Police and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police found that the suspects had used a combination of an accelerant and an improvised explosive device to set the lobby of the bank ablaze. Damage to the bank was estimated at over $500,000.
The investigation also led to charges for another incident at the RBC bank located at 1535 Bank Street that occurred at approx. 4:00am on February 1, 2010 where two persons were observed damaging multiple windows and ATMs with rocks and a hammer.
This morning, the three men have been charged as follows:
Roger Clement 58 years old, of Ottawa
RBC Arson - 18th of May 2010
Arson Causing Damage
Possession of incendiary material
Use explosives with intent to cause property damage
Mischief
RBC Damage - 1st of February 2010
Mischief
Matthew Morgan – Brown 32 years old, of Ottawa
RBC Arson - 18th of May 2010
Arson Causing Damage
Possession of incendiary material
Use explosives with intent to cause property damage
Mischief
Claude Haridge, 50 years old, of Ottawa
RBC Arson - 18th of May 2010
Careless storage / handling of ammunition
Fail to comply with undertaking
RBC Damage - 1st of February 2010
Mischief
The three suspects are appearing at Show cause at the Ottawa Court House this morning ....
Petard said:I live in the Glebe, not far from where this fire took place, this assumption the risk to the public was minimal is BS, and I hope is considered heavily as the accused go through the legal system.
mellian said:Knowing who they are now from previous involvement with the Ottawa activist community when I still lived there, I am more certain than when I wrote that quote that the intention is not to harm anyone. They are still idiots thought.