No canadian support for military? opinion please, writing paper

[Paul Gagnon]

Originally posted by CDNguy:
[qb]
Canada were asked what the leaders of Canada should be receiving the greatest amount of attention it was Unemployment/Jobs: 27% Health Care/Medicare: 40% Defense/Military: 1%[/qb]

Those results are skewed. The question was asking which was a higher priority and did not specifically ask if the military was wanted or needed. There have been several articles written taht prove this. Polls can be made to show just about anything and this is a prime example.

 

[Franko]

Anyone can make up statistics right off the top of their head...24.7% of Canadians know this.

Warm fuzzy things... crap that the CF does not need in order to do it‘s freakin‘ job. I‘m sick and tired of seeing all these bloody write ups and books that probably took a few tens of thousand dollars to print and paid some yahoo a few grand to write just so it can be all about the civies who work in NDHQ(you all know the one‘s I‘m talking about, Safety Digest, Lessons Learned etc). Does the guy in the trench, Leo, LavIII, M109, ship, or chopper need to read that crap? **** no! What about the incentives for pilots, doctors? Come on. They signed up and took the same oath as us, where is our signing bonus? It‘s all a load of poo. Here is another idea: If you want to trim the fat from the CF, start at the top. There is NO reason to have a civvie pulling down $120,000 a year working at NDHQ(and they exist). There is absolutly no reason to have 65 generals in the forces. Get rid of them and put in a Maj Gen as CDS, a Brigs to rep each of the services. Full Col for brigade comd/ Base Comd. There, just saved a few million in wages that could be put to better use, purchasing kit & training(both reg & res).

Gettin‘ mad now....

Another thing while I‘m on a roll...what is up with focus groups and studies paid for by the CF(for a handsome sum at that) which are primarilary staffed by civvies who aren‘t a serving member? Most times they come out of it with the same ideas that the Regimental comanders come up with. Wasted money....bah!

What about all the guys and gals getting resigned for another 5 years after their 20 are done even though they are MIR commandos? They can‘t even be deployed! Believe me...they exist, most of us in the CF know at least ONE. Be honest with yourself and think about the troops in your unit. There‘s one in there someone.

There is plenty of "niceities" or "fuzzies" that aren‘t req in the CF to do operations. After the Gulf War a receptionist went to a retreat for a couple of weeks to get rid of her stress. Cost to the taxpayer: approx $85,000! Personnaly, if she couldn‘t hack it, fire her and get a guy who‘s P Cat to do her job.

The unfortunate thing about this whole debacle of the CF being strapped for cash is: we saw it comming a long time ago and took the onslaught. We did what we do best. Train as hard as we can with what little we have and pull a few miracles out of our ***es. The whole of NATO member armies know we are the worst equiped, one of the best trained armies in the world. Now that we are starting to get back to what we were meant to do, actually deploy into combat and practicing our ‘art‘, the CF is starting to feel the pinch and pulling back on the reigns.

We used to have a buget of over 19 billion when I first got in(88). All we had on the go was Germany(the big drain of funds but needed the cold war was still on), Cyprus, Golan, Sini. Now it‘s down to 13ish and we‘re in Afganistan(2000 troops), Bosnia(1300 troops), Golan(200), Ivory Coast(unknown), with a government thats starting to warm up to the idea of us going into Iraq.

The CF is now sitting at a table with a big sh!t sandwich in front of it...

Wanna take a bite?........

Or say enoughs enough!

Regards

:rage:

 

[Franko]

I guess I‘ve had the last say?

Come on folks...lets hear what you have to say!!

Regards

 

[Raincoast]

Originally posted by CDNguy:
[qb] Im currently working on a paper to do with the over stretching of our military.

basicly im seeing that the funds arent there because a) the government isnt all there, morons at times

b) the canadian citizens dont want it.
in 1998 (i know kinda old) they did a survey

Canada were asked what the leaders of Canada should be receiving the greatest amount of attention it was Unemployment/Jobs: 27% Health Care/Medicare: 40% Defense/Military: 1%

would that not partially explain why the military doenst get more funding. canadian citizens are too focused on their own well being , we already have the best healthcare in the world,

i just read the thread about military role, and during my essay i was supporting a military with primary role of peacekeeping.

Now ive always thought we needed a bigger military, we have a huge country and should defend it, but thats not going to happen anytime soon because no one thinks canada is threatened, ya ok.

so im argueing that our reputation as peacekeepers is at risk because we simply cant effectively act on all the commitments the government is making? is this not true. i read that 1/3 of the armies deployable force is currently overseas.

i personally think if we could get canadian citizens to realize that to raise the military budget isnt to simply build bigger guns, although it would allow us to bring our fighting force up to date, but its to be able to help out more overseas, humanitarion mission, keep the peace for the world.

am i going anywhere right with this? [/qb]

No offence to your argument, but if you employ the same level of grammar and spelling on your paper as you do here you probably have bigger things about which to worry.

As for your points, I think that funds-for-more-peacekeeping is an idea most centre- and left-leaning Canadians could warm up to.

 

[Raincoast]

A line of trenches from BC to quebec won‘t stop terrorists from getting in or WMD from landing on ottawa. [/QB]

But not joining the US in trying to keep the rest of the world at gun-point and manipulating the entire Middle East will at least make sure that any WMDs - mythical or otherwise - are aimed elsewhere.

 

[jeff001]

Franko
I agree 100%. In the CF we have close to a dozen Lt Generals, one Lt General is supposed to be in command of 65,000 troops by international standards.This doesn‘t include the civilians who have the same signing authority in NDHQ or "Disney on the Rideau".
DND, is one of the largest employers in Ottawa-Hull region,it also rents some huge amount of buildings in the downtown area. Its is growing without limits,and as it grows it eats away at the budget, for the troops,sailors&airmen to do thier job.It would be an approx. guess to say that the amount spent on buildings or office space in Ottawa,would probably cover(some or most) of the cost of say, maybe some new choppers to replace the Seakings. Maybe some ammunition to hold a Brigade level exercise, or some aircraft to transport equipment, just in case there‘s a war, outside the training areas near our bases.

 

[Franko]

Tech...good points.

As for the last one...BBWWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Regards

 

[Spr.Earl]

It‘s nice to you youngn‘s are awake!

 

[Lexi]

Originally posted by Recce41:
[qb] Everyone thinks, ?its we don‘t need one?. The problem is the country does not understand us. Back as soon as the 60s. Militia units, would parade through the cities, have open house, and **** well showed what we did. The soldiers in the militia are the real, sells men. I go **** to units and see, the mess full, yng soldiers drunk. What does that so the people? All that shows is we are drunks and foul mouthed a55holes.
When I was in Winnipeg, a lot of people said this, "I don‘t know what you did?. They think we go out in the woods and shoot up the world.

Canada is a Militia country, since 1867, our Army has been a professional Militia one. Back when militia soldiers trained the same as the Regs. Now, were lucky to get a NCO out for a course.
Until we change the view of the military, the military will be sore in the goverment‘s pocket book. [/qb]

I think he‘s absolutely right. I remember that when I was younger, I used to think that soldiers, or peace keepers in our case, were merciless killers that smoked, drank and swore alot. It wasn‘t until I actually met some soldiers that I found their basically just like you and me, and the majority are nice, kind, considerate guys. And girls.

As for your paper.. whoever it was that started this board... I think you are going somewhere with it. Strech the idea a little further and you may have yourself a 90.

All my love,

 

[teltech]

Originally posted by TECH.:
[qb] Franko
I agree 100%. In the CF we have close to a dozen Lt Generals, one Lt General is supposed to be in command of 65,000 troops by international standards.This doesn‘t include the civilians who have the same signing authority in NDHQ or "Disney on the Rideau".[/qb]

As someone once told me after the airborne disbandment parade:
"They should turn NDHQ into a unit and disband it"

 

[Franko]

Teltech....we can only dream...

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!! Disney on the Rideau GONE....

It‘ll never happen. As long as there is one soldier in Canada there will always be someone buggering it up.

Regards

 

[tmbluesbflat]

The biggest problem is the experience of many Canadians that are recent immigrants, they recall the military from where came, in most cases a horrifying memory. Other Canadians that served over the last fifty years know how they were treated by the Government when they were wounded, disabled etc. they don‘t recommend it as an honourable proffesion to their children because of that lousy experience. We had first nations soldiers unable to get pensions etc. and pow‘s from Hong Kong that are still embroiled in a fight for what is owed them, until we get honourable politicians and senior civil servants in power. The military will be but a notch up above street beggers, maybe!

 

[Franko]

tmbluesflt....Thanks for calling all of us who serve a notch above street beggars.

You got a bit of ‘splainin to do.

regards

 

[tmbluesbflat]

Those who serve are regarded by many as just a notch above street beggers, sorry for the confusion.

 

[Franko]

Yeah...thought so. I think we should ALL write this guy off. He/she is obviously a troll.

Go away tmbluesbflat, find some other forum to troll.

WHO IS WITH ME?

Regards

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

If you have such a low opinion of the CF why are you even here? I agree Franko this dope smoker has the bearing of a troll (and not a very good one).

 

[tmbluesbflat]

Please try to understand the Language. I did not say that CDN service personell were a notch above street beggers. What I said is that is how they are regarded by many! When in fact they deserve better and have earned far better!

 

[CSS Type]

It appears that some are being overly sensitive. In my view tmblusesbflat was making an observation and trying to get a dialogue going. If you read what is being written, it doesn‘t appear to be trolling.

 

[Franko]

OK...lets try this again....

tmbluesbflat...would you care to expand on your comments?

I understand the problems with Aboriginals getting their pensions after WW2. It‘s an absolute travesty. As is the fight for HK POWs getting their come uppance. I couldn‘t agree more!

This is all because of the VAO debacle after the war. It is being worked out, too bad the people who need it the most have, for the most part, passed away.

As for being overly sensitive... I am far from it. I wanted to hear an explaination of his point of view CSS Type. It sounded more inflamitory than a POV. I have heard this bunk too many times from "trolls" and I‘m getting to the short end of the gun tube.

Regards

 

[tmbluesbflat]

The respect thing or lack of, comes from events such as the Somolia affair, not from the event but from the handling and susequent investigation. The high command‘s criminal coverup and their with holding the truth from both the minister and prime minister of the day smacks of treason etc, that single affair lost more respect for the military than anything in previous Canadian history. I am not talking about Cadets or serving members in the ranks etc I am speaking of the cowards etc involved in that affair, coverups are the worst kind of public relations, the disbanding of a professional unit such as the AIRBORNE is a cowardly admission of incompetance, by both the politicians and the Military officers (they should have been cashiered). The public see‘s precious little of the day to day military, only officers and politicians are paraded for the old PHOTO_OPS. So what happens you guys do great work the idiots in Ottawa do their regular performance and all your hard work goes for naught. I hope that I am not missunderstood here, I was a serving member 40 years ago and it was exactly the same then, nothing has changed!