Police Folk Allegedly Behaving Badly

[Booter]

Guessing when things get out of hand in a community with a lot of drugs or ODs the RCMP get slammed for not stopping it.

The problem is when there is a legitimate way to get it done and they don’t use those tools.

I guess it’s….
Maintain the right. Not necessarily what’s legal.

Which is terrible advice and practice but it can be what the world looks like in grey places maybe?

 

[daftandbarmy]

Yeah they have always no case seizured drugs and alcohol out of the mail. It’s goes in cycles.

The community councils are very vocal that they get to decide what comes into their communities and often the police are more than happy to oblige. Seizing liquor and drugs at the airports and the post office. These also aren’t communities with a post office- they are contracted into the northern stores and the employees call in drugs. And then the community leadership want to know what we are doing when they watch drugs pass through the post office. There are also warrants obtained but those warrants also are tossed in court because the courts do not understand the reality of 350 people in the Arctic.

Even where there are community bylaws there isn’t an authority but it’s always been a convo.

The chief Superintendent is TRYING to get them to get rid of a historical practice that is older than the charter in the territory. And you guys think it’s wrong that he is admitting it.

I wonder what your response would be if he denied the problem existed.

I’ve personally seen this conversation come around three times before. Often brought up by police and not Canada post.

The law assumes a structure that doesn’t exist and the police are left to manage community expectations without the support of the courts. Making a call of losing their trust with the community or taking Roger’s cocaine.

And we haven't even broached the subject of alcohol yet

 

[Haggis]

And we haven't even broached the subject of alcohol yet

I did a few deployments north of 60 where all our kit was searched prior to departure for commercial and non-commercial alcohol.

 

[lenaitch]

Legal authority is highly overrated. Let's just search whatever mail we want - Nunavut RCMP.

"It’s illegal for Canadian police to search mail in transit, but it had been commonplace in the territory, according to Nunavut RCMP Chief Supt. Kent Pike."

Read more at: Forced to stop searching mail, RCMP lean on other methods of detecting illegal drugs, alcohol shipped to Nunavut - Nunavut News

Forced to stop searching mail, RCMP lean on other methods of detecting illegal drugs, alcohol shipped to Nunavut - Nunavut News

Proposed federal legislation could allow police searches to resume

nunavutnews.com

Reminds me of the pre-Charter days when certain RCMP members had Writs of Assistance, typically for drugs (NCA and FDA back then).

My remote FN service pre-dates the illicit drug problem but most band councils were pretty determined to keep their reserves dry. Because it was band bylaw-based, we didn't get involved so it was left to band constables (where they existed) and/or council members. They weren't shy about rooting through just about anything coming off a plane. I don't recall any issue with mail-borne crime. When the ice roads opened, some set barriers at the FNT boundary.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Not very topical, but I spent a few weeks in Tuk in the 70's. They had a no alcohol policy. They also had a 10x10 log room, dirt floor and a bucket. No heat. They called it the Tuk Tuk Alcohol Centre. It did a pretty brisk business while we were there.

 

[Booter]

Reminds me of the pre-Charter days when certain RCMP members had Writs of Assistance, typically for drugs (NCA and FDA back then).

My remote FN service pre-dates the illicit drug problem but most band councils were pretty determined to keep their reserves dry. Because it was band bylaw-based, we didn't get involved so it was left to band constables (where they existed) and/or council members. They weren't shy about rooting through just about anything coming off a plane. I don't recall any issue with mail-borne crime. When the ice roads opened, some set barriers at the FNT boundary.

Band Constables is another issue altogether!

 

[lenaitch]

Band Constables is another issue altogether!

My experience back in the day was certainly a mixed bag. Some handled the fact that they were essentially a band employee (but paid by the province as special constables) better than others. Back then there was no movement; BCs were from the FN so ended up policing their own neighbours and families. An unenviable situation.

Ontario has dodged that now. FNTs are policed by either a stand-alone FNPS (if they are large enough) or one of three deployed FNPSs. There are a couple of FNs, one at least that comes to mind, that opted out of all of it and are still policed directly by the OPP.

 

[Haggis]

Ontario has dodged that now. FNTs are policed by either a stand-alone FNPS (if they are large enough) or one of three deployed FNPSs. There are a couple of FNs, one at least that comes to mind, that opted out of all of it and are still policed directly by the OPOPP.Que

Québec has a similar model with the unique exception of the Akwesasne Mohawk Police Service which serves the QC and ON portions of the community. Their HQ is on the QC side. The US side has their own St. Regis Mohawk Tribal Police.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I can't imagine what police up north have to deal with on a daily basis.

Northern communities would imode without a steady influx of RCMP and other outside resources like doctors, food and fuel.

Me and two other hiking buddies turned up in Pangnirtung (Baffin Island) one summer and, just for the heck of it, stopped in to see the three man RCMP detachment.

It reminded me of a police station in Belfast. They had their armour on and 'patrol rifles' ready to go. There had been a rape/murder of a teacher, a woman from 'down south' up on a temporary assignment, and the community was literally 'up in arms' about it.

We didn't stick around... they were looking like they expected some incoming at any moment.

 

[RangerRay]

Me and two other hiking buddies turned up in Pangnirtung (Baffin Island) one summer and, just for the heck of it, stopped in to see the three man RCMP detachment.

It reminded me of a police station in Belfast. They had their armour on and 'patrol rifles' ready to go. There had been a rape/murder of a teacher, a woman from 'down south' up on a temporary assignment, and the community was literally 'up in arms' about it.

We didn't stick around... they were looking like they expected some incoming at any moment.

I hear enough stories of RCMP compounds at remote Manitoba reserves being used as target practice by the locals to not discount it as BS.

 

[Booter]

I hear enough stories of RCMP compounds at remote Manitoba reserves being used as target practice by the locals to not discount it as BS.

I flew into “shamganistan” a few times to coordinate unfolding events. Barbwire, bullet proof building glass, compound. It has a restricted time commitment for a reason.

Landing in a blacked out plane at night in a massive crosswind with someone shooting at the plane in another similar place. I love our pilots.

It’s not unusual in some places for sure

 

[brihard]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/durham-police-deputy-chief-suspended-racial-slur-9.7107832

But what if Deputy Chief was just singing Deputy Chief’s favourite song?

 

[OldSolduer]

I hear enough stories of RCMP compounds at remote Manitoba reserves being used as target practice by the locals to not discount it as BS.

I spent three days at a northern rez. The RCMP told us to stay in our building at night and don’t even think about exploring.
We did go to the Northern Store - which everyone gravitated to at 1000 hours.

 

[Booter]

I flew into “shamganistan” a few times to coordinate unfolding events. Barbwire, bullet proof building glass, compound. It has a restricted time commitment for a reason.

Landing in a blacked out plane at night in a massive crosswind with someone shooting at the plane in another similar place. I love our pilots.

It’s not unusual in some places for sure

Lol “barbwire”….barbed wire. Barb Wire works in sales

 

[Eaglelord17]

Kind of funny really. You can tell by their response they see stuff like following the law as beneath them. The chief is like yeah whateves.

Well it is. Plenty of examples of RCMP officers breaking the law without consequences. Look at High River where they were found to have broken the law yet not a single officer or higher up was charged.

Not many jobs where you can threaten someone with a gun and still keep the job and be trusted with firearms.

 

[Booter]

Well it is. Plenty of examples of RCMP officers breaking the law without consequences. Look at High River where they were found to have broken the law yet not a single officer or higher up was charged.

Not many jobs where you can threaten someone with a gun and still keep the job and be trusted with firearms.

Not many jobs that require you to challenge people with a firearm regularly and then have guys who don’t know what they’re talking about dissect it on the internet.

Anyone who talks like you doesn’t have the experience needed to have the opinions you do. But no doubt you think you do.

The interpretation of the law that lead to the “breaking of the law” in an emergency was examined after the fact and found to be incorrect- it then informed every operation that came after it. So much so that it’s a briefing point on these emergencies in Alberta now.

Most of us know what you can’t do in that case. Someone didn’t and in the presence of looting made a poor call, and then that calls intent was interpreted poorly. That issue has been addressed. Which is what is supposed to happen.

I’ve been the front face on multiple natural disasters of national interest and my teams actions were slick. It is not unusual for the RCMP to get it right. Our actions have critical eyes on us all the time, and that’s fine- it’s the name of the game. But our folks nail it consistently.

 

[Eaglelord17]

Not many jobs that require you to challenge people with a firearm regularly and then have guys who don’t know what they’re talking about dissect it on the internet.

Anyone who talks like you doesn’t have the experience needed to have the opinions you do. But no doubt you think you do.

The interpretation of the law that lead to the “breaking of the law” in an emergency was examined after the fact and found to be incorrect- it then informed every operation that came after it. So much so that it’s a briefing point on these emergencies in Alberta now.

Most of us know what you can’t do in that case. Someone didn’t and in the presence of looting made a poor call, and then that calls intent was interpreted poorly. That issue has been addressed. Which is what is supposed to happen.

I’ve been the front face on multiple natural disasters of national interest and my teams actions were slick. It is not unusual for the RCMP to get it right. Our actions have critical eyes on us all the time, and that’s fine- it’s the name of the game. But our folks nail it consistently.

You may feel it was addressed, much of the public does not. Yes it isn’t likely to happen again, however that doesn’t mean those responsible have been held accountable.

It’s about when you don’t nail it that’s a issue. It’s about the lack of accountability for those who fail to nail it. Police don’t like to ‘rat’ on their own. They let a lot slide before they hold someone to task. Even then when held to task the punishment is often much less than a civilian would receive for a similar situation.

Yes police have a hard job, and that is exactly why I am so critical of them. I hold them to a exceptionally high standard because of trust and power placed in their hands. When that trust is broken there should be hell to pay.

 

[daftandbarmy]

You may feel it was addressed, much of the public does not. Yes it isn’t likely to happen again, however that doesn’t mean those responsible have been held accountable.

It’s about when you don’t nail it that’s a issue. It’s about the lack of accountability for those who fail to nail it. Police don’t like to ‘rat’ on their own. They let a lot slide before they hold someone to task. Even then when held to task the punishment is often much less than a civilian would receive for a similar situation.

The (now defunct) Esquimalt Police Department enters the chat... from awhile ago


Victoria police, former Esquimalt officers hit with sexual abuse lawsuit

The Victoria Police Department and four former Esquimalt police officers are being sued for $5.3 million over sexual abuse allegations dating back to the 1980s and 1990s.

Scott Connors, Robert Cowick, Samuel Devana and Kenneth Cockle are named as defendants in the notice of civil claim, filed with the B.C. Supreme Court on Nov. 12. VicPD is named because it merged with the Esquimalt Police Department in 2003.

Victoria police, former Esquimalt officers hit with sexual abuse lawsuit

The Victoria Police Department and four former Esquimalt police officers are being sued for $5.3 million over sexual abuse allegations dating back to the 1980s and 1990s.

vancouverisland.ctvnews.ca

 

[Booter]

The overwhelming majority of conduct resolved in the rcmp contains witness and other member observation and statements. So your “rat” statement is nonsense. You watch too much tv, what the reality is that when you’re in the grey making calls it isn’t as easy as when you have your 500 word article a month after the decision making ends and your saying what everyone should have done.

You re free to have your opinions- I’ve got lots of my own opinions that people have issues with, but I won’t pass by someone taking a swipe at the people I look after.

The process was addressed. The errors were addressed. Your “accountable” is a fancy way of saying you want someone to get probation for something that they made a mistake in- was it a mistake that affected a ton of people and significant implications for everyone? Financially and the relationship to the community? Absolutely.

But it wasn’t criminal. It was a person in a position who is guiding things in unprecedented conditions who wound up out of their lane- and by the time the operation was recovered it was too late,

That’s administrative. It isn’t criminal. And the administrative error was corrected.

I finished a massive thing and was told I was lucky it worked out by my political lines. That’s what it’s like to be working without a safety net. When it works you’re the hero of the hour. When it doesn’t you wind up with a cover sheet named after you.

 

[FJAG]

The Victoria Police Department and four former Esquimalt police officers are being sued for $5.3 million over sexual abuse allegations dating back to the 1980s and 1990s.

Sigh. Don't Statutes of Limitation have any value anymore?