Post Traumatic Stress Disorder

[the 48th regulator]

There sure is Brother.

The first place to start is here

http://www.osiss.ca/

They will guide you in every aspect.  Do not be troubled in the fact that it is government sponsored.  All peer support staff is drawn from former soldiers, that have gone through what you are.

Trust me, they can help, and I am also available to answer any questions.  PM if that makes you feel comfortable

dileas

tess

 

[alfie]

Thanks for the link, I will pm if I can't find what I need

 

[the 48th regulator]

Alfie,

They helped me in my time of need, and they will do the work to help you.

Again, I am here if you have any questions brother.

dileas

tess

 

[tannerthehammer]

I think everyone who goes on tour comes away with some sort of PTSD, but some have it to a lesser or greater degree...We had a guy just come back from A-Stan and I was chatting with him about about his time away while we were on a ruckmarch and I got a sense that it affected him as it seemed like he didn't really want to talk about it...

I remember being at a recent ceremony where he was presented with a plaque from our unit and the CO talked about how his gun was the only one in the battery that had a direct hit on a Taliban vehicle and after he stopped talking everyone clapped...I understand why we are over there and that we have a job to do but it really struck me when I heard people clapping to the fact that people had died, even if they are the enemy...

 

[2018]

Well said, tanner. A-Stan and many places before that present us with crazy situations that training doesn't match. We all come away affected in one way or another. The best hope is that the affect is a positive one, not regrets, ill health or other bad effects. Thankfully, as seen above, there is lots of aid for those that need it.

 

[Red 6]

I wouldn't say everyone that serves in combat gets PTSD, but I believe everyone who serves in combat is affected by it in some way.

 

[Armymedic]

I concur with Red 6's comment.

Not everyone gets diagnosable PTSD, in fact much less common then you would think. Every single one of us though endures significant stress when put into that life or death situation. How we deal with it afterwards makes a huge difference. SOme enjoy the "rush" of combat, others rather not admit they just took another persons life.

And just because PTSD is the military mental affliction d'jour, does not mean you will get it. People deal with death and dying all the time. Not every single instance does someone come away with PTSD.

If we did not hinge a financial reward to the diagnosis and worried more about detection and proper treatment, I believe that it would not have become a popular excuse it has become.

 

[the 48th regulator]

I concur with Red 6's comment.

Not everyone gets diagnosable PTSD, in fact much less common then you would think. Every single one of us though endures significant stress when put into that life or death situation. How we deal with it afterwards makes a huge difference. SOme enjoy the "rush" of combat, others rather not admit they just took another persons life.

And just because PTSD is the military mental affliction d'jour, does not mean you will get it. People deal with death and dying all the time. Not every single instance does someone come away with PTSD.

If we did not hinge a financial reward to the diagnosis and worried more about detection and proper treatment, I believe that it would not have become a popular excuse it has become.

Trauma of any sort is the cause; however it is the follow up treatment of the soldier that exacerbates or helps to heal the Syndrome in people.

PTSD, is not some communicable disease that someone picks up, it is how your mind handles a situation.  Treatment, however, be it a talk or downright therapy is needed to help the soldier, so that he may be integrated into the military back to the level he was before the trauma.

dileas

tess

 

[Armymedic]

Trauma of any sort is the cause; however it is the follow up treatment of the soldier that exacerbates or helps to heal the Syndrome in people.

Not entirely true on both counts.

1. It is the experience of extreme stressful situations which have made your mind push your body to invoke the "flight or fight" response, usually but not exclusively events which may involve the person to believe that their life or some one else very proximal, live is in real or perceived danger. It is the physiological response that imprints the memories/event recall that are so common to PTSD suffers.

2. Preconditioning thru training and the knowledge of peer and family support prior to the event has been noted to reduce the cases of PTSD in cbt veterans.

If your statement was 100% correct, then each and every soldier wounded, or close to the the cbt deaths in Afghanistan would have PTSD. This is definately not the case.

 

[the 48th regulator]

Not entirely true on both counts.

1. It is the experience of extreme stressful situations which have made your mind push your body to invoke the "flight or fight" response, usually but not exclusively events which may involve the person to believe that their life or some one else very proximal, live is in real or perceived danger. It is the physiological response that imprints the memories/event recall that are so common to PTSD suffers.

2. Preconditioning thru training and the knowledge of peer and family support prior to the event has been noted to reduce the cases of PTSD in cbt veterans.

If your statement was 100% correct, then each and every soldier wounded, or close to the the cbt deaths in Afghanistan would have PTSD. This is definately not the case.

Alright,

I will print this up and let my doctor know in our next session.

Boy, has she got it all wrong....

So the follow up from the military, has no effect what so ever in helping the soldier?  The time decompressing, interviews and such?

dileas

tess

 

[Armymedic]

Perhaps she does...

Medicine is not an absolute, and understanding mental illness....

But I ask: Why, by percentage, do persons in support trades (in US and Cdn militaries) report higher incedences of PTSD then do cbt arms soldiers?

 

[the 48th regulator]

Perhaps she does...

Medicine is not an absolute, and understanding mental illness....

But I ask: Why, by percentage, do persons in support trades (in US and Cdn militaries) report higher incedences of PTSD then do cbt arms soldiers?

Don't know, are there detailed facts on these statistics?

dileas

tess

 

[GAP]

Perhaps she does...

Medicine is not an absolute, and understanding mental illness....

But I ask: Why, by percentage, do persons in support trades (in US and Cdn militaries) report higher incedences of PTSD then do cbt arms soldiers?

I would suggest one factor.

What is the most common thing for a cbt arms soldier to do after contact and things have settled down......talk, talk, talk, they describe every step of everything that happened from their POV, and it goes around and around....Black humor, jokes, teasing, it is all part of talk...

 

[Roy Harding]

...

But I ask: Why, by percentage, do persons in support trades (in US and Cdn militaries) report higher incedences of PTSD then do cbt arms soldiers?

Just an uneducated guess on my part (but somewhat informed, as I was both Inf and CSS in my career) - it's the Regimental system.  Cbt Arms soldiers "belong" to something - a large family if you will.  A Regiment is there for them, complete with members who understand (approximately) what they are going through.  CSS soldiers, on the other hand, are pretty much on their own.

I'd be interested in seeing the stats reflecting a breakdown of those current CSS soldiers who still belong to a Regimental structure (I'm thinking RCEME here), and those that don't.  I'd also be interested in the comparisons between today's CSS soldier and those who (at one time) belonged to "Regimental Families" - I'm thinking RCASC, here.


Roy

 

[Red 6]

We need to be clear about the difference between combat stress and post-traumatic stress syndrome. It takes time, sometimes a long time, to sort your way through the memories of what you lived through in combat. It's always struck me (since my retirement anyway) how much support you get preparing for war in the US Army but the "After" is pretty much yours to figure out for better or worse. My hat's off to any man or woman who wears the uniform , esecially those who serve on the sharp end of the spear in war.

This is just my own hip pocket opinion, but I think too many young kids get saddled with the stigma of PTSD from professionals who are wanting to help, but don't themselves understand what war is. I don't subscribe to the idea that only combat veterans can help other combat veterans, but I always have wondered about it. I went to some voluntary counseling several years ago at the VA here in the states and the counselor was nice, but kept trying to push me into a Vietnam sort of box. He just couldn't get that my experiences were totally different so I never went back.

I'll bet there are a lot of guys and gals here who've sat out on their back porches and watched the leaves falling or whatever figuring it all out. War is without a doubt the shittiest deal out there. In my small exposure to it myself and watching my dad cope with World War II until the day he died, I feel qualified to have that opinion. Just because a Soldier feels confused or lousy or blue about his or her experiences doesn't mean there's something clinically wrong that needs to be medicated. I'm not venting or anything and it seems like most folks in this thread have pretty much the same opinion as me.

One of the toughest hurdles and probably a big contributor to PTSD is how different war makes you feel in comparison to everyone else. The Army is a huge cocoon and I've been acquainted with several career Soldiers down here who never had a problem with PTSD while they were still in the Army. But when they retired and left the Army behind they went into tailspins. This definitely doesn't happen to every career Soldier, but the Army provides a structure and let's face it, when you're a leader you're on stage all the time. Like I wrote above, once you leave the Army, you're on your own.

 

[the 48th regulator]

Very good points Red,

It took me over a decade to realize the demons that were eating me up.  I healed fast, damn fast, and felt untouchable.

So over the years I continued to abuse myself, and those around me.  After I started to have little ones, and the the loyal support of my wife, I realised that I had to control myself.  The temper, the self abuse, the lack of care.  It all had to end.  Nights waking up in cold sweats, just drenched, passing it off as "I am not weak, and I will not let anyone know"

The wife saw it all.  Now, I enjoy life. I dig what I do, however, time really gouged a valley in my soul.  I at times still feel that I let the boys down by leaving early.  I wonder what would have happened if I could have returned fire. 

I see all the goings on In the sandbox, and wish I never left, but then I remind myself "Could I actually been a danger to those around me?".

I still feel both my scars, inside and out.


Geez, all that and I didn't have more than one beer!

dileas

tess

 

[Greymatters]

2. Preconditioning thru training and the knowledge of peer and family support prior to the event has been noted to reduce the cases of PTSD in cbt veterans.

I agree strongly with this.  Your prior environment and preconditioning help to reduce the mental shock to the system that in turn usually leads to PTSD. 

 

[the 48th regulator]

I agree strongly with this.  Your prior environment and preconditioning help to reduce the mental shock to the system that in turn usually leads to PTSD. 

Along with proper follow up after deployment, wouldn't you agree?

dileas

tess

 

[Red 6]

Along with proper follow up after deployment, wouldn't you agree? dileas tess

I'm not sure so much about the preparation because I'm not sure how much anything other than war can prepare you for combat. I hope that makes sense. I mean, we can learn battle drills, first aid and buddy aid, convoy procedures, call for fire, etc, etc., but there are some things that there just isn't any way to prepare for. In regards to post-operational issues, without a doubt, unit cohesion is the best cure for combatting PTSD. There just is no substitute for sitting down with your buddies who you lived it with and getting all the excess baggage sorted out. In the US Army, this is very hard for reserve component units and the Army has been struggling to get a fix for this problem. At least from the outside, Canada's regimental system seems to be an intelligent solution to this problem, but that's just my read as an observer.

 

[HItorMiss]

Since Tess was so open and honest I can be to...

Tess wonders what it would have been like to be able to go back, I did go back and while in the process of getting myself able to go back I so focused on my physical and how best to regain my ability to soldier that I never not once dealt with anything that happened to me and those around me. Then when I did get back I had the mission to complete and so again my mind churned through that and again I avoided dealing with the nagging whispers in my head. They chattered when it was quiet and would always sit there wriggling in my brain waiting to get out just under the surface but so long as I had a focus and mission or a goal they were just that... whispers. Then I came home and I had nothing to drive me foreward or the keep my head occupied.So late at night I would see the faces floating in front of my eyes or when/if I slept I would wake up in a near panic. Thankfully I can't remember anything I ever dreamt I still don't but what I do know is I still don't sleep a full night, I still wake up at the slightest sound and I still find myself on the edge of control of alot of things. I am angry deep down inside red hot rage angry. I am angry at myself and no I wont get into why but suffice it to say that it's not going to go away anytime soon.

Here is the uplifting part I know I am not "OK" I have known that for a bit now and I am working to fix that. Do I have PTSD as is the fashionable term is....I don't think so I think I have a good deep case of CSR and survivors guilt just compounds the problem. The CF is there to help and the CoC has been diligent at spotting people who don't come foreward themselves. They are easy to spot to or at least the serious case's are. I know a few that are lurking on the fringe and seeing guys getting help is slowly making them get help to, call it a positive to peer pressure. The Regimental system is for this aspect of military life a damn good thing to have, I for one am glad it exist.