RCMP officers told not to wear symbol depicting ‘thin blue line’

[Bruce Monkhouse]

A Banker and a Cop comparison??  Get serious....

As for compensation, I agree with you that the rank and file RCMP aren't paid enough; however, I also think certain Municipal Forces are paid way too much for what they actually do.  A constable compensated $295,000 in a year is ridiculous, that's more than some Doctors are compensated.  Well played by the Union for getting it to this point and the individual officer may pull a lot of over time but that's a massive missuse of taxpayer money and we are being robbed blind. 

Actually if him/her decided to do that much overtime it probably saved money for the Govt.  There are 3 of us here with over 1000 hours overtime each....and the big ticket expenses of benefits and pension didn't cost my employer one extra cent.  Extra employee's would have....

 

[SeaKingTacco]

A Banker and a Cop comparison??  Get serious....


Actually if him/her decided to do that much overtime it probably saved money for the Govt.  There are 3 of us here with over 1000 hours overtime each....and the big ticket expenses of benefits and pension didn't cost my employer one extra cent.  Extra employee's would have....

Sidebar question: I have always wondered about that. Is your pension based upon your base pay or how much overtime you accrue?

 

[mariomike]

Is your pension based upon your base pay or how much overtime you accrue?

Ontario municipal police, firefighters and paramedics are in the Ontario Municipal Employees Retirement System ( OMERS ).

I have been an OMERS member since 1972.

Pension is based up base pay. Overtime is not included.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Ontario municipal police, firefighters and paramedics are in the Ontario Municipal Employees Retirement System ( OMERS ).

I have been an OMERS member since 1972.

Pension is based up base pay. Overtime is not included.

Thanks! Like I said- always wondered about that.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

A Banker and a Cop comparison??  Get serious....


Actually if him/her decided to do that much overtime it probably saved money for the Govt.  There are 3 of us here with over 1000 hours overtime each....and the big ticket expenses of benefits and pension didn't cost my employer one extra cent.  Extra employee's would have....

I would absolutely love to see you sit in her chair and stickhandle some of the issues.  I would bring popcorn  :rofl:

From what I can tell, there are many professions that could use more than a bit of humility.  Police and Military are both near the very top of that list.

 

[mariomike]

Ontario Corrections  and OPP, may include OT? I don't know.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

They don't...I mean I pay more into it when I do overtime, but get no financial benefit from it. [base salary, 5 best years]  The Govt also doesn't pay any more for their share.

 

[mariomike]

Regarding bank managers. In Toronto, they used to be armed. And they were required to practice at indoor gun ranges.

That came to an end when a bullet fired by a manager during a bank robbery in Toronto ricocheted off a wall and killed a teller.

 

[brihard]

The only police service I’m aware of with pensionable overtime was Winnipeg, and they recently lost that. Quite reasonably, it was deemed to be fiscally unsustainable. I don’t have a problem with that.

Humphrey Bogart: Absoluty a lot of people in CAF do carry a lot of individual responsibility for safety of systems and such, and I think the navy could stake a fair claim to this being the most the case. You’ll note that I wasn’t speaking in anything close to absolutes. But I’ll absolutely stand by what I said. If someone wants to compare police pay to the average CAF captain/Lt(N), I’m comfortable with that comparison. There will be those on both sides who face even more and plenty who face less, but in the aggregate the weight of responsibility on police officers can be immense. It’s not a lack of humility to say that, it’s objective reality, and I’m fully prepared to show receipts.

 

[blacktriangle]

In certain trades & organizations, Cpls and MCpls make calls that can have immediate repercussions at both the tactical and strategic levels. Same with Capt/Lt(N). Some of these positions are compensated accordingly, and others probably should have their compensation reviewed.

With that said, I don't think it's fair to compare the average Cpl in garrison or a Capt in an Admin/Trg role to the duties of an LEO out on patrol.

I think it's clear that LEOs have a tough job with unique challenges and stressors. We put a lot of responsibility and power in their hands. They should be rigorously screened, well trained, and well paid. At the end of the day though, they are all volunteers, and are also members of society and their respective communities. As long as they remember that fact, and practice proper application of the powers we invest in them, they have my support 100%. They have a job to do, and it's keeping the rest of us safe, so we can do our jobs and collectively prosper as a civilization. I'm happy to support them and recognize that they are in fact a thin blue line, and just hope they can remember they are but one colour on a much broader societal spectrum.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I would absolutely love to see you sit in her chair and stickhandle some of the issues.  I would bring popcorn  :rofl:

From what I can tell, there are many professions that could use more than a bit of humility.  Police and Military are both near the very top of that list.

I stopped into one of the local Lifelabs the other day so they could Dracula me.

Sitting there, overhearing some of the guff handed out to the staff by a few of the sh*trats in there and wondering when/if I should step in, I was pretty certain there is no way I could do that job (without winding up with an assault conviction) .

 

[blacktriangle]

I stopped into one of the local Lifelabs the other day so they could Dracula me.

Sitting there, overhearing some of the guff handed out to the staff by a few of the sh*trats in there and wondering when/if I should step in, I was pretty certain there is no way I could do that job (without winding up with an assault conviction) .

When I was deciding on a second career, I looked at going back to school to become a PA. Then I thought about the people I'd actually have to deal with, and promptly ruled out anything in healthcare...sounds like I made a good call. It seems like anything that involves the public is more stress than it's worth. Perhaps this is less a reflection on the occupations that deal with the public, and more a reflection on the public itself.

 

[daftandbarmy]

When I was deciding on a second career, I looked at going back to school to become a PA. Then I thought about the people I'd actually have to deal with, and promptly ruled out anything in healthcare...sounds like I made a good call. It seems like anything that involves the public is more stress than it's worth. Perhaps this is less a reflection on the occupations that deal with the public, and more a reflection on the public itself.

They did a great job talking these idiots down. I was thinking of suggesting that they hire security guards for staff protection.

Anyone know Charlie Brown? (seriously, that's the name of their CEO ) https://www.lifelabs.com/leadership/charles-brown/#:~:text=Charles%20Brown%20is%20President%20and,diagnostics%20and%20health%20technology%20provider.

 

[Navy_Pete]

When I was deciding on a second career, I looked at going back to school to become a PA. Then I thought about the people I'd actually have to deal with, and promptly ruled out anything in healthcare...sounds like I made a good call. It seems like anything that involves the public is more stress than it's worth. Perhaps this is less a reflection on the occupations that deal with the public, and more a reflection on the public itself.

I think everyone should work a retail job early on in life; the display of awful human behaviour they regularly deal with is pretty incredible.People can be especially terrible if they feel a sense of superiority over whoever they are dealing with.

 

[brihard]

I think everyone should work a retail job early on in life; the display of awful human behaviour they regularly deal with is pretty incredible.People can be especially terrible if they feel a sense of superiority over whoever they are dealing with.

Oh man, no kidding. Not all bad though, I helped Rick Hillier find an air compressor once when I was a hardware kid at Canadian Tire.

 

[mariomike]

I think everyone should work a retail job early on in life; the display of awful human behaviour they regularly deal with is pretty incredible.People can be especially terrible if they feel a sense of superiority over whoever they are dealing with.

Or being sent into people's homes. It sounds corny, but I believe good customer service starts with a smile and a shoe shine.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Or being sent into people's homes. It sounds corny, but I believe good customer service starts with a smile and a shoe shine.

Speaking of which, incidents like this are insanely complex and tragic, but seem to be more prevalent these Crazy COVID days. I don't envy the cops that have to take on these assignments, at all:

Family of woman killed by police with plastic bullets tried for years to get help

https://www.timescolonist.com/news/local/family-of-woman-killed-by-police-with-plastic-bullets-tried-for-years-to-get-help-1.24222553

 

[Eaglelord17]

Captain  PI 10  $8718 a month.  And lots of rungs on that ladder yet...

Ok vs military police officer getting paid about 5616$ a month? Apples and apples.

I am not against the police being paid fairly. To me the RCMP wages seem very reasonable for what the job is. I think everywhere else should be falling in line along the same wages. That would mean better gear for more people (as there is more money to be dispersed for equipment), more police officers (making the job safer), and potentially saving the tax payers money if they don't need to hire more. I am not arguing OT, as OT is something your choosing to earn, though if there is too much OT it means they need to hire more officers not pay the few they have more.

 

[mariomike]

To me the RCMP wages seem very reasonable for what the job is. I think everywhere else should be falling in line along the same wages.

While unionization is new for the RCMP, police collective bargaining has been in place in Canada for years. So it should be no surprise that salaries have gone up.

Maybe instead of some people saying, "I don't have it, so they shouldn't either." They could ask, "They have it – why don't I?"

It's not a race to the bottom.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

The only police service I’m aware of with pensionable overtime was Winnipeg, and they recently lost that. Quite reasonably, it was deemed to be fiscally unsustainable. I don’t have a problem with that.

Humphrey Bogart: Absoluty a lot of people in CAF do carry a lot of individual responsibility for safety of systems and such, and I think the navy could stake a fair claim to this being the most the case. You’ll note that I wasn’t speaking in anything close to absolutes. But I’ll absolutely stand by what I said. If someone wants to compare police pay to the average CAF captain/Lt(N), I’m comfortable with that comparison. There will be those on both sides who face even more and plenty who face less, but in the aggregate the weight of responsibility on police officers can be immense. It’s not a lack of humility to say that, it’s objective reality, and I’m fully prepared to show receipts.

I think that's reasonable Brihard, I also think the fact that all Police Officers are badged and hold Peace Officer Status makes them share far more in common with Commissioned Officers than Non-Commissioned Members of the CAF in that they have Authority far and above what a Non-Commissioned Member below the rank of Warrant Officer would have. 

I also think the fact that Police Officers hold Peace Officer Status means they should be held to a far higher level of accountability than someone who doesn't hold that status.  Ditto for Commissioned Officers in the CAF, though we have seen in both cases that this isn't always the case but it should be. 

As for salaries, I absolutely believe the RCMP needs to be paid more but I'm less convinced that any Police Officer holding an entry level rank should be making close to $300k annually, overtime or not.

Others have pointed out that this is a result of nickle and diming on hiring more Officers to get out of pension contributions and benefits but I don't think that explains it completely.  The Unions have played a part in this for sure but my gut feeling is this is going to lead to growth of Privatized Security Firms in the long term. 

Many Private Firms are already providing these services and I can see in the future, Police Forces pricing themselves out of the game.